5 ms·

Apologies for the hot take, but imo GitHub has been really knocking it out of the park with terrible ideas lately (remember how everyone fell all over themselve

by dvt 5y ago

Apologies for the hot take, but imo GitHub has been really knocking it out of the park with terrible ideas lately (remember how everyone fell all over themselves during the Copilot release?). This is an absolutely worthless visualization that only impresses those that haven't heavily worked with visualizations. A few points right off the bat: - Labels are way too small, so you'll need to zoom in.. - ...but if you zoom in, you'll need to pan... - ...and if you need to pan, you lose context - Hovering over "connected files" is just a jumbled mess Case in point: look at the `paperjs/paper.js` example they themselves provide. There's a big circle called "packages" and inside that circle, two smaller circles that all contain the exact same files: "package.json," "index.js," and "README.md" -- how is this insightful in any way? I need to go to the repo to actually see that one of the folders is called "paper-jsdom" and the other one "paper-jsdom-canvas." The visualization literally confuses me more than just looking at the repo. I don't mean to be overly negative, but it's just not a good visualization and no one will ever seriously use this.

spartanatreyu 5y ago
I don't think it's useful in it's current form (except perhaps for newcomers to a project to have an idea of the file structure at a glance). But I also don't think they're trying to present this as a new killer feature they've been working on for years. I'm pretty sure this is just an experiment/exploration done by a few people over a few months to see what they found, then they presented their results.
- wattenberger 5y ago
  Spot on! It's a space I've been wanting to explore, and so have been tinkering with it this last week while we're in between larger projects. I definitely don't see it being a product in it's current gotten, but wanted to share the exploration! Although I will say that the more I've been visualizing different repos, the more convinced I am that it's more useful than is easy to convey.
  - eenell 5y ago
    Have you looked at CodeScene at all?
    - wattenberger 5y ago
      I hadn't seen it until today - looks like a useful product!
zumu 5y ago
While I wholeheartedly agree, I'd argue there is value in having R&D teams tinkering around with different ideas. They may churn out duds, but theoretically they will produce something valuable eventually.
TechBro8615 5y ago
The guy literally says he timeboxed his exploration on this experiment. I think it's pretty cool and would love to have the option to navigate repositories like this.
- tasogare 5y ago
  Author is a woman.
  - globular-toast 5y ago
    Sex is irrelevant.
    - cto_of_antifa 5y ago
      It’s generally considered polite to refer To people the way they want to be referred to. It’s relevant.
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
      - TechBro8615 5y ago
        It's absolutely relevant and was my mistake. I would have corrected it if I had seen it in time – apologies to the author.
- haliskerbas 5y ago
  ...for the HNers who love to talk about how sexism or implicit bias doesn't exist in tech...
  - skinnymuch 5y ago
    Any people doing any automatic assuming likely also assumed the person is white, not homeless, well dressed, no mental health issues, and so on. It’s how things work. There’s so few people who actually feel the way you’re describing things. Being sexist and having implicit biases is not the same thing. The OP did apologize for getting the gender wrong so happy ending there.
LeftHandPath 5y ago
It's probably useless - but it would make for a killer powerpoint slide at your next meeting, wouldn't it?
boulos 5y ago
This is a Show HN post. While you have valid criticisms (small labels, using filenames as labels produces lots of package.json, etc.), the way you shared it certainly violates the site guidelines (“Be kind”). You knew you were being harsh and let your emotional response get to you. But, you should remind yourself that a person was on the other side of this post, and she cared enough to share it. Even if you feel the visualization is unacceptably bad, you should seek to find a way to provide constructive criticism. You’ve got the beginnings of actionable feedback, it’s just covered in invective language (though directed at the work not the person, so that’s something!).
- globular-toast 5y ago
  Way back when I was in school and much less confident than I a now, it was actually comments like yours that hurt the most. What you're essentially saying is "I know what was said is true and I don't dispute that, but you shouldn't have said it". For me this was like a second blow. Criticism always hurts, but at least the first guy thought I was tough enough to take it. You, on the other hand, not only agree with the first guy, you think I'm so feeble that I need a "nice" person like you to shield me. When people stick their neck out they will sometimes get hurt. This is totally normal and a natural way of learning and developing. Safe spaces don't make successful people. The comment you are replying to didn't even seem emotional to me and certainly didn't attack the person. It was just honest feedback.
  - willio58 5y ago
    Being right doesn’t excuse you from being kind. You can critique something in a constructive way. This isn’t about safe spaces, it’s about keeping communication civil.
  - skinnymuch 5y ago
    You are reading way too into the post you responded to. At no point did they agree that the OP is speaking the truth. They said to rephrase it to not just be negativity. But constructive too. You then bring up safe spaces which is irrelevant. It appears you had an agenda from the get go and are attempting to create a narrative here.
onion2k 5y ago
As a tool for exploring a repo it does have some flaws in navigating, but as a tool for comparing the complexity of two repos it looks very useful. It's immediately obvious where the depth, complexity and 'weight' of something lies. That's useful. Plus, even if the result isn't perfect, the fact people are exploring alternatives to a tree structure is great, because trees suck for anything that's broad and deep, especially in a language you're new to that doesn't have familiar patterns.
NikhilVerma 5y ago
https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html > Be kind. Don't be snarky. Have curious conversation; don't cross-examine. Please don't fulminate. Please don't sneer, including at the rest of the community. > When disagreeing, please reply to the argument instead of calling names. "That is idiotic; 1 + 1 is 2, not 3" can be shortened to "1 + 1 is 2, not 3." > Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith.
pizza 5y ago
I admire the people who work on pet projects like this one and share them with the world despite getting criticism that is just barely constructive. These are merely design issues- not things that stem from it being a terrible idea. It's a good idea that just needs a v2 design, there is no need to go on a diatribe about unrelated events, this was clearly just someone taking an idea they thought could be valuable and sharing it with others in the hopes they might gain value from it also. I have needed quick visual fingerprints of repos for a very long time, even just a crude outlay of the filesizes was what I needed but this provides even more. I just don't like the tone of this criticism, and nobody would ever do Show HN's ever again if "it's just not a good visualization and no one will ever seriously use this" was the standard for commentary.

by dvt 5y ago

spartanatreyu 5y ago

I don't think it's useful in it's current form (except perhaps for newcomers to a project to have an idea of the file structure at a glance). But I also don't think they're trying to present this as a new killer feature they've been working on for years. I'm pretty sure this is just an experiment/exploration done by a few people over a few months to see what they found, then they presented their results.

wattenberger 5y ago
Spot on! It's a space I've been wanting to explore, and so have been tinkering with it this last week while we're in between larger projects. I definitely don't see it being a product in it's current gotten, but wanted to share the exploration! Although I will say that the more I've been visualizing different repos, the more convinced I am that it's more useful than is easy to convey.
- eenell 5y ago
  Have you looked at CodeScene at all?
  - wattenberger 5y ago
    I hadn't seen it until today - looks like a useful product!

zumu 5y ago

While I wholeheartedly agree, I'd argue there is value in having R&D teams tinkering around with different ideas. They may churn out duds, but theoretically they will produce something valuable eventually.

TechBro8615 5y ago

The guy literally says he timeboxed his exploration on this experiment. I think it's pretty cool and would love to have the option to navigate repositories like this.

tasogare 5y ago
Author is a woman.
- globular-toast 5y ago
  Sex is irrelevant.
  - cto_of_antifa 5y ago
    It’s generally considered polite to refer To people the way they want to be referred to. It’s relevant.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - TechBro8615 5y ago
      It's absolutely relevant and was my mistake. I would have corrected it if I had seen it in time – apologies to the author.
haliskerbas 5y ago
...for the HNers who love to talk about how sexism or implicit bias doesn't exist in tech...
- skinnymuch 5y ago
  Any people doing any automatic assuming likely also assumed the person is white, not homeless, well dressed, no mental health issues, and so on. It’s how things work. There’s so few people who actually feel the way you’re describing things. Being sexist and having implicit biases is not the same thing. The OP did apologize for getting the gender wrong so happy ending there.

LeftHandPath 5y ago

It's probably useless - but it would make for a killer powerpoint slide at your next meeting, wouldn't it?

boulos 5y ago

This is a Show HN post. While you have valid criticisms (small labels, using filenames as labels produces lots of package.json, etc.), the way you shared it certainly violates the site guidelines (“Be kind”). You knew you were being harsh and let your emotional response get to you. But, you should remind yourself that a person was on the other side of this post, and she cared enough to share it. Even if you feel the visualization is unacceptably bad, you should seek to find a way to provide constructive criticism. You’ve got the beginnings of actionable feedback, it’s just covered in invective language (though directed at the work not the person, so that’s something!).

globular-toast 5y ago
Way back when I was in school and much less confident than I a now, it was actually comments like yours that hurt the most. What you're essentially saying is "I know what was said is true and I don't dispute that, but you shouldn't have said it". For me this was like a second blow. Criticism always hurts, but at least the first guy thought I was tough enough to take it. You, on the other hand, not only agree with the first guy, you think I'm so feeble that I need a "nice" person like you to shield me. When people stick their neck out they will sometimes get hurt. This is totally normal and a natural way of learning and developing. Safe spaces don't make successful people. The comment you are replying to didn't even seem emotional to me and certainly didn't attack the person. It was just honest feedback.
- willio58 5y ago
  Being right doesn’t excuse you from being kind. You can critique something in a constructive way. This isn’t about safe spaces, it’s about keeping communication civil.
- skinnymuch 5y ago
  You are reading way too into the post you responded to. At no point did they agree that the OP is speaking the truth. They said to rephrase it to not just be negativity. But constructive too. You then bring up safe spaces which is irrelevant. It appears you had an agenda from the get go and are attempting to create a narrative here.

onion2k 5y ago

As a tool for exploring a repo it does have some flaws in navigating, but as a tool for comparing the complexity of two repos it looks very useful. It's immediately obvious where the depth, complexity and 'weight' of something lies. That's useful. Plus, even if the result isn't perfect, the fact people are exploring alternatives to a tree structure is great, because trees suck for anything that's broad and deep, especially in a language you're new to that doesn't have familiar patterns.

NikhilVerma 5y ago

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html > Be kind. Don't be snarky. Have curious conversation; don't cross-examine. Please don't fulminate. Please don't sneer, including at the rest of the community. > When disagreeing, please reply to the argument instead of calling names. "That is idiotic; 1 + 1 is 2, not 3" can be shortened to "1 + 1 is 2, not 3." > Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith.

pizza 5y ago

I admire the people who work on pet projects like this one and share them with the world despite getting criticism that is just barely constructive. These are merely design issues- not things that stem from it being a terrible idea. It's a good idea that just needs a v2 design, there is no need to go on a diatribe about unrelated events, this was clearly just someone taking an idea they thought could be valuable and sharing it with others in the hopes they might gain value from it also. I have needed quick visual fingerprints of repos for a very long time, even just a crude outlay of the filesizes was what I needed but this provides even more. I just don't like the tone of this criticism, and nobody would ever do Show HN's ever again if "it's just not a good visualization and no one will ever seriously use this" was the standard for commentary.