3 ms·

> To be clear, as a parent, it's not because I'm fearful, it's because a positive COVID test from any child in my kid's school means that it shuts down for two

by timr 5y ago

> To be clear, as a parent, it's not because I'm fearful, it's because a positive COVID test from any child in my kid's school means that it shuts down for two weeks, completely messing up our lives, jobs etc. Completely agreed. This is a stupid, hysterical policy, and we should all be against it. I include it with my previous comment that children should face no restrictions from SARS-CoV2. What we've done to kids in the last year is so unethical that it makes me furious. I don't mean to imply that you specifically, are hysterical, but this stuff is coming from a group of people who are operating based on fear and lack knowledge. And unfortunately, a great many of them are in positions of power.

ajsnigrutin 5y ago
It's not just kids... All the young people have given away a year of their lives to "save grandma"... and now, the government wants them to give up another year, because few grandmas don't want to get vaccinated. Since the vaccines are available to everyone, and enough time has passed, that everyone has had the chance to get vaccinated, then i have no moral issues if a few people die, because they took the risk, and lost the statistics game.
- sterlind 5y ago
  we're seeing an increase in hospitalizations, which is straining capacity and putting doctors under pressure. if capacity is exceeded due to unvaccinated covid patients, what do you do? bar new covid admissions from the hospital and let them die on the street? keep existing triage order, where someone sick with heart failure or accident trauma might not be admitted because the ward's full of sicker, admitted, covid patients? and before you say "kick the covid patients to the curb," morals aside do you really think that's politically feasible?
  - hunter2_ 5y ago
    What if the triage criteria is to prioritize vaccinated people? Then the segment that suffers from lack of hospital capacity is the same as the segment responsible for unnecessarily burdening the hospital. This comes full circle on the "show your papers" issue, but at least in this scenario showing papers is directly aligning cause and effect regarding death.
  - tayo42 5y ago
    I'm kind of curious how that would be received. If you show up to the hospital for covid and you don't have a vaccine and aren't exempt you don't get treated. I really think there's a good chance it would be received OK. I think vaccinated people are sick of the shit from the other half or 40% and I think the unvaccaniated think they're immune to everything. I think they're happy taking their chances or w/e
mcguire 5y ago
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.10.10.20210492v2 https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.10.10.20210492v... https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7004e4.htm https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7004e4.htm https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7386533/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7386533/
saiya-jin 5y ago
There is no easy policy win re kids. Sure, we can be like fuck it all, children are mostly safe from covid, but then its almost guaranteed parents and everybody else in household will get it. I know for 100% we both did get it from our son who brought it from kindergarden. We were super careful for almost a year and it worked well. We got covid while my wife was pregnant. Not a nice situation to say at least. How do you set that restrictions to adults are OK because we want to protect them, but for kids aren't? Those restrictions then kind of become pointless, don't they? Older people also want to see their grandkids desperately, I think that's a simple fact of life. So unless I am reading it wrong, folks are annoyed because suddenly they have to take care of their kids for 2 weeks. I know I had a rough week+something when I was WFH and caring for our son whose kindergarden got closed due to covid (and he brought it home as we found almost a week later). But fuck, I've managed and it brought me closer to my son, juggling tons of conf calls and so can almost everybody else for few weeks. Its just a work, on all calls in past year there have been kids yelling in the background, sometimes mine too. It is actually properly cool to hear how those voices have their lives running in the background. Its true that those who physically have to be present at work (like my wife, doctor) had tougher times if kindergardens locked down and no solution in sight. But the amount of couples where both parents were in same situation is properly miniscule, mostly folks that complain don't fall there. Its folks who had their convenient busy lives suddenly messed up a bit and had to fully focus on their closest ones and found out proper parenting 24/7 is hard. Society doesn't have an easy coping mechanism for this since we don't have robot nannies immune to viruses. That sucks, and will suck. Minor obstacle that builds character and family bonds I'd say.
- timr 5y ago
  > Sure, we can be like fuck it all, children are mostly safe from covid No, children are almost entirely safe from Covid. Don't exaggerate the risk. > but then its almost guaranteed parents and everybody else in household will get it. ...and they can get vaccinated, and they will face the approximate risk profile of a cold or flu. Look, it's like I said: there are people who are going to be at continued risk from this. That's unfortunate, but it's no different than any other virus we've lived with throughout human civilization. At this point, we're proposing extraordinary interventions to head off an ordinary level of risk.

by timr 5y ago

ajsnigrutin 5y ago

It's not just kids... All the young people have given away a year of their lives to "save grandma"... and now, the government wants them to give up another year, because few grandmas don't want to get vaccinated. Since the vaccines are available to everyone, and enough time has passed, that everyone has had the chance to get vaccinated, then i have no moral issues if a few people die, because they took the risk, and lost the statistics game.

sterlind 5y ago
we're seeing an increase in hospitalizations, which is straining capacity and putting doctors under pressure. if capacity is exceeded due to unvaccinated covid patients, what do you do? bar new covid admissions from the hospital and let them die on the street? keep existing triage order, where someone sick with heart failure or accident trauma might not be admitted because the ward's full of sicker, admitted, covid patients? and before you say "kick the covid patients to the curb," morals aside do you really think that's politically feasible?
- hunter2_ 5y ago
  What if the triage criteria is to prioritize vaccinated people? Then the segment that suffers from lack of hospital capacity is the same as the segment responsible for unnecessarily burdening the hospital. This comes full circle on the "show your papers" issue, but at least in this scenario showing papers is directly aligning cause and effect regarding death.
- tayo42 5y ago
  I'm kind of curious how that would be received. If you show up to the hospital for covid and you don't have a vaccine and aren't exempt you don't get treated. I really think there's a good chance it would be received OK. I think vaccinated people are sick of the shit from the other half or 40% and I think the unvaccaniated think they're immune to everything. I think they're happy taking their chances or w/e

mcguire 5y ago

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.10.10.20210492v2 https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.10.10.20210492v... https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7004e4.htm https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7004e4.htm https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7386533/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7386533/

saiya-jin 5y ago

There is no easy policy win re kids. Sure, we can be like fuck it all, children are mostly safe from covid, but then its almost guaranteed parents and everybody else in household will get it. I know for 100% we both did get it from our son who brought it from kindergarden. We were super careful for almost a year and it worked well. We got covid while my wife was pregnant. Not a nice situation to say at least. How do you set that restrictions to adults are OK because we want to protect them, but for kids aren't? Those restrictions then kind of become pointless, don't they? Older people also want to see their grandkids desperately, I think that's a simple fact of life. So unless I am reading it wrong, folks are annoyed because suddenly they have to take care of their kids for 2 weeks. I know I had a rough week+something when I was WFH and caring for our son whose kindergarden got closed due to covid (and he brought it home as we found almost a week later). But fuck, I've managed and it brought me closer to my son, juggling tons of conf calls and so can almost everybody else for few weeks. Its just a work, on all calls in past year there have been kids yelling in the background, sometimes mine too. It is actually properly cool to hear how those voices have their lives running in the background. Its true that those who physically have to be present at work (like my wife, doctor) had tougher times if kindergardens locked down and no solution in sight. But the amount of couples where both parents were in same situation is properly miniscule, mostly folks that complain don't fall there. Its folks who had their convenient busy lives suddenly messed up a bit and had to fully focus on their closest ones and found out proper parenting 24/7 is hard. Society doesn't have an easy coping mechanism for this since we don't have robot nannies immune to viruses. That sucks, and will suck. Minor obstacle that builds character and family bonds I'd say.

timr 5y ago
> Sure, we can be like fuck it all, children are mostly safe from covid No, children are almost entirely safe from Covid. Don't exaggerate the risk. > but then its almost guaranteed parents and everybody else in household will get it. ...and they can get vaccinated, and they will face the approximate risk profile of a cold or flu. Look, it's like I said: there are people who are going to be at continued risk from this. That's unfortunate, but it's no different than any other virus we've lived with throughout human civilization. At this point, we're proposing extraordinary interventions to head off an ordinary level of risk.