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Amazon will never bet on Bitcoin as it's primary virtual coin. It makes 0 sense since there's too much volatility plus it's open to manipulation by outsiders.

Amazon will never bet on Bitcoin as it's primary virtual coin. It makes 0 sense since there's too much volatility plus it's open to manipulation by outsiders. As an active international company, Amazon is perfectly positioned to create its own virtual coin. They've created their own transportation service since what is available did not meet their needs. Likewise, the credit card companies take a big chunk of their profits and don't meet all their needs. It's only a matter of time before they go after them. I bet they're making plans to create it and use it for internal transactions aiming for it to be used by all the shoppers. Eventually it will be convertible to any currency and Bitcoin will be one of them. This is the power of being big and getting bigger. This is a multi year project but it's coming.

dadoge 5y ago
What value does a virtual coin they maintain have for them and us consumers?
- WheelsAtLarge 5y ago
  Think about why countries have their own currency and don't automatically adopt some other country's money and you can start to figure out why it's advantageous to create your own coin. Historically it has been a huge problem for countries that let their citizens make their own money so they make it illegal. I don't know why that's changed recently but as long as it's legal companies will create their own. It really does become free money for the company.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
daveguy 5y ago
I'm not so sure. I would be surprised if they made their own coin given the regulatory scrutiny that would bring. I don't think they'll necessarily use Bitcoin though.
paxys 5y ago
There is already an Amazon "coin". It's called your gift card balance. If you mean they will try to move away from USD (or other national currencies), there is absolutely zero incentive for them to do so. And how will they pay their wholesalers, vendors, employees, taxes?
- fnord77 5y ago
  I'm sure they'd want nothing more than to be able to pay their employees with amazon gift cards so the only place they can spend their earnings is at the company store.
  - uncoder0 5y ago
    I don't doubt that they love the company store model. I've been offered AWS credits in lieu of cash for contract work.... after the cash amount was agreed to in writing and work was performed.
    - chii 5y ago
      how would the worker pay their taxes, if amazon did that? Presumably, the US gov't will not accept amazon gift-card in lieu of cash.
      - atatatat 5y ago
        You think most Amazon warehouse workers make enough to pay taxes?
  - throaway46546 5y ago
    Don't a lot of mechanical turk workers get paid in gift cards?
- EE84M3i 5y ago
  Amazon gift cards are marketplace specific. You can't buy a gift card in the UK and use it in the US.
vosper 5y ago
When Facebook tried to launch their own coin with Libra (now Diem) it went really badly, and they had lots of big names on-board, too: PayPal, eBay, Mastercard, Stripe, Visa. Diem seems to be battling on (maybe they want to make it the currency of their "metaverse") but how much do you hear about it these days? And that was when the FTC wasn't chaired by Lisa Khan.
- paxys 5y ago
  The difference is that Facebook presented a solution in search of a problem. Even today, browsing through the Diem site, there's a ton of vague marketing speak and zero actual things I can do with it. In contrast, "use this coin to buy anything on Amazon" is a massive product from the second it launches.
  - tantalor 5y ago
    I doubt sellers will want to accept it. You can't pay your taxes with Bezos-bucks.
    - toast0 5y ago
      I assume when I buy something from an Amazon merchant, Amazon pays them in their local currency, regardless of which currency I chose to pay with. If they've got BezoBucks now, I assume paying with those still sends USD to US vendors and UKP to UK vendors and EUR to European vendors, etc. I still don't see a big upside for Amazon, but merchants wouldn't need to accept it. And of course, Amazon could incentivize merchants to use it. Maybe if you take it, you get 1% more value than if you take USD and spend it on the site/AWS.
      - davidcbc 5y ago
        What value do BezoBucks add in this scenario? They can already convert USD to other currencies to pay their vendors. Just like Facebook's cryptocurrency it's just a solution in search of a problem.
knownjorbist 5y ago
Do people not remember Amazon Coin? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazon_Coin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazon_Coin
- somethingwitty1 5y ago
  That wasn't a "coin" in the context of this discussion. As the wiki correctly points out, it was a gift card, nothing more. It couldn't gain or lose value. It was tied to a specific dollar amount.
  - abrokenpipe 5y ago
    > It couldn't gain or lose value. It was tied to a specific dollar amount. Like a stable coin?
    - davidcbc 5y ago
      No, because it was actually backed by Amazon instead of by hopes and dreams like stable coins
trident5000 5y ago
"as its primary virtual coin" idk why you think it needs to come down to this, like its a big stance. They sell stuff. They will take whatever form of payment you want to accomplish this just like multiple fiat currencies are accepted by companies. If they accepted bitcoin it would be a casual add on of a payment type.
phasnox 5y ago
> It makes 0 sense since there's too much volatility plus it's open to manipulation by outsiders. So what? They don't have to keep it in Bitcoin. It makes lots of sense as they would safe millions on fees if done right. > Amazon is perfectly positioned to create its own virtual coin They could, and there's even a big change they would. We've seen big companies do dumb stuff. e.g. FB Libra project.
- dadoge 5y ago
  There is very little consumer demand to buy things in Bitcoin, esp in the US. Maybe elsewhere tho…like South America or Africa
  - WalterSear 5y ago
    Even less there.
    - dadoge 5y ago
      What do you mean? Argentina has had over 30% inflation EACH YEAR for many years in a row, for instance
      - WalterSear 5y ago
        They still have US dollars. They have less access to crypto and less ways to use it. They are poorer and can suffer market fluctuations worse. They don't have a government attempting to shut down fraudulent crypto actors in the way the US is.
        dadoge 5y ago
        https://medium.com/muunwallet/muun-releases-non-custodial-bitcoin-and-lightning-wallet-for-ios-dfe2808eebd5 https://medium.com/muunwallet/muun-releases-non-custodial-bi... They are actually at the forefront of adoption of The Lightning Network.
        5y ago
AndrewUnmuted 5y ago
When I worked at Audible I remember a particular hackathon where a team created a way to pay their membership to the platform in Bitcoin. The executive team at the time was made visibly uncomfortable by the idea while it was being presented. They expressed concern over the process involved in handling fraud and essentially said the business model didn't support a Bitcoin-based payments system. They even had the nerve to inquire about how accepting payments in Bitcoin benefits the customer. Needless to say, the team did not win. In fact, my team did - but we probably shouldn't have. Then the Amazon Coin [0] came out later that year, which to this day very few people actually are aware even exists. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazon_Coin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazon_Coin
- davidcbc 5y ago
  Amazon Coin isn't a cryptocurrency, so it seems irrelevant to the conversation.
yarky 5y ago
> It makes 0 sense since there's too much volatility plus it's open to manipulation by outsiders. It makes 0 sense only if you assume that they will hodl the coins, which makes no sense if you're using it exclusively to settle a transaction. You don't need to be expose to the crypto volatility to accept it as a payment method, in fact I don't see any risk involved as long as you find a way to immediately convert your crypto to the fiat currency of your choice.
- teawrecks 5y ago
  It's also not like it's part of btc's design to be volatile. Maybe one day the USD will be too volatile compared to a crypto that a significant number of people adopt. Never say never.
deevolution 5y ago
Companies creating their own coin is like having an intranet... intranets mostly suck and have no real value. There's a reason the www is superior - because it's fully open.
SideburnsOfDoom 5y ago
> Amazon is perfectly positioned to create its own virtual coin. Which by definition would be centralised, and so wouldn't need a blockchain at all?

dadoge 5y ago

What value does a virtual coin they maintain have for them and us consumers?

WheelsAtLarge 5y ago
Think about why countries have their own currency and don't automatically adopt some other country's money and you can start to figure out why it's advantageous to create your own coin. Historically it has been a huge problem for countries that let their citizens make their own money so they make it illegal. I don't know why that's changed recently but as long as it's legal companies will create their own. It really does become free money for the company.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]

daveguy 5y ago

I'm not so sure. I would be surprised if they made their own coin given the regulatory scrutiny that would bring. I don't think they'll necessarily use Bitcoin though.

paxys 5y ago

There is already an Amazon "coin". It's called your gift card balance. If you mean they will try to move away from USD (or other national currencies), there is absolutely zero incentive for them to do so. And how will they pay their wholesalers, vendors, employees, taxes?

fnord77 5y ago
I'm sure they'd want nothing more than to be able to pay their employees with amazon gift cards so the only place they can spend their earnings is at the company store.
- uncoder0 5y ago
  I don't doubt that they love the company store model. I've been offered AWS credits in lieu of cash for contract work.... after the cash amount was agreed to in writing and work was performed.
  - chii 5y ago
    how would the worker pay their taxes, if amazon did that? Presumably, the US gov't will not accept amazon gift-card in lieu of cash.
    - atatatat 5y ago
      You think most Amazon warehouse workers make enough to pay taxes?
- throaway46546 5y ago
  Don't a lot of mechanical turk workers get paid in gift cards?
EE84M3i 5y ago
Amazon gift cards are marketplace specific. You can't buy a gift card in the UK and use it in the US.

vosper 5y ago

When Facebook tried to launch their own coin with Libra (now Diem) it went really badly, and they had lots of big names on-board, too: PayPal, eBay, Mastercard, Stripe, Visa. Diem seems to be battling on (maybe they want to make it the currency of their "metaverse") but how much do you hear about it these days? And that was when the FTC wasn't chaired by Lisa Khan.

paxys 5y ago
The difference is that Facebook presented a solution in search of a problem. Even today, browsing through the Diem site, there's a ton of vague marketing speak and zero actual things I can do with it. In contrast, "use this coin to buy anything on Amazon" is a massive product from the second it launches.
- tantalor 5y ago
  I doubt sellers will want to accept it. You can't pay your taxes with Bezos-bucks.
  - toast0 5y ago
    I assume when I buy something from an Amazon merchant, Amazon pays them in their local currency, regardless of which currency I chose to pay with. If they've got BezoBucks now, I assume paying with those still sends USD to US vendors and UKP to UK vendors and EUR to European vendors, etc. I still don't see a big upside for Amazon, but merchants wouldn't need to accept it. And of course, Amazon could incentivize merchants to use it. Maybe if you take it, you get 1% more value than if you take USD and spend it on the site/AWS.
    - davidcbc 5y ago
      What value do BezoBucks add in this scenario? They can already convert USD to other currencies to pay their vendors. Just like Facebook's cryptocurrency it's just a solution in search of a problem.

knownjorbist 5y ago

Do people not remember Amazon Coin? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazon_Coin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazon_Coin

somethingwitty1 5y ago
That wasn't a "coin" in the context of this discussion. As the wiki correctly points out, it was a gift card, nothing more. It couldn't gain or lose value. It was tied to a specific dollar amount.
- abrokenpipe 5y ago
  > It couldn't gain or lose value. It was tied to a specific dollar amount. Like a stable coin?
  - davidcbc 5y ago
    No, because it was actually backed by Amazon instead of by hopes and dreams like stable coins

trident5000 5y ago

"as its primary virtual coin" idk why you think it needs to come down to this, like its a big stance. They sell stuff. They will take whatever form of payment you want to accomplish this just like multiple fiat currencies are accepted by companies. If they accepted bitcoin it would be a casual add on of a payment type.

phasnox 5y ago

> It makes 0 sense since there's too much volatility plus it's open to manipulation by outsiders. So what? They don't have to keep it in Bitcoin. It makes lots of sense as they would safe millions on fees if done right. > Amazon is perfectly positioned to create its own virtual coin They could, and there's even a big change they would. We've seen big companies do dumb stuff. e.g. FB Libra project.

dadoge 5y ago
There is very little consumer demand to buy things in Bitcoin, esp in the US. Maybe elsewhere tho…like South America or Africa
- WalterSear 5y ago
  Even less there.
  - dadoge 5y ago
    What do you mean? Argentina has had over 30% inflation EACH YEAR for many years in a row, for instance
    - WalterSear 5y ago
      They still have US dollars. They have less access to crypto and less ways to use it. They are poorer and can suffer market fluctuations worse. They don't have a government attempting to shut down fraudulent crypto actors in the way the US is.
      - dadoge 5y ago
        https://medium.com/muunwallet/muun-releases-non-custodial-bitcoin-and-lightning-wallet-for-ios-dfe2808eebd5 https://medium.com/muunwallet/muun-releases-non-custodial-bi... They are actually at the forefront of adoption of The Lightning Network.
      - 5y ago

AndrewUnmuted 5y ago

When I worked at Audible I remember a particular hackathon where a team created a way to pay their membership to the platform in Bitcoin. The executive team at the time was made visibly uncomfortable by the idea while it was being presented. They expressed concern over the process involved in handling fraud and essentially said the business model didn't support a Bitcoin-based payments system. They even had the nerve to inquire about how accepting payments in Bitcoin benefits the customer. Needless to say, the team did not win. In fact, my team did - but we probably shouldn't have. Then the Amazon Coin [0] came out later that year, which to this day very few people actually are aware even exists. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazon_Coin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazon_Coin

davidcbc 5y ago
Amazon Coin isn't a cryptocurrency, so it seems irrelevant to the conversation.

yarky 5y ago

> It makes 0 sense since there's too much volatility plus it's open to manipulation by outsiders. It makes 0 sense only if you assume that they will hodl the coins, which makes no sense if you're using it exclusively to settle a transaction. You don't need to be expose to the crypto volatility to accept it as a payment method, in fact I don't see any risk involved as long as you find a way to immediately convert your crypto to the fiat currency of your choice.

teawrecks 5y ago
It's also not like it's part of btc's design to be volatile. Maybe one day the USD will be too volatile compared to a crypto that a significant number of people adopt. Never say never.

deevolution 5y ago

Companies creating their own coin is like having an intranet... intranets mostly suck and have no real value. There's a reason the www is superior - because it's fully open.

SideburnsOfDoom 5y ago

> Amazon is perfectly positioned to create its own virtual coin. Which by definition would be centralised, and so wouldn't need a blockchain at all?