21 ms·

Debian for Mobile

238 points by wwarner 5y ago

jeremycarter 5y ago
Similar to Maemo from the Nokia days?
- rektide 5y ago
  maemo felt more like a specific initiative, with a core stack of libraries & cross-inregeative apps being built atop them. I get the impression Mobian is more like Debian itself. anyone is welcome, whatever tech you have.
  - jeremycarter 5y ago
    Sounds like a great idea then!
- mclightning 5y ago
  came to look for this comment. Maemo -> Meego -> Mer -> Sailfish.... now this. I guess this one runs like a un-opinionated Debian but for mobile.
- wicket 5y ago
  If you're looking for an actively developed Maemo rebased on top of modern Debian, you might be interested in Maemo Leste. [1] It's actually rebased on top of Devuan Beowulf rather the Debian (Buster), but they are open to having a Debian flavour with systemd too if anyone is willing to add support for this. [1] https://leste.maemo.org/ https://leste.maemo.org/
einpoklum 5y ago
This may be the better link - "What is Mobian" / Mobian FAQ: https://blog.mobian-project.org/posts/2021/02/18/what_is_mobian/ https://blog.mobian-project.org/posts/2021/02/18/what_is_mob... And the basic answer is: "Mobian aims to integrate the standard Debian distribution with Phone-specific projects and modifications in a distribution that works on certain mobile phones and tablets, such as the Pinephone, the Pinetab and the Librem 5. The idea is to minimize the Mobian specific pieces by “upstreaming” changes to the original projects as much as possible."
- kop316 5y ago
  This is also a pretty good link: https://wiki.mobian-project.org/doku.php https://wiki.mobian-project.org/doku.php Its a wiki for a lot of tips and tricks to get Mobian working on the Pinephone. It has a couple of other devices it will run on, but the Pinephone/Librem 5 are the most mature. (Disclaimer: I'm one of the devs for Mobian).
  - justinlilly 5y ago
    One of the key FAQs missing is: Is it ready? Should I use it? What should I expect my experience to be?
    - Arnavion 5y ago
      Compared to other distros on the pinephone, it's hampered by having Debian as a base system. The pinephone's singular camera program Megapixels is stuck on an older version on Mobian, because the newer versions require GTK 4, which Debian and thus Mobian does not package. (You can of course compile the GTK 4 stack yourself if you want. It's Linux after all.)
      - kop316 5y ago
        Yep. So far the plan is once Bullseye moves to stable, I think we are going to look into porting GTK4 into Mobian, as Megapixels and a few other apps are moving to GTK4.
      - mobian 5y ago
        Mobian is targeting Debian Testing/Sid. Debian is currently in freeze but after the upcoming release Mobian will start getting regular updates for every package.
    - kop316 5y ago
      I like to think Mobian is one of the "mature" Pinephone Distros, i.e. if there is something that doesn't work on Mobian, it will not work on any Pinephone/Librem 5 Distro. > Should I use it? I mean...of course i will say "yes you should!", so I guess I am more curious what you are expecting or if you have specific expectations? > What should I expect my experience to be? Mobian uses Phosh as the default environment, so if you have used any Pinephone Distribution with Phosh, that's about what to expect. If you have not used Phosh....well to be honest I do not know of any good Video reviews for it, but I imagine such videos exist.
kop316 5y ago
Heh, neat to see this here! I'm one if the (junior) devs helping out on this project, so if there are any specific questions I'm happy to try and answer!
- livre 5y ago
  Any plans on porting it to more mainstream phones? It seems to be aiming for "first-world phones" at the moment which is nice since they are more open and you don't have to worry (too much) about proprietary blobs and firmware but leaves a big chunk of the world out.
  - Kenji 5y ago
    The driver situation is super tough. Modern phones are full of proprietary shit and nobody is willing/able to reverse engineer all of this, and things like documentation and data sheets aren't really available.
    - livre 5y ago
      That's pretty much the answer I expected but I had to ask anyway. Thanks.
    - atlantis_ 5y ago
      It is getting better though - check out libcamera.
      - megous 5y ago
        What's to check out there wrt kernel drivers?
  - kop316 5y ago
    Right now the focus is on devices that devs have and run mainstream Linux: https://wiki.mobian-project.org/doku.php?id=devices https://wiki.mobian-project.org/doku.php?id=devices PostmarketOS runs on more devices (and is a great Distribution!), but they also run a lot more devices through Halium (which is a compatibility layer).
giancarlostoro 5y ago
Honestly, if I were to make an Android competitor, I'd try my best to compete by obviously using Linux but also including a solid package manager based on Debians, or snap and including buyable packages and a simple process for others to put their apps on said package manager / store. Maybe it can be a separate app that is optional. I'd also ensure full support for Progressive Web Apps.
- ocdtrekkie 5y ago
  Yeah, PWAs will be critical to the survival of third to market OSes which can't get large developer investment from major brands. I live in constant frustration that Windows Mobile was shut down the release prior to Windows supporting PWAs.
  - kop316 5y ago
    Epiphany supports PWAs, and is installed by default on Mobian. I just tried and successfully "Installed" Lyft as a PWA.
zajio1am 5y ago
As a Pinephone user, i am grateful for such project as it is important to upstream changes instead of end with shattered ecosystem of per-device distributions. But the default UI based on Phosh is problematic. Minimal configuration, broken and convoluted approach to scaling makes it rather hard to use. Also, no project mailing list?
- k1rcher 5y ago
  Semi-unrelated: I’ve been eyeing the Pinephone for quite some time now. Do you use yours as a daily driver? Or have you paired it with an a more-mainstream iPhone/Android? I’m currently using an iPhone as my social circle uses primarily uses iMessage and I’ve found it hard to migrate. As a secondary device for debugging, testing, and a “burpsuite playground” I’m using an extremely cheap Nokia I picked up a few years ago. I think a Pinephone would be cool to replace the Android I have.
  - vlunkr 5y ago
    Semi-unrelated again: Apple loves to lock you into their ecosystem (need an iPhone to use Apple Watch, etc), but iMessage is incredibly effective and often overlooked. If you use it heavily and want to move away from Apple, your options are to simply not take part in those conversations, or to convince everyone else to switch to something else. It sucks.
    - GekkePrutser 5y ago
      I heard this is really a big thing in the US yeah. Here in Europe iMessage isn't really a thing at all. Probably because apple's marketshare is so much lower. I know many people with iPhones but nobody ever tried to invite me to an iMessage group chat. Nobody even tried to message me with it directly, because it would have switched over to SMS and I've literally never had an SMS from a person. Just automated notifications and spam. Not that we're much better off here because we're still stuck with proprietary stuff like WhatsApp but at least it's not locked to one platform.
  - zajio1am 5y ago
westoque 5y ago
It took me awhile to find screenshots of how this looks like, so for others curious: https://wiki.mobian-project.org/doku.php?id=intro https://wiki.mobian-project.org/doku.php?id=intro This website looks like it got put together by a bunch of hackers, which is fine, but to attract even more contributors and other enthusiasts it might be good to at least put an intro and screenshots on the main page.
- kop316 5y ago
  > This website looks like it got put together by a bunch of hackers, Yeah, we try not to gatekeep folks from editing the Wiki, which is a double edged sword, like you said. > which is fine, but to attract even more contributors and other enthusiasts it might be good to at least put an intro and screenshots on the main page. Thank you for the feedback! would there be anything specific you would want to see for an intro/screenshots?
  - H12 5y ago
    Not the same guy, but a video demo of the UI (even if it's just a screengrab of an emulator) would be particularly interesting. Just something to communicate visually what using the UI is like. It's the first thing I look for when I'm curious about a mobile (and presumably animation-heavy) piece of software.
    - O_H_E 5y ago
      Yup that ^
    - fsflover 5y ago
      Search for Pinephone videos with Mobian, there are plenty on Youtube.
    - kop316 5y ago
      Fair enough! I may have to look up a couple of videos to link to the wiki.
    - kop316 5y ago
jokoon 5y ago
Mmmh are there non free drivers in there?
- kop316 5y ago
  No non-free drivers, but the Modem and Wifi/Bluetooth drivers need non-free firmware.
  - sdk- 5y ago
    Some devs in the Pine community are working on an open source firmware for the modem (e.g. https://twitter.com/biktorgj/status/1357217053745250304 https://twitter.com/biktorgj/status/1357217053745250304)
    - kop316 5y ago
      While I don't mean to take away from what the devs are doing (as it is awesome!), the modem is in two parts: a "user space" that is an version of Android (yes, the modem runs Android, I think Android 7?), and the actual modem has a lower level firmware based on Qualcomm Hexagon, which is still closed source, and not easily replaceable.
    - khimaros 5y ago
      this seems to contain the latest status and build instructions: https://github.com/biktorgj/pinephone_modem_sdk https://github.com/biktorgj/pinephone_modem_sdk there are also some interesting reverse engineering details here: https://xnux.eu/devices/feature/modem-pp-reveng.html https://xnux.eu/devices/feature/modem-pp-reveng.html
zozbot234 5y ago
Note that this is not an official Debian project, contrary to what the title implies. For the actual Debian for Mobile effort, see https://lists.debian.org/debian-mobile/ https://lists.debian.org/debian-mobile/ and https://wiki.debian.org/Mobile https://wiki.debian.org/Mobile
- neilv 5y ago
  Thanks. Privacy&security trustworthiness-wise, Mobian is an unknown quantity (at least, to me). That should be a big concern for something as sensitive as a smartphone/handheld, which tend to handle people's electronic communication, authentication for even more sensitive resources, etc. One path to trust would be to become an official Debian project, and to be scrutinized by broader Debian people.
  - kop316 5y ago
    While yes, it is not strictly a Debian project, there is significant overlap between the Debian on Mobile team: https://salsa.debian.org/DebianOnMobile-team https://salsa.debian.org/DebianOnMobile-team And the Mobian Team: https://gitlab.com/mobian1 https://gitlab.com/mobian1 Debian packaging has a nice feature too in that you can check the source used to build it, and any of the packages will be reproducible. So if you don't trust any of the Builds on the Mobian repository, you can actually check them all yourself.
    - vineyardmike 5y ago
      > you can actually check them all yourself For any sufficiently large project, this becomes basically infeasible unless you have serious resources or known risks to account for. "You can check the source" is almost a meme - how many people check the source of stuff they use? Likely very few. Most depend on history of trust and audits, and well funded groups paying people check.
      - kop316 5y ago
        In learning the Debian Packaging, I have a LOT more confidence in the Debian Packaging process, and a much better understanding of why it is what it is. Debian packaging (the quilt format) will watch the upstream git repo and will error out if the repo being packaged is different than what is upstream. The only way to add patches is to put them into the "Debian/Patches" folder and explicitly put them in there. In addition, one of the default CI pipelines for the Gitlab called "reprotest", which checked various environment differences to ensure that the package is reproducable. The outcome of this is it is signifiantly easier to check that a downstream package matches upstream for the average person, rather than checking all of the source, they can look at where upstream points to and check if reprotest passes.
macdice 5y ago
Might be a nice OS to run on https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/astro-slide-5g-transformer/x/26891513#/ https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/astro-slide-5g-transforme... (a phone about to ship with a Psion Series 5 style slide-out keyboard).
- kop316 5y ago
  If one of the devs purchase one, and it runs mainline linux, it would be a good candidate!
- yoshamano 5y ago
  Ahhh, Planet Computers. I really want to like their devices. They’re all Android devices that technically run Linux (and SailfishOS). The issue is all their devices use MediaTek SoC’s. So Linux comes in the form of a barely supported Debian + libhybris Frankenstein’s monster. You can run Linux on them, but you’ll be hard-pressed to do anything useful in Linux.
  - macdice 5y ago
    Is that situation likely to improve? Got any good pointers for where to read about that?
yepguy 5y ago
There's also Droidian [1], which is Mobian for Android devices. [1]: https://droidian.org/ https://droidian.org/
- shbooms 5y ago
  There's Ubuntu Touch as well foor another take on things. https://ubuntu-touch.io/ https://ubuntu-touch.io/
- zozbot234 5y ago
  Nice effort. What's the state of this work? It would be amazing to have some way for Debian to be available in GSI form, even while relying on a compatibility layer.
  - kop316 5y ago
    I have no affiliation with this project, so I actually have no idea. However, I wish them the best of luck on it!
  - khimaros 5y ago
    it looks like there are GSI builds available for Android 9 [0] and Android 10 [1] launch devices. Android 9 supports seems to be more advanced. [0] https://github.com/orgs/droidian/projects/1 https://github.com/orgs/droidian/projects/1 [1] https://github.com/orgs/droidian/projects/3 https://github.com/orgs/droidian/projects/3
mickotron 5y ago
Cool, now I can have outdated packages on my mobile, too!
- yjftsjthsd-h 5y ago
  Hopefully! It would be nice to escape Android's "anything older than a month is dead to us and will never get bugfixes" mindset:)
apatheticonion 5y ago
I would love to have Android on my phone but when I plug it into a USB-C dock, it outputs a full fat linux distro (with root access) on my monitor, using the USB peripherals as input. Android in the hand, Tux on the dock.
- zozbot234 5y ago
  Meh. The single one AOSP application that I'd actually want natively on my Linux phone is the open source Hacker's Keyboard, to enable a full-sized PC keyboard on the touch screen. Everything else can be left to an emulation layer like Anbox.
  - kop316 5y ago
    To the best of my knowledge, you can make a custom layout on the Phosh keyboard with a layout file. IIRC it isn't too difficult.
    - zozbot234 5y ago
      If so, why don't they ship standard full-PC layouts as Hacker's Keyboard does? IME, those are especially useful in landscape mode, or else on larger-screen phones and tablets.
      - kop316 5y ago
        I'm not the squeek keyboard dev, so I do not know. They have a "terminal" layout, which works well for me when I need more full-PC layouts.
        zozbot234 5y ago
        Found this issue tracker with related information: https://forums.puri.sm/t/using-non-latin-language-on-librem-5/7103/14 https://forums.puri.sm/t/using-non-latin-language-on-librem-... Looks like they're still far from basic feature parity with HK: they don't have key-specific popups for alternate inputs, and are unclear on how to support shift as a "true" modifier key (as HK does) without interfering with their existing UX, which is oriented towards composing text without necessarily involving the application. (This can be especially beneficial on smaller devices, where the "keyboard" can actually be a full-screen view with the only function being pure text entry.) A more PC-like layout would still provide some benefits though.

Debian for Mobile

238 points by wwarner 5y ago

jeremycarter 5y ago

Similar to Maemo from the Nokia days?

rektide 5y ago
maemo felt more like a specific initiative, with a core stack of libraries & cross-inregeative apps being built atop them. I get the impression Mobian is more like Debian itself. anyone is welcome, whatever tech you have.
- jeremycarter 5y ago
  Sounds like a great idea then!
mclightning 5y ago
came to look for this comment. Maemo -> Meego -> Mer -> Sailfish.... now this. I guess this one runs like a un-opinionated Debian but for mobile.
wicket 5y ago
If you're looking for an actively developed Maemo rebased on top of modern Debian, you might be interested in Maemo Leste. [1] It's actually rebased on top of Devuan Beowulf rather the Debian (Buster), but they are open to having a Debian flavour with systemd too if anyone is willing to add support for this. [1] https://leste.maemo.org/ https://leste.maemo.org/

einpoklum 5y ago

This may be the better link - "What is Mobian" / Mobian FAQ: https://blog.mobian-project.org/posts/2021/02/18/what_is_mobian/ https://blog.mobian-project.org/posts/2021/02/18/what_is_mob... And the basic answer is: "Mobian aims to integrate the standard Debian distribution with Phone-specific projects and modifications in a distribution that works on certain mobile phones and tablets, such as the Pinephone, the Pinetab and the Librem 5. The idea is to minimize the Mobian specific pieces by “upstreaming” changes to the original projects as much as possible."

kop316 5y ago
This is also a pretty good link: https://wiki.mobian-project.org/doku.php https://wiki.mobian-project.org/doku.php Its a wiki for a lot of tips and tricks to get Mobian working on the Pinephone. It has a couple of other devices it will run on, but the Pinephone/Librem 5 are the most mature. (Disclaimer: I'm one of the devs for Mobian).
- justinlilly 5y ago
  One of the key FAQs missing is: Is it ready? Should I use it? What should I expect my experience to be?
  - Arnavion 5y ago
    Compared to other distros on the pinephone, it's hampered by having Debian as a base system. The pinephone's singular camera program Megapixels is stuck on an older version on Mobian, because the newer versions require GTK 4, which Debian and thus Mobian does not package. (You can of course compile the GTK 4 stack yourself if you want. It's Linux after all.)
    - kop316 5y ago
      Yep. So far the plan is once Bullseye moves to stable, I think we are going to look into porting GTK4 into Mobian, as Megapixels and a few other apps are moving to GTK4.
    - mobian 5y ago
      Mobian is targeting Debian Testing/Sid. Debian is currently in freeze but after the upcoming release Mobian will start getting regular updates for every package.
  - kop316 5y ago
    I like to think Mobian is one of the "mature" Pinephone Distros, i.e. if there is something that doesn't work on Mobian, it will not work on any Pinephone/Librem 5 Distro. > Should I use it? I mean...of course i will say "yes you should!", so I guess I am more curious what you are expecting or if you have specific expectations? > What should I expect my experience to be? Mobian uses Phosh as the default environment, so if you have used any Pinephone Distribution with Phosh, that's about what to expect. If you have not used Phosh....well to be honest I do not know of any good Video reviews for it, but I imagine such videos exist.

kop316 5y ago

Heh, neat to see this here! I'm one if the (junior) devs helping out on this project, so if there are any specific questions I'm happy to try and answer!

livre 5y ago
Any plans on porting it to more mainstream phones? It seems to be aiming for "first-world phones" at the moment which is nice since they are more open and you don't have to worry (too much) about proprietary blobs and firmware but leaves a big chunk of the world out.
- Kenji 5y ago
  The driver situation is super tough. Modern phones are full of proprietary shit and nobody is willing/able to reverse engineer all of this, and things like documentation and data sheets aren't really available.
  - livre 5y ago
    That's pretty much the answer I expected but I had to ask anyway. Thanks.
  - atlantis_ 5y ago
    It is getting better though - check out libcamera.
    - megous 5y ago
      What's to check out there wrt kernel drivers?
- kop316 5y ago
  Right now the focus is on devices that devs have and run mainstream Linux: https://wiki.mobian-project.org/doku.php?id=devices https://wiki.mobian-project.org/doku.php?id=devices PostmarketOS runs on more devices (and is a great Distribution!), but they also run a lot more devices through Halium (which is a compatibility layer).

giancarlostoro 5y ago

Honestly, if I were to make an Android competitor, I'd try my best to compete by obviously using Linux but also including a solid package manager based on Debians, or snap and including buyable packages and a simple process for others to put their apps on said package manager / store. Maybe it can be a separate app that is optional. I'd also ensure full support for Progressive Web Apps.

ocdtrekkie 5y ago
Yeah, PWAs will be critical to the survival of third to market OSes which can't get large developer investment from major brands. I live in constant frustration that Windows Mobile was shut down the release prior to Windows supporting PWAs.
- kop316 5y ago
  Epiphany supports PWAs, and is installed by default on Mobian. I just tried and successfully "Installed" Lyft as a PWA.

zajio1am 5y ago

As a Pinephone user, i am grateful for such project as it is important to upstream changes instead of end with shattered ecosystem of per-device distributions. But the default UI based on Phosh is problematic. Minimal configuration, broken and convoluted approach to scaling makes it rather hard to use. Also, no project mailing list?

k1rcher 5y ago
Semi-unrelated: I’ve been eyeing the Pinephone for quite some time now. Do you use yours as a daily driver? Or have you paired it with an a more-mainstream iPhone/Android? I’m currently using an iPhone as my social circle uses primarily uses iMessage and I’ve found it hard to migrate. As a secondary device for debugging, testing, and a “burpsuite playground” I’m using an extremely cheap Nokia I picked up a few years ago. I think a Pinephone would be cool to replace the Android I have.
- vlunkr 5y ago
  Semi-unrelated again: Apple loves to lock you into their ecosystem (need an iPhone to use Apple Watch, etc), but iMessage is incredibly effective and often overlooked. If you use it heavily and want to move away from Apple, your options are to simply not take part in those conversations, or to convince everyone else to switch to something else. It sucks.
  - GekkePrutser 5y ago
    I heard this is really a big thing in the US yeah. Here in Europe iMessage isn't really a thing at all. Probably because apple's marketshare is so much lower. I know many people with iPhones but nobody ever tried to invite me to an iMessage group chat. Nobody even tried to message me with it directly, because it would have switched over to SMS and I've literally never had an SMS from a person. Just automated notifications and spam. Not that we're much better off here because we're still stuck with proprietary stuff like WhatsApp but at least it's not locked to one platform.
- zajio1am 5y ago

westoque 5y ago

It took me awhile to find screenshots of how this looks like, so for others curious: https://wiki.mobian-project.org/doku.php?id=intro https://wiki.mobian-project.org/doku.php?id=intro This website looks like it got put together by a bunch of hackers, which is fine, but to attract even more contributors and other enthusiasts it might be good to at least put an intro and screenshots on the main page.

kop316 5y ago
> This website looks like it got put together by a bunch of hackers, Yeah, we try not to gatekeep folks from editing the Wiki, which is a double edged sword, like you said. > which is fine, but to attract even more contributors and other enthusiasts it might be good to at least put an intro and screenshots on the main page. Thank you for the feedback! would there be anything specific you would want to see for an intro/screenshots?
- H12 5y ago
  Not the same guy, but a video demo of the UI (even if it's just a screengrab of an emulator) would be particularly interesting. Just something to communicate visually what using the UI is like. It's the first thing I look for when I'm curious about a mobile (and presumably animation-heavy) piece of software.
  - O_H_E 5y ago
    Yup that ^
  - fsflover 5y ago
    Search for Pinephone videos with Mobian, there are plenty on Youtube.
  - kop316 5y ago
    Fair enough! I may have to look up a couple of videos to link to the wiki.
  - kop316 5y ago

jokoon 5y ago

Mmmh are there non free drivers in there?

kop316 5y ago
No non-free drivers, but the Modem and Wifi/Bluetooth drivers need non-free firmware.
- sdk- 5y ago
  Some devs in the Pine community are working on an open source firmware for the modem (e.g. https://twitter.com/biktorgj/status/1357217053745250304 https://twitter.com/biktorgj/status/1357217053745250304)
  - kop316 5y ago
    While I don't mean to take away from what the devs are doing (as it is awesome!), the modem is in two parts: a "user space" that is an version of Android (yes, the modem runs Android, I think Android 7?), and the actual modem has a lower level firmware based on Qualcomm Hexagon, which is still closed source, and not easily replaceable.
  - khimaros 5y ago
    this seems to contain the latest status and build instructions: https://github.com/biktorgj/pinephone_modem_sdk https://github.com/biktorgj/pinephone_modem_sdk there are also some interesting reverse engineering details here: https://xnux.eu/devices/feature/modem-pp-reveng.html https://xnux.eu/devices/feature/modem-pp-reveng.html

zozbot234 5y ago

Note that this is not an official Debian project, contrary to what the title implies. For the actual Debian for Mobile effort, see https://lists.debian.org/debian-mobile/ https://lists.debian.org/debian-mobile/ and https://wiki.debian.org/Mobile https://wiki.debian.org/Mobile

neilv 5y ago
Thanks. Privacy&security trustworthiness-wise, Mobian is an unknown quantity (at least, to me). That should be a big concern for something as sensitive as a smartphone/handheld, which tend to handle people's electronic communication, authentication for even more sensitive resources, etc. One path to trust would be to become an official Debian project, and to be scrutinized by broader Debian people.
- kop316 5y ago
  While yes, it is not strictly a Debian project, there is significant overlap between the Debian on Mobile team: https://salsa.debian.org/DebianOnMobile-team https://salsa.debian.org/DebianOnMobile-team And the Mobian Team: https://gitlab.com/mobian1 https://gitlab.com/mobian1 Debian packaging has a nice feature too in that you can check the source used to build it, and any of the packages will be reproducible. So if you don't trust any of the Builds on the Mobian repository, you can actually check them all yourself.
  - vineyardmike 5y ago
    > you can actually check them all yourself For any sufficiently large project, this becomes basically infeasible unless you have serious resources or known risks to account for. "You can check the source" is almost a meme - how many people check the source of stuff they use? Likely very few. Most depend on history of trust and audits, and well funded groups paying people check.
    - kop316 5y ago
      In learning the Debian Packaging, I have a LOT more confidence in the Debian Packaging process, and a much better understanding of why it is what it is. Debian packaging (the quilt format) will watch the upstream git repo and will error out if the repo being packaged is different than what is upstream. The only way to add patches is to put them into the "Debian/Patches" folder and explicitly put them in there. In addition, one of the default CI pipelines for the Gitlab called "reprotest", which checked various environment differences to ensure that the package is reproducable. The outcome of this is it is signifiantly easier to check that a downstream package matches upstream for the average person, rather than checking all of the source, they can look at where upstream points to and check if reprotest passes.

macdice 5y ago

Might be a nice OS to run on https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/astro-slide-5g-transformer/x/26891513#/ https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/astro-slide-5g-transforme... (a phone about to ship with a Psion Series 5 style slide-out keyboard).

kop316 5y ago
If one of the devs purchase one, and it runs mainline linux, it would be a good candidate!
yoshamano 5y ago
Ahhh, Planet Computers. I really want to like their devices. They’re all Android devices that technically run Linux (and SailfishOS). The issue is all their devices use MediaTek SoC’s. So Linux comes in the form of a barely supported Debian + libhybris Frankenstein’s monster. You can run Linux on them, but you’ll be hard-pressed to do anything useful in Linux.
- macdice 5y ago
  Is that situation likely to improve? Got any good pointers for where to read about that?

yepguy 5y ago

There's also Droidian [1], which is Mobian for Android devices. [1]: https://droidian.org/ https://droidian.org/

shbooms 5y ago
There's Ubuntu Touch as well foor another take on things. https://ubuntu-touch.io/ https://ubuntu-touch.io/
zozbot234 5y ago
Nice effort. What's the state of this work? It would be amazing to have some way for Debian to be available in GSI form, even while relying on a compatibility layer.
- kop316 5y ago
  I have no affiliation with this project, so I actually have no idea. However, I wish them the best of luck on it!
- khimaros 5y ago
  it looks like there are GSI builds available for Android 9 [0] and Android 10 [1] launch devices. Android 9 supports seems to be more advanced. [0] https://github.com/orgs/droidian/projects/1 https://github.com/orgs/droidian/projects/1 [1] https://github.com/orgs/droidian/projects/3 https://github.com/orgs/droidian/projects/3

mickotron 5y ago

Cool, now I can have outdated packages on my mobile, too!

yjftsjthsd-h 5y ago
Hopefully! It would be nice to escape Android's "anything older than a month is dead to us and will never get bugfixes" mindset:)

apatheticonion 5y ago

I would love to have Android on my phone but when I plug it into a USB-C dock, it outputs a full fat linux distro (with root access) on my monitor, using the USB peripherals as input. Android in the hand, Tux on the dock.

zozbot234 5y ago
Meh. The single one AOSP application that I'd actually want natively on my Linux phone is the open source Hacker's Keyboard, to enable a full-sized PC keyboard on the touch screen. Everything else can be left to an emulation layer like Anbox.
- kop316 5y ago
  To the best of my knowledge, you can make a custom layout on the Phosh keyboard with a layout file. IIRC it isn't too difficult.
  - zozbot234 5y ago
    If so, why don't they ship standard full-PC layouts as Hacker's Keyboard does? IME, those are especially useful in landscape mode, or else on larger-screen phones and tablets.
    - kop316 5y ago
      I'm not the squeek keyboard dev, so I do not know. They have a "terminal" layout, which works well for me when I need more full-PC layouts.
      - zozbot234 5y ago
        Found this issue tracker with related information: https://forums.puri.sm/t/using-non-latin-language-on-librem-5/7103/14 https://forums.puri.sm/t/using-non-latin-language-on-librem-... Looks like they're still far from basic feature parity with HK: they don't have key-specific popups for alternate inputs, and are unclear on how to support shift as a "true" modifier key (as HK does) without interfering with their existing UX, which is oriented towards composing text without necessarily involving the application. (This can be especially beneficial on smaller devices, where the "keyboard" can actually be a full-screen view with the only function being pure text entry.) A more PC-like layout would still provide some benefits though.