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The existence of coaches and scrum masters is the result of decisions of management, that see agile as a way of getting daily reports from the team through the

by mmarq 5y ago

The existence of coaches and scrum masters is the result of decisions of management, that see agile as a way of getting daily reports from the team through the daily standup. I don’t think that people who don't write or never wrote software should have a place in a software development team. We don’t allow scrum masters and agile coaches in hospitals and ask them to “improve the process”, because we know the only “improvement” we will get is millions of dead and injured. But for whatever reason we allow freshly minted certified scrum masters to lecture seasoned professionals on process, to organise 19 meetings a day to discuss the differences between scrum and agile and, in general, to unleash havoc and destruction.

AndyPa32 5y ago
This is exactly what drove me off my last team. We were seasoned developers with a combined experience of more than 50 years, 25 of them in scrum. And we were assigned a scrum master that never worked in software development before, fresh of the scrum master training and was telling us in a very condescending tone, how we could improve ourselves and our team. That guy didn't know anything about software development, not anything about our problem domain and nothing really about our client or users. It was ridiculous.
- walshemj 5y ago
  How can you even get a Job as a "scrum master" with no experience in development or the industry. You should collectively have just refused to work for them in this case.
  - wheelinsupial 5y ago
    The consultant that comes into your company decides to start by applying scrum to software development teams. Leadership likes this new approach and expands it to other departments. Now you have scrum masters who were previously accountants, marketers, HR, and other business domain experts. Consultant decides that it’s in the scrum coaching team’s best interest to let the scrum masters determine where they are placed. Scrum masters want to work on software because other companies pay more. All scrum masters converge to become involved in software teams.
jim-jim-jim 5y ago
> We don’t allow scrum masters and agile coaches in hospitals Give it a few years.
- brnt 5y ago
  My hospital had them 10 years ago. Leaving is, second to marrying my wife, the best decision I ever made. Hospitals are, much to my sincere regret, not able to attract much talent in IT. Mediocrity is the best you can hope for, and I wouldn't even count on that.
  - dsr_ 5y ago
    It is the same as the government IT problem: if you can make much more money in private practice, why would you work at a hospital or government? Selling software to the hospitals or government is a better deal.
  - CRConrad 5y ago
    > Hospitals are, much to my sincere regret, not able to attract much talent in IT. I think the GP meant "in hospitals" as in "among medical people", doctors and nurses, not IT staff.
xorcist 5y ago
> We don’t allow scrum masters and agile coaches in hospitals They're not called scrum masters but the healthcare industry is absolutely full of them. One peculiar thing about the covid crisis was, at least around this particular corner of the planet, in the all-hands-on-deck situation where everyone on the floor in healthcare had to help out, these people suddenly found other things to do. It was impressive to see what could be accomplished when everyone was focused on a singular goal, without a coach in sight. I'm sure there's a lesson there somewhere.
- schwurb 5y ago
  > I'm sure there's a lesson there somewhere. There sure is: Having one goal and being able to allocate all/most resources towards that goal. The problem is that this is not sustainable. Times of crisis usually ends and then what? Then we are back at square one with "How do we allocate our scarse resources between these really important 4-5 goals?" Concluding: It is certainly refreshing how efficient groups can be once a crisis forces all attention towards one single goal. (Perhaps unfortuntately) that is not a reliable (crisises are usually not predictable) nor sustainable (other goals tend to get neglected in crisis mode).
Aeolun 5y ago
> I don’t think that people who don't write or never wrote software should have a place in a software development team This is no guarantee any more. Newly minted managers coming from a development position that have only ever worked in dysfunctional organisations (and got promoted from within) will only reinforce the existing bad practices.
dsr_ 5y ago
A fair number of hospitals have been taken over by MBAs. The result is generally more money for the administration, and cost-cutting elsewhere. Since the purpose of a hospital is not to make money but to improve health-related outcomes, this is usually bad. On the other hand, it turns out that focus on improving health-related outcomes by applying science and statistics works really well... and usually decreases costs, too.

by mmarq 5y ago

AndyPa32 5y ago

This is exactly what drove me off my last team. We were seasoned developers with a combined experience of more than 50 years, 25 of them in scrum. And we were assigned a scrum master that never worked in software development before, fresh of the scrum master training and was telling us in a very condescending tone, how we could improve ourselves and our team. That guy didn't know anything about software development, not anything about our problem domain and nothing really about our client or users. It was ridiculous.

walshemj 5y ago
How can you even get a Job as a "scrum master" with no experience in development or the industry. You should collectively have just refused to work for them in this case.
- wheelinsupial 5y ago
  The consultant that comes into your company decides to start by applying scrum to software development teams. Leadership likes this new approach and expands it to other departments. Now you have scrum masters who were previously accountants, marketers, HR, and other business domain experts. Consultant decides that it’s in the scrum coaching team’s best interest to let the scrum masters determine where they are placed. Scrum masters want to work on software because other companies pay more. All scrum masters converge to become involved in software teams.

jim-jim-jim 5y ago

> We don’t allow scrum masters and agile coaches in hospitals Give it a few years.

brnt 5y ago
My hospital had them 10 years ago. Leaving is, second to marrying my wife, the best decision I ever made. Hospitals are, much to my sincere regret, not able to attract much talent in IT. Mediocrity is the best you can hope for, and I wouldn't even count on that.
- dsr_ 5y ago
  It is the same as the government IT problem: if you can make much more money in private practice, why would you work at a hospital or government? Selling software to the hospitals or government is a better deal.
- CRConrad 5y ago
  > Hospitals are, much to my sincere regret, not able to attract much talent in IT. I think the GP meant "in hospitals" as in "among medical people", doctors and nurses, not IT staff.

xorcist 5y ago

> We don’t allow scrum masters and agile coaches in hospitals They're not called scrum masters but the healthcare industry is absolutely full of them. One peculiar thing about the covid crisis was, at least around this particular corner of the planet, in the all-hands-on-deck situation where everyone on the floor in healthcare had to help out, these people suddenly found other things to do. It was impressive to see what could be accomplished when everyone was focused on a singular goal, without a coach in sight. I'm sure there's a lesson there somewhere.

schwurb 5y ago
> I'm sure there's a lesson there somewhere. There sure is: Having one goal and being able to allocate all/most resources towards that goal. The problem is that this is not sustainable. Times of crisis usually ends and then what? Then we are back at square one with "How do we allocate our scarse resources between these really important 4-5 goals?" Concluding: It is certainly refreshing how efficient groups can be once a crisis forces all attention towards one single goal. (Perhaps unfortuntately) that is not a reliable (crisises are usually not predictable) nor sustainable (other goals tend to get neglected in crisis mode).

Aeolun 5y ago

> I don’t think that people who don't write or never wrote software should have a place in a software development team This is no guarantee any more. Newly minted managers coming from a development position that have only ever worked in dysfunctional organisations (and got promoted from within) will only reinforce the existing bad practices.

dsr_ 5y ago

A fair number of hospitals have been taken over by MBAs. The result is generally more money for the administration, and cost-cutting elsewhere. Since the purpose of a hospital is not to make money but to improve health-related outcomes, this is usually bad. On the other hand, it turns out that focus on improving health-related outcomes by applying science and statistics works really well... and usually decreases costs, too.