10 ms·

Exactly right. Put another way, Viasat is saying "I will lose money because my service is worse, and I will be in a disadvantaged position because we followed t

by qqtt 5y ago

Exactly right. Put another way, Viasat is saying "I will lose money because my service is worse, and I will be in a disadvantaged position because we followed the rules and the FCC allowed SpaceX not to. If there was no material impact to Viasat's business, they wouldn't even be able to file the lawsuit. The courts will decide if SpaceX/FCC acted unfairly towards Viasat by allowing SpaceX to operate under a different set of rules - again, causing Viasat's product to be worse and having a material impact to Viasat's business.

leephillips 5y ago
Does the harm have to be financial? Can I sue because Starlink interferes with my pursuit of observational astronomy?
- rolleiflex 5y ago
  Not a lawyer, but my understanding is that the answer is yes, in theory. In practice, the primary people that could legitimately make that argument would be the observatories of universities or the like, people with substantial and well-documented prior interest in the act. In fact this concern was raised before. I don’t think any went as far as suing, though.
  - leephillips 5y ago
    That makes sense. I know there is a lot of resentment in the astronomy community over Starlink, but suing is a big financial risk.
    - aeternum 5y ago
      It's kinda sad to see the astronomy community consider a slight inconvenience to their hobby to be more important than worldwide internet access. We lost a jumbo jet to the ocean and were unable to find it because we did not have worldwide coverage. How many millions of people are without internet access in rural areas? Don't many consider internet access to be close to a basic human right? I was considering getting into astronomy myself but do not want to be part of a community like that. It's probably a vocal minority but it's still disappointing.
      - leephillips 5y ago
        Yeah, good call. You should probably stay away.
      - tsimionescu 5y ago
        How could thousands of satellites launched every year be a solution to bringing internet to the whole world? Do you have any idea how expensive Starlink will be? Whole villages won't be able to afford a single base station at current prices, and they are losing money today.
        nanidin 5y ago
        I'm a westerner, but lived in a village in Indonesia for 6 weeks. I agree the cost of a base station + monthly fees would be exorbitant for most living in the village as currently priced for the US market. Interesting note though, they had satellite dishes with pirate decoders to watch satellite TV, which gave them access to things like American movies. This is in a place where a cup of coffee was $0.10 and a pack of cigarettes was something like $1. The family I lived with had four kids, the father climbed trees to collect juice to ferment into tuak, which they sold at a roadside stop for something like $0.05/bottle. They also had a small farm. They were able to afford running non-potable water, electricity, TV + satellite dish + decoder, and cheap cell phones with data connections. I'm sure Starlink would be priced in a way that was affordable in the local economy should it get there, and that people that have no other internet options will take it up and join the modern world. I think that will be a net win for society. Not a direct reply, but Starlink will also enable some interesting scenarios around open internet access in places where it doesn't exist today - like the Middle East during the Arab Spring, or in China, or in North Korea.
        tsimionescu 5y ago
        > I'm sure Starlink would be priced in a way that was affordable in the local economy should it get there But this is the problem: it can't. With cables, the cost is location dependent because it is dominated by the local cost of work. But starlink has limited bandwidth, and their cost is dominated by the satellites and launches, and by the work of highly skilled engineers in America. Every extra subscriber costs them a lot, and they can't make money by launching millions of dollars worth of satellites and charging 10$ a month. > Not a direct reply, but Starlink will also enable some interesting scenarios around open internet access in places where it doesn't exist today - like the Middle East during the Arab Spring, or in China, or in North Korea. Why do you think that? Satellite signals are easy to detect and jam, unfortunately. Especially since satellite internet requires you to transmit, not just receive. If you were right, those places would already have satellite television access to news around the world.
  - skinnymuch 5y ago
    Would a Peter Thiel like situation only work if it was done the same way - billionaire funds some one at a university? A billionaire themselves wouldn’t have grounds for a case for saying their astronomical observations are being messed with. This is assuming they do have some what of an astronomy hobby.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
defaultname 5y ago
>they wouldn't even be able to file the lawsuit Pedantic, but anyone can file a lawsuit about almost anything, regardless of proof or standing or lack thereof. The barrier to doing so is negligible. It would get dismissed at the earliest consideration, but the point is that the filing of a lawsuit means incredibly little.

by qqtt 5y ago

leephillips 5y ago

Does the harm have to be financial? Can I sue because Starlink interferes with my pursuit of observational astronomy?

rolleiflex 5y ago
Not a lawyer, but my understanding is that the answer is yes, in theory. In practice, the primary people that could legitimately make that argument would be the observatories of universities or the like, people with substantial and well-documented prior interest in the act. In fact this concern was raised before. I don’t think any went as far as suing, though.
- leephillips 5y ago
  That makes sense. I know there is a lot of resentment in the astronomy community over Starlink, but suing is a big financial risk.
  - aeternum 5y ago
    It's kinda sad to see the astronomy community consider a slight inconvenience to their hobby to be more important than worldwide internet access. We lost a jumbo jet to the ocean and were unable to find it because we did not have worldwide coverage. How many millions of people are without internet access in rural areas? Don't many consider internet access to be close to a basic human right? I was considering getting into astronomy myself but do not want to be part of a community like that. It's probably a vocal minority but it's still disappointing.
    - leephillips 5y ago
      Yeah, good call. You should probably stay away.
    - tsimionescu 5y ago
      How could thousands of satellites launched every year be a solution to bringing internet to the whole world? Do you have any idea how expensive Starlink will be? Whole villages won't be able to afford a single base station at current prices, and they are losing money today.
      - nanidin 5y ago
        I'm a westerner, but lived in a village in Indonesia for 6 weeks. I agree the cost of a base station + monthly fees would be exorbitant for most living in the village as currently priced for the US market. Interesting note though, they had satellite dishes with pirate decoders to watch satellite TV, which gave them access to things like American movies. This is in a place where a cup of coffee was $0.10 and a pack of cigarettes was something like $1. The family I lived with had four kids, the father climbed trees to collect juice to ferment into tuak, which they sold at a roadside stop for something like $0.05/bottle. They also had a small farm. They were able to afford running non-potable water, electricity, TV + satellite dish + decoder, and cheap cell phones with data connections. I'm sure Starlink would be priced in a way that was affordable in the local economy should it get there, and that people that have no other internet options will take it up and join the modern world. I think that will be a net win for society. Not a direct reply, but Starlink will also enable some interesting scenarios around open internet access in places where it doesn't exist today - like the Middle East during the Arab Spring, or in China, or in North Korea.
        tsimionescu 5y ago
        > I'm sure Starlink would be priced in a way that was affordable in the local economy should it get there But this is the problem: it can't. With cables, the cost is location dependent because it is dominated by the local cost of work. But starlink has limited bandwidth, and their cost is dominated by the satellites and launches, and by the work of highly skilled engineers in America. Every extra subscriber costs them a lot, and they can't make money by launching millions of dollars worth of satellites and charging 10$ a month. > Not a direct reply, but Starlink will also enable some interesting scenarios around open internet access in places where it doesn't exist today - like the Middle East during the Arab Spring, or in China, or in North Korea. Why do you think that? Satellite signals are easy to detect and jam, unfortunately. Especially since satellite internet requires you to transmit, not just receive. If you were right, those places would already have satellite television access to news around the world.
- skinnymuch 5y ago
  Would a Peter Thiel like situation only work if it was done the same way - billionaire funds some one at a university? A billionaire themselves wouldn’t have grounds for a case for saying their astronomical observations are being messed with. This is assuming they do have some what of an astronomy hobby.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

defaultname 5y ago

>they wouldn't even be able to file the lawsuit Pedantic, but anyone can file a lawsuit about almost anything, regardless of proof or standing or lack thereof. The barrier to doing so is negligible. It would get dismissed at the earliest consideration, but the point is that the filing of a lawsuit means incredibly little.