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The soil is not a mere substrate, it is an entire ecosystem into itself. Topsoil depth is directly correlated with crop yield, and top soil depth has been shrin

The soil is not a mere substrate, it is an entire ecosystem into itself. Topsoil depth is directly correlated with crop yield, and top soil depth has been shrinking. It takes atleast 50 years, often longer, to turn shit soil into good top soil worth anything and it requires sacrificing a lot of the yield to do so. Growing alfalfa would help, but that is often not that profitable compared to reaping the soil and throwing on more artificial fertilizer until the soil is garbage.

soperj 5y ago
People have done it alot faster than 50 years. Method boils down to, no till, plant a mix of cover crops, and don't plant mono culture. Ended up getting a inch of top soil a year.
- tremon 5y ago
  plant a mix of cover crops You're starting halfway on the track. Most things you plant in arid soil won't grow, which is the situation where the GP started from. Sure, once you have a soil quality where your crop mix grows, it will take less than 50 years. "How to get an inch of topsoil?" - "first, have an inch of topsoil" isn't really the scenario the GP was thinking of.
  - soperj 5y ago
    The prairies in Canada/US are very arid, and they have no problem growing things.
d110af5ccf 5y ago
> It takes atleast 50 years, often longer Or, crazy idea, just do exactly what we do with fertilizer. Identify what's missing, prepare it en masse, and add it back in. This could include microbes, minerals, certain types of organic material, you name it. As our understanding of a system improves so too does our ability to efficiently manipulate it to achieve the end result that we want.
- ClumsyPilot 5y ago
  You don't understant the volumes involved in farming, 4 inches of soil * area of 1000 hectares = 3 million tons of material.
  - d110af5ccf 5y ago
    No one suggested replacing the soil wholesale. I described additional things which might be incorporated into existing fertilizers in the future. I believe many of them already include organic matter of various sorts. For the record, I believe you drastically underestimate our current practices and capabilities. We've been performing nitrogen fixation on an industrial scale since the early 1900s.
    - ClumsyPilot 5y ago
      You are talking about replacing 30% of topsoil, thats how much organic matter as a percentage of soil you need to have for soil to be soil and not sand. Its not about capabilities, ita about cost.
    - imtringued 5y ago
      No, it's exactly what you suggested. Let's say you can get a microbial solution manufactured in a lab. You still have to distribute it and let it "grow" into the soil. That is exactly the opposite of what you said you wanted though. It's not the instant application process that fertilizers have. Therefore you actually do need to supplement the soil wholesale for an instant result. Waiting for the "dumb bacteria" to do their job costs money so it won't happen.
FooBarWidget 5y ago
Why is it hard to restore topsoil?

soperj 5y ago

People have done it alot faster than 50 years. Method boils down to, no till, plant a mix of cover crops, and don't plant mono culture. Ended up getting a inch of top soil a year.

tremon 5y ago
plant a mix of cover crops You're starting halfway on the track. Most things you plant in arid soil won't grow, which is the situation where the GP started from. Sure, once you have a soil quality where your crop mix grows, it will take less than 50 years. "How to get an inch of topsoil?" - "first, have an inch of topsoil" isn't really the scenario the GP was thinking of.
- soperj 5y ago
  The prairies in Canada/US are very arid, and they have no problem growing things.

d110af5ccf 5y ago

> It takes atleast 50 years, often longer Or, crazy idea, just do exactly what we do with fertilizer. Identify what's missing, prepare it en masse, and add it back in. This could include microbes, minerals, certain types of organic material, you name it. As our understanding of a system improves so too does our ability to efficiently manipulate it to achieve the end result that we want.

ClumsyPilot 5y ago
You don't understant the volumes involved in farming, 4 inches of soil * area of 1000 hectares = 3 million tons of material.
- d110af5ccf 5y ago
  No one suggested replacing the soil wholesale. I described additional things which might be incorporated into existing fertilizers in the future. I believe many of them already include organic matter of various sorts. For the record, I believe you drastically underestimate our current practices and capabilities. We've been performing nitrogen fixation on an industrial scale since the early 1900s.
  - ClumsyPilot 5y ago
    You are talking about replacing 30% of topsoil, thats how much organic matter as a percentage of soil you need to have for soil to be soil and not sand. Its not about capabilities, ita about cost.
  - imtringued 5y ago
    No, it's exactly what you suggested. Let's say you can get a microbial solution manufactured in a lab. You still have to distribute it and let it "grow" into the soil. That is exactly the opposite of what you said you wanted though. It's not the instant application process that fertilizers have. Therefore you actually do need to supplement the soil wholesale for an instant result. Waiting for the "dumb bacteria" to do their job costs money so it won't happen.

FooBarWidget 5y ago

Why is it hard to restore topsoil?