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As a woman in tech, the problem is that men start hitting on you when they’ve had a few beers. This happens extremely frequently, so much that I have personally

As a woman in tech, the problem is that men start hitting on you when they’ve had a few beers. This happens extremely frequently, so much that I have personally decided to discount what people say to me when they’re drunk at company events

Karunamon 5y ago
This is a sexist comment and could be career-ending if made by someone of the opposite sex. For a demonstration why: "The problem is that (class of people that encompasses billions of unrelated individuals worldwide) start (any kind of negative action in particular)" No matter what you fill those variables with, it remains a broad, harmful generalization. I'm sorry you had to work with unprofessional assholes that won't take 'no' for an answer, but your experience is not license to slander literally half of the planet.
- will4274 5y ago
  I feel very ambivalent about your comment. Parents comment is sexist and you are absolutely correct in saying that men can and are fired at some workplaces for making similar comments that generalize women. On the other hand, parents comment is also true. I'm a man btw.
- throwaway675309 5y ago
  Yep, likely wasn't intentional, but that person's statement does have the air of, "they are INSERT_CLASS, so it's in their nature"...
- Supermancho 5y ago
  > As a woman in tech, the problem is that men start hitting on you when they’ve had a few beers. > I'm sorry you had to work with unprofessional assholes that won't take 'no' for an answer, but your experience is not license to slander literally half of the planet. You've broadened the original statement to say more than was commented. The original did not say "all men" or even "only men". Quite the disingenuous interpretation turned around to try to make up a controversy.
  - Karunamon 5y ago
    >the problem is that men... >the problem is that women... Not one sentence beginning this way in this context will ever be anything other than a sexist generalization. That was the point being made, and I stand by it.
    - taurath 5y ago
      https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NotAllMen https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NotAllMen Please educate yourself on how this shuts down debate over intolerant behavior. The tolerance of other men is required for activity like this - and /obviously/ there are many men who find this behavior awful but also clearly /not enough/ to stop it from happening. Yes, of course, not all men do this shit. But it’s enough to have a considerable impact on people. Usually there’s a small number of abusers and then a large group of people tolerating or egging on the abuse. This is why they’re describing a “frat bro” culture in the legal suit.
      - Karunamon 5y ago
        Here, sure. We're describing concrete allegations against specific people. However, mentioning a class of people without qualification colloquially means 'all', and would not be tolerated or seen as anything other than an ignorant, discriminatory, prejudicial comment in any other context. Tarring an entire sex as having any problem in particular is disgusting. The article you linked even includes the following quote: If we genuinely oppose prejudice on the grounds of identity, rather than seek to elevate certain identities and disparage others, there is no shame and much worth in pointing out when negative stereotypes are applied to men. The original comment could have been made without the generalization and would have carried just as much weight. The fact that your last paragraph begins with "of course.." is proof that you recognize that this is an inaccurate generalization. Let's have less of that. That's what I'm asking for.
        deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
        5y ago
giantg2 5y ago
Interesting. I wonder if the sector influences that. I've never seen men hit on women coworkers at happy hours. I Actually had a woman coworker start talking about going to a strip club after one and taking a bunch of other men and women there and inviting me too. I have to say, that wasn't something I was expecting (I was only there a year at that point). I'm in finance IT. I haven't noticed it in the office either. That said, I wouldn't be surprised if it happens on a small scale. I've had 2 women say... "stuff"... to me in the office before.
kache_ 5y ago
Do people actually drink at work events? I just keep on adding ice to my drink and pretend so I don't look out of place Work events are work :P just a different kind of work
- munk-a 5y ago
  Yea, ditto. I need to be in the office with these folks tomorrow so I tend to be very conservative with consumption at work events. I don't want to burn the accumulated good will from the workplace by being an asshat one evening.
- s1artibartfast 5y ago
  Depends on company culture. In some places, people really let their guard down and get loose with their co-workers.
- Blackstone4 5y ago
  I dont know bro. it really depends on where I work. I agree that in some places that yes it was work work but at others it was a way of letting our guards down and coming together as a team. This helped relationships in the office since we were all drinking together...albeit this tended to be with select individuals (i.e. we would avoid invite those who were too serious). After a few drinks, we would debate work topics and right the wrongs of the world. In some companies, this is where the wheels are set in motion and opens up new channels of communication. Drinking together creates some kind of bond. I do have a policy of not sleeping with anyone from work so that helped me have good boundaries and avoided trouble..

Karunamon 5y ago

This is a sexist comment and could be career-ending if made by someone of the opposite sex. For a demonstration why: "The problem is that (class of people that encompasses billions of unrelated individuals worldwide) start (any kind of negative action in particular)" No matter what you fill those variables with, it remains a broad, harmful generalization. I'm sorry you had to work with unprofessional assholes that won't take 'no' for an answer, but your experience is not license to slander literally half of the planet.

will4274 5y ago
I feel very ambivalent about your comment. Parents comment is sexist and you are absolutely correct in saying that men can and are fired at some workplaces for making similar comments that generalize women. On the other hand, parents comment is also true. I'm a man btw.
throwaway675309 5y ago
Yep, likely wasn't intentional, but that person's statement does have the air of, "they are INSERT_CLASS, so it's in their nature"...
Supermancho 5y ago
> As a woman in tech, the problem is that men start hitting on you when they’ve had a few beers. > I'm sorry you had to work with unprofessional assholes that won't take 'no' for an answer, but your experience is not license to slander literally half of the planet. You've broadened the original statement to say more than was commented. The original did not say "all men" or even "only men". Quite the disingenuous interpretation turned around to try to make up a controversy.
- Karunamon 5y ago
  >the problem is that men... >the problem is that women... Not one sentence beginning this way in this context will ever be anything other than a sexist generalization. That was the point being made, and I stand by it.
  - taurath 5y ago
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NotAllMen https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NotAllMen Please educate yourself on how this shuts down debate over intolerant behavior. The tolerance of other men is required for activity like this - and /obviously/ there are many men who find this behavior awful but also clearly /not enough/ to stop it from happening. Yes, of course, not all men do this shit. But it’s enough to have a considerable impact on people. Usually there’s a small number of abusers and then a large group of people tolerating or egging on the abuse. This is why they’re describing a “frat bro” culture in the legal suit.
    - Karunamon 5y ago
      Here, sure. We're describing concrete allegations against specific people. However, mentioning a class of people without qualification colloquially means 'all', and would not be tolerated or seen as anything other than an ignorant, discriminatory, prejudicial comment in any other context. Tarring an entire sex as having any problem in particular is disgusting. The article you linked even includes the following quote: If we genuinely oppose prejudice on the grounds of identity, rather than seek to elevate certain identities and disparage others, there is no shame and much worth in pointing out when negative stereotypes are applied to men. The original comment could have been made without the generalization and would have carried just as much weight. The fact that your last paragraph begins with "of course.." is proof that you recognize that this is an inaccurate generalization. Let's have less of that. That's what I'm asking for.
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
      - 5y ago

giantg2 5y ago

Interesting. I wonder if the sector influences that. I've never seen men hit on women coworkers at happy hours. I Actually had a woman coworker start talking about going to a strip club after one and taking a bunch of other men and women there and inviting me too. I have to say, that wasn't something I was expecting (I was only there a year at that point). I'm in finance IT. I haven't noticed it in the office either. That said, I wouldn't be surprised if it happens on a small scale. I've had 2 women say... "stuff"... to me in the office before.

kache_ 5y ago

Do people actually drink at work events? I just keep on adding ice to my drink and pretend so I don't look out of place Work events are work :P just a different kind of work

munk-a 5y ago
Yea, ditto. I need to be in the office with these folks tomorrow so I tend to be very conservative with consumption at work events. I don't want to burn the accumulated good will from the workplace by being an asshat one evening.
s1artibartfast 5y ago
Depends on company culture. In some places, people really let their guard down and get loose with their co-workers.
Blackstone4 5y ago
I dont know bro. it really depends on where I work. I agree that in some places that yes it was work work but at others it was a way of letting our guards down and coming together as a team. This helped relationships in the office since we were all drinking together...albeit this tended to be with select individuals (i.e. we would avoid invite those who were too serious). After a few drinks, we would debate work topics and right the wrongs of the world. In some companies, this is where the wheels are set in motion and opens up new channels of communication. Drinking together creates some kind of bond. I do have a policy of not sleeping with anyone from work so that helped me have good boundaries and avoided trouble..