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So early 2020, I launched Rithm, an app that helps you build habits, reach your goals and stay motivated. The 1st version was a chatbot app, think of it like a

So early 2020, I launched Rithm, an app that helps you build habits, reach your goals and stay motivated. The 1st version was a chatbot app, think of it like an accountability coach that you text with to track habits and stay accountable. Rithm landed as the #4 product of the day on ProductHunt, had some good initial traction which proceeded to fall off a cliff. Here are the 8 lessons for a failed version 1, see video and blog post. Hope this helps some makers out there!

OJFord 5y ago
Just a minor copy note: > There are a million and 1 habit and goal apps out there and I made the mistake to think that just because there are a lot of products in this space, doesn’t mean that there is a lot of businesses in that space. I think you were thinking of two different ways to phrase that, mixed them up, and the result is that it says the opposite? As in, either remove 'I made the mistake to think that', or 'doesn't mean that'.
- kylebolt 5y ago
  Good spot, thank you!
somenewaccount1 5y ago
Looks like you are still working on learning distribution. I'm typing on a mac, but own an android. i still can't use or try your app :(
- kylebolt 5y ago
  I thought failing on 1 platform would be more economical than failing on 2 :)
  - allenu 5y ago
    For mobile apps, if you're a single developer, I think going with a single platform is fine. You can only do so much, and if you're familiar with the platform, you can move much more quickly than having to support two. That's the strategy I've chosen and it's helped a lot because I was already an expert in iOS and a lot of the work is just "figuring out what users want" and it's easier to change your code on a single platform that you know really well.
  - somenewaccount1 5y ago
    Then.....extending distribution wasn't really a problem or lesson learned. It's a nice to have.
    - kylebolt 5y ago
      Yes, no point in more distribution when users were not retaining. Although, it was hard to even get those first few thousand users to try the product.
- drewolbrich 5y ago
  At least for this particular flavor of app, building an Android version is an optimization that should be made once the product has been proven successful. Until that happens, it would be a huge waste of time and money for the developer to build an Android version, since it too would fail as a product, just like the iOS version. Multiplying 0 by 2 is still 0. The situation might be different for an app whose success depended on the user's ability to use the app to communicate with all of their friends, some of which had Android phones.
  - throwawayboise 5y ago
    Why not build something like this cross-platform? The functionality sounds simple enough that you don't really need a native app for each platform.
    - realusername 5y ago
      Even when using about cross-platform frameworks, there's quirks, store pages and time to invest to maintain the other platform. My Flutter app is still not available on iOS for example.
    - allenu 5y ago
      It seems like it would be simple enough, but it's death by a thousand cuts. Supporting Android means having to keep track of even more screen sizes, OS versions, updates, app store releases and so on. It just adds on more and more. For one developer who is trying to prove out an idea, the work to support the app on multiple platforms just eats up your time and focus when you really should be focusing on features and adjusting what the product is as you get more info from your existing customers. There are of course frameworks out there to help you build one codebase for multiple platforms, but if you go down that route, if you aren't familiar with the framework, you have to learn it. There are going to be quirks in them that you're not aware of. Maybe framework version X only works with iOS version Y and Android version Z. It just goes on and on. Frameworks aren't perfect either, and things don't work exactly the same across platforms even with the framework.
- somenewaccount1 5y ago
  aaaaaahhhh.... negative 4 points for actually reading the article/watching the video, and being accurate. hacker news blowing steve jobs as usual. that's the type of exclusionary behavior i like to see!
- somenewaccount1 5y ago
  aaaaaahhhh.... negative 4 points for actually reading the article/watching the video, and being accurate. hacker news blowing steve jobs as usual. that's the type of exclusionary behavior i like to see! if anyone payed attention - i even own an mac AND HIS APP DOES NOT WORK ON IT. That barely requires a frigin flag to compile and distribute for, it doesn't even take extra work. But fuck me, right?
pacman2 5y ago
You app with the chatbot is a bad nightmare. I would never use something like it. Combine a Tamagotchi with your app, have the user "feed" them with his "habbits". At least you would combine two things. With the chat bot? Move on.

OJFord 5y ago

Just a minor copy note: > There are a million and 1 habit and goal apps out there and I made the mistake to think that just because there are a lot of products in this space, doesn’t mean that there is a lot of businesses in that space. I think you were thinking of two different ways to phrase that, mixed them up, and the result is that it says the opposite? As in, either remove 'I made the mistake to think that', or 'doesn't mean that'.

kylebolt 5y ago
Good spot, thank you!

somenewaccount1 5y ago

Looks like you are still working on learning distribution. I'm typing on a mac, but own an android. i still can't use or try your app :(

kylebolt 5y ago
I thought failing on 1 platform would be more economical than failing on 2 :)
- allenu 5y ago
  For mobile apps, if you're a single developer, I think going with a single platform is fine. You can only do so much, and if you're familiar with the platform, you can move much more quickly than having to support two. That's the strategy I've chosen and it's helped a lot because I was already an expert in iOS and a lot of the work is just "figuring out what users want" and it's easier to change your code on a single platform that you know really well.
- somenewaccount1 5y ago
  Then.....extending distribution wasn't really a problem or lesson learned. It's a nice to have.
  - kylebolt 5y ago
    Yes, no point in more distribution when users were not retaining. Although, it was hard to even get those first few thousand users to try the product.
drewolbrich 5y ago
At least for this particular flavor of app, building an Android version is an optimization that should be made once the product has been proven successful. Until that happens, it would be a huge waste of time and money for the developer to build an Android version, since it too would fail as a product, just like the iOS version. Multiplying 0 by 2 is still 0. The situation might be different for an app whose success depended on the user's ability to use the app to communicate with all of their friends, some of which had Android phones.
- throwawayboise 5y ago
  Why not build something like this cross-platform? The functionality sounds simple enough that you don't really need a native app for each platform.
  - realusername 5y ago
    Even when using about cross-platform frameworks, there's quirks, store pages and time to invest to maintain the other platform. My Flutter app is still not available on iOS for example.
  - allenu 5y ago
    It seems like it would be simple enough, but it's death by a thousand cuts. Supporting Android means having to keep track of even more screen sizes, OS versions, updates, app store releases and so on. It just adds on more and more. For one developer who is trying to prove out an idea, the work to support the app on multiple platforms just eats up your time and focus when you really should be focusing on features and adjusting what the product is as you get more info from your existing customers. There are of course frameworks out there to help you build one codebase for multiple platforms, but if you go down that route, if you aren't familiar with the framework, you have to learn it. There are going to be quirks in them that you're not aware of. Maybe framework version X only works with iOS version Y and Android version Z. It just goes on and on. Frameworks aren't perfect either, and things don't work exactly the same across platforms even with the framework.
somenewaccount1 5y ago
aaaaaahhhh.... negative 4 points for actually reading the article/watching the video, and being accurate. hacker news blowing steve jobs as usual. that's the type of exclusionary behavior i like to see!
somenewaccount1 5y ago
aaaaaahhhh.... negative 4 points for actually reading the article/watching the video, and being accurate. hacker news blowing steve jobs as usual. that's the type of exclusionary behavior i like to see! if anyone payed attention - i even own an mac AND HIS APP DOES NOT WORK ON IT. That barely requires a frigin flag to compile and distribute for, it doesn't even take extra work. But fuck me, right?

pacman2 5y ago

You app with the chatbot is a bad nightmare. I would never use something like it. Combine a Tamagotchi with your app, have the user "feed" them with his "habbits". At least you would combine two things. With the chat bot? Move on.