6 ms·

Everything you need to know about Covid-19 vaccines

25 points by sohkamyung 5y ago

ggm 5y ago
Everything you need to know about Covid-19 vaccines Which can be found by the authors. But, for the ones we can't find any information which actually we're all fascinated in, like Sputnik or the Chinese vaccines, or the Cuban vaccine, bupkes. Oddly, nothing about Johnson & Johnson, the only single dose design I know about. Absence of information leads to presence of .. assumptions. Like, "they're all bad" which is far from the truth: They have different qualities of test, but they're not nothing. Also no mention of Covax, or the sub-strains of the Oxford Vaccine now made by CSL in Australia, but (regrettably) not yet recognized by many EU economies as a "valid" treatment despite being immunologically identical to the sources used in Europe. This kind of petty beaurocracy is causing real pain to individuals seeking to travel. Also, nothing about vaccine mixtures. And, a lack of clarity about the emerging need of a third topup. Vaccine mixtures might elucidate a stronger response than just AZ twice (for instance) so this could mean MORE people getting higher immunity, if a mixture was used.
- hnzix 5y ago
  AZ followed by Pfizer is now encouraged in Oz by GPs for people who had an initial AZ shot before Pfizer was more widely available.
  - adrianN 5y ago
    Same in Germany.
    - gnabgib 5y ago
      And Canada, UK
  - ggm 5y ago
    ATAGI held off saying they approved of this AFAIK. If this is true, I wish it was widespread and recommended because I am due my second AZ in 5 weeks time and I would LOVE pfizer, but I suspect in Qld I will be told "nope"
    - hnzix 5y ago
      I've heard QLD has low supplies of Pfizer in many locations, you might be able to try different clinics to get some.
- drukenemo 5y ago
  I know I’m not addressing the article , but the comment above and many others on this topic. I’m still surprised by the blank check this community generally gives to big pharma and governments, seeing their track records. It’s not that I expect an anti (COVID-19) vaccine attitude, but I would have expected to see here a more questioning tone more regularly, as I see how strongly voiced HN can be with other topics. For example: discussion of their fast development time vs safety, VAERS stats, vaccination of children and pregnant women, real-world efficacy and the fact that these vaccines are under experimental usage up to 2023 or so. All I’m saying is that I’d expect to see less consensus here on not touching these matters.
  - Santosh83 5y ago
    People are strongly voiced and logical until their very life (or way of life) is on the table (or even just the whipped up perception of it being so). Then they retreat into a shell of conformity and xenophobia. We see this over and over again.
  - ggm 5y ago
    How many doses worldwide, how many reported incidents. It's that simple. If you think some at-scale public disaster is impending, Can you explain what you think it is, beyond skepticism it might exist and we're not adequately cautious?
    - ghoward 5y ago
      That's just it: we are not adequately cautious. Who knows what the long-term side effects of the vaccines will be? The fact that those concerns are hand-waved away makes me more concerned. I mean, I don't trust Big Pharma, but at the very least, the FDA stood in their way. This time, the FDA gave them a pass called "Emergency Use Authorization," and that worries me.
      - zarzavat 5y ago
        Covid has long term effects too, seemingly much more than vaccines. Were this not the case then yes the calculus for younger people would be very different. But it seems that everybody benefits.
- robbiep 5y ago
  As I understand it, COVAX is the WHO program name for distribution of vaccines to developing countries, and will potentially include all vaccines, unless you have other information?
  - ggm 5y ago
    So.. that would include the vaccines I mentioned, not listed here.
    - robbiep 5y ago
      You phrased COVAX as though it was a vaccine in itself, rather than a program, and it is not at all clear that was your intention
      - ggm 5y ago
        I am sorry I wasn't clearer. I meant, what about ALL the vaccines directed into covax which will at end, affect more of the world than the supset used in eurine and the US
- kenny11 5y ago
  The Johnson & Johnson vaccine is covered in the article under "Janssen", the J&J subsidiary that developed it.
  - ggm 5y ago
    Ah. Thanks! I didn't understand that. But nothing on Sputnik or the ?three? chinese vax or the Cuban one.
- gnabgib 5y ago
  This looks like a British publication, not a world-wide fact sheet. As another commenter as noted, J&J is the company, their vaccine is called Janssen which is covered (but maybe not administered in the UK) [0] Oxford/AstraZeneca is licensed/sold under several other brand names [1] including Covishield and Vaxzevria but so far the brands are used interchangeably (as long as the batch wasn't bad.. this makes sense, no?) Given this is British, the other brand names aren't particularly relevant to their population (they got the original). Covax, as far as I can tell, is a programme to deliver Oxford/AstraZeneca vaccines (no matter the brand).. perhaps you meant Covaxin (an India developed vaccine)? Vaccine mixtures haven't been explored much (this would mean restarting the trails again mixing and matching, which is tricky given people are either completely against, or want the vaccines yesterday).. but the WHO has cautioned against [2]. Never the less several countries are mixing.. we'll see the results as they play out. Oxford(!) did find that mixing AstraZeneca + Pfizer was more effective than double AstraZeneca [3] [0]: https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/janssen.html https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different... [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxford%E2%80%93AstraZeneca_COVID-19_vaccine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxford%E2%80%93AstraZeneca_COV... [2]: https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/who-warns-against-mixing-covid-vaccines-here-s-what-we-know-so-far/ar-AAM7xm3 https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/who-warns-against-m... [3]: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/study-shows-mixing-astrazeneca-and-pfizer-vaccines-generates-strong-immune-response-against-covid-19/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/study-shows-mixing-astrazeneca-...
- jacquesm 5y ago
  I think this covers 'Janssen': https://pharmaceutical-journal.com/article/feature/everything-you-need-to-know-about-covid-19-vaccines#h-adenoviral-vector-vaccines https://pharmaceutical-journal.com/article/feature/everythin...
flocial 5y ago
It’s crazy how we’re expected to cope with myocarditis, blood clots, other mystery symptoms and even death by participating in a large scale clinical trial for experimental gene therapy. The shot is usually free or cheap but god forbid you end up one of the unlucky ones with ruined health and expensive medical bills with no one to sue or take responsibility but yourself. You’ll most likely get censored on social media and gas lighted by health care providers if you speak out too. All this for the greater good of society?
- hrkipp 5y ago
  https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brandolini%27s_law https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brandolini%27s_law
- guywhocodes 5y ago
  I got pericarditis, I'm expected to make a full recovery and the gas lightning is probably the worst part of it. Lost a couple of friends to it, "maybe it's just anxiety". EDIT: I've been diagnosed, all my doctors agree, still: "maybe it's just anxiety".
  - flocial 5y ago
    We have an environment of fear and denial about these adverse effects. Many people like you are afraid or weary of sharing experiences because of personal attacks, gaslighting, and censorship. There isn’t adequate informed consent. Btw you might want to look into mitochondrial supplements, N -acetylcysteine (NAC), zinc, vit D, even ivermectin, etc. Look at the literature and make your own decisions. There are lots of good supplements that could help manage symptoms with safety.
- avalys 5y ago
  The alternative is to participate in the more ad-hoc yet even larger-scale clinical trial for an objectively dangerous virus of unknown (possibly artificial) origin, with its own profile of unpleasant side effects and potential long term sequelae even if you survive. No one is saying this is an ideal situation! The vaccine is merely the best of the options, all of them bad.
josh_today 5y ago
Serious question: Is going straight to a vaccine the typical route for new infectious diseases? Are treatments the equivalent of a Z Pack or Tamiflu more challenging to develop?
- arrosenberg 5y ago
  The COVID vaccine is pretty specific to the infection mechanism the virus uses. Azithromycin is a general purpose antibiotic that will kill most bacteria that aren't specifically resistant to it. Definitely more complex to develop - antibiotics can be found in the dirt, mRNA designer vaccines can not. However, the effort that went into the COVID vaccine is akin to a moonshot for the mRNA tech. Costs should come down and the number of ways it's deployed should go up, hopefully both of those will drive further innovation. It really comes down to cost-benefit. Cancer and global pandemics, yes. Designer drugs for minor inconveniences, probably not in the near future.
- wiml 5y ago
  Antivirals are a relatively new development. Historically, your only options for most viral diseases have been supportive care (keep you comfortable or at least alive while your body fights off the infection), vaccination, and of course prevention (hygiene, quarantine, and so on).
- rsynnott 5y ago
  The first licensed flu vaccine became available in the 40s; tamiflu in 1999. And realistically, if we had an antiviral that was as effective against covid as tamiflu is against flu, that… would not be very interesting and we’d still be vaccinating everyone. Antivirals are difficult and slow to develop, relatively new tech, and often not particularly good.
gtm1260 5y ago
Does anyone know how the number of times you are exposed to the Covid 19 virus affects the efficacy statistics?
NiceWayToDoIT 5y ago
Uk population is around 67 million (3 doses would be 210m) does anyone know why is the order 517 million vaccine in total? Are those orders by UK or orders to company producing vaccines?
- fsh 5y ago
  It was not clear which vaccine development projects would succeed and which would not. For a reasonably wealthy country, the cost of the vaccine doses is completely negligible compared to the cost of the pandemic. This is why it made sense to massively overpurchase doses.
  - NiceWayToDoIT 5y ago
    Thanks, I was curious to check : Pfizer-BioNTech $19.50 per dose Moderna $25-$37 per dose AstraZeneca $3-4 (U.S.) in the UK and U.S Johnson & Johnson $10 per dose Sputnik V Vaccine $10 per dose Sinovac Biotech $60 per dose in China ($29.75 per dose) https://www.biospace.com/article/comparing-covid-19-vaccines-pfizer-biontech-moderna-astrazeneca-oxford-j-and-j-russia-s-sputnik-v/ https://www.biospace.com/article/comparing-covid-19-vaccines...
    - NiceWayToDoIT 5y ago
      Interesting enough testes are ranging from £50-250 and usually u need few, even self-test kits have similar range. I wonder is there a way to have a really cheap tests (£3-5) ? I guess it would be interesting to find out PCR test cost break down.
      - fsh 5y ago
        Rapid antigen test kits have reached retail prices well below 1€ now. They probably cost cents to produce. I guess a significant factor in the cost of PCR tests are the thermocyclers and the lab staff. Not nearly as easy to scale as rapid test kits.
        5y ago
kaskakokos 5y ago
This is the EudraVigilance web [1]: European database of suspected adverse drug reaction reports. On this website you can view data on suspected drugs side-effects, COVID vaccines included. This is the Med Alerts web [2]: The U.S. Government database incidents of adverse health events that follow the administration of a vaccine. [1] https://www.adrreports.eu/en/index.html https://www.adrreports.eu/en/index.html [2] https://medalerts.org/vaersdb/findfield.php?TABLE=ON&GROUP1=CAT&EVENTS=ON&VAX=COVID19 https://medalerts.org/vaersdb/findfield.php?TABLE=ON&GROUP1=...
- fsh 5y ago
  Pretty much any possible medical problem has a non-zero background rate in the population. When you vaccinate hundreds of millions of people, you probably sample all of those at least once. One needs to do a proper statistical analysis to determine if there is any causal link to the vaccination.
  - kaskakokos 5y ago
    I agree with you, and with all this uncertainty, does anyone know if: Covid-associated problems > Vaccine-associated problems? I imagine that this is not so easy, probably we can split the response by age, previous medical issues, etc. An also I am sure that Covid-associated problems (including dead) have been decreasing since it was first discovered in humans. So, which is the status?
    - fsh 5y ago
      The clinical studies clearly show that the benefit from getting the vaccine outweighs the possible risks. Otherwise the regulatory agencies would not have approved them. Why don't you simply look up the reports from the approval agency of your choice if you want to know the details?
      - kaskakokos 5y ago
        I am not sure that this is accurate. For me it is like a coin: - One side shows the benefits of the vaccine, and let's not forget that this side is promoted by the vaccine sellers. No problem with that, they do their job, in a few months we will see a 3rd and 4th dose being promoted to ensure immunity. - The other side shows the cons of the vaccine, but as you said it is not sufficiently studied. It seems to me insufficient to make decisions.
taxicabjesus 5y ago
Maybe you all can help me out. For someone who's not yet vaccinated, what's the point? 1. We now know that most of the carnage of February/March/April 2020 had to do with the aggressive use of ventilators. Once doctors stopped ventilating the majority of their patients, survival became the likely outcome of a SARS-CoV-2 infection. 2. We now know that severe COVID-19 is basically a Serotonin Syndrome (without the customary drug trigger), whereby plasma levels of serotonin becomes elevated, platelets release cluster-bombs of serotonin in the lungs, and lungs damaged by the bacterial/viral infections aren't able to remove excess serotonin from the blood. [0], for example. 3. Serotonin Syndrome is easily controlled with the anti-serotonin drug Cyproheptadine, and other similar substances [0]. 4. We know that lungs are damaged by pure oxygen, and that 5% CO2 completely alleviates the problem of #OxygenToxicity. 5. We now know that severe COVID-19 is likely a post-viral auto-immune condition [1]. 6. Most cases of severe viral lung infections also have concomitant bacterial infections such as tuberculosis [2]. Treating the concomitant bacterial infection is easier, more important and more effective than treating viral infections. 7. People who are already immune due to natural infection display robust immunity already, and have little-to-no potential for benefit from a vaccine jab. 8. While vaccination may be somewhat protective against SARS-CoV-2, it does not improve the population's overall health levels. Malnourished people will still be malnourished and vulnerable to other infections, or "breakthrough infections", due to their Vitamin B-1 deficiency, Zinc deficiency, etc. We know how to successfully treat severe COVID-19 cases (though most doctors are not yet aware of 'best practices'). A vast number of people already benefit from natural immunity to SARS-Cov-2. Old people do not benefit from flu vaccine [3], and probably won't benefit during the coming winter season from their COVID-19 vaccines either. What's the point of promoting vaccines, when we now have any number of cost-effective health-improving interventions that will prevent almost all of the not-yet-immune from dying from COVID-19 (save those who are statistically likely to die in the coming year anyways)? [0] Unprovoked serotonin syndrome-like presentation of SARS-CoV-2 infection: A small case series - https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/2050313X211032089 https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/2050313X211032... [1] "Our study explaining the pathophysiology of acute COVID has been published by ERJ, the flagship scientific journal of the European Respiratory Society @ERSpublications. Here, we describe how severe COVID-19 is NOT a viral pneumonia, but a post-viral autoimmune attack of the lung. -- https://twitter.com/DaveLeeERMD/status/1413816137570205697 https://twitter.com/DaveLeeERMD/status/1413816137570205697 [2] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3948857/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3948857/ [3] Turning 65 was associated with a statistically and clinically significant increase in rate of seasonal influenza vaccination. However, no evidence indicated that vaccination reduced hospitalizations or mortality among elderly persons. The estimates were precise enough to rule out results from many previous studies. - https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32120383/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32120383/
Archelaos 5y ago
The title of the article completely devalues it in my eyes. How does the author know that the reader does not want to know something else? This seems to me to be a very paternalistic attitude. What is not discussed at all, for example, are cross-vaccinations with different vaccines, e.g. AstraZeneca + mRNA.
- nprateem 5y ago
  I think they assume you're not autistic
- kaskakokos 5y ago
  Agree. I need to know a lot of additional things about Covid. Indeed it seems to me like the article is quite superficial. A lot of people here is doing smart questions that the article does not response.
raxxorrax 5y ago
This should be labeled as misinformation just out of spite. And it is, it lacks information and no doctor would accept this as a consultation. So flag happy Google should label it as misinformation.

25 points by sohkamyung 5y ago

ggm 5y ago

Everything you need to know about Covid-19 vaccines Which can be found by the authors. But, for the ones we can't find any information which actually we're all fascinated in, like Sputnik or the Chinese vaccines, or the Cuban vaccine, bupkes. Oddly, nothing about Johnson & Johnson, the only single dose design I know about. Absence of information leads to presence of .. assumptions. Like, "they're all bad" which is far from the truth: They have different qualities of test, but they're not nothing. Also no mention of Covax, or the sub-strains of the Oxford Vaccine now made by CSL in Australia, but (regrettably) not yet recognized by many EU economies as a "valid" treatment despite being immunologically identical to the sources used in Europe. This kind of petty beaurocracy is causing real pain to individuals seeking to travel. Also, nothing about vaccine mixtures. And, a lack of clarity about the emerging need of a third topup. Vaccine mixtures might elucidate a stronger response than just AZ twice (for instance) so this could mean MORE people getting higher immunity, if a mixture was used.

hnzix 5y ago
AZ followed by Pfizer is now encouraged in Oz by GPs for people who had an initial AZ shot before Pfizer was more widely available.
- adrianN 5y ago
  Same in Germany.
  - gnabgib 5y ago
    And Canada, UK
- ggm 5y ago
  ATAGI held off saying they approved of this AFAIK. If this is true, I wish it was widespread and recommended because I am due my second AZ in 5 weeks time and I would LOVE pfizer, but I suspect in Qld I will be told "nope"
  - hnzix 5y ago
    I've heard QLD has low supplies of Pfizer in many locations, you might be able to try different clinics to get some.
drukenemo 5y ago
I know I’m not addressing the article , but the comment above and many others on this topic. I’m still surprised by the blank check this community generally gives to big pharma and governments, seeing their track records. It’s not that I expect an anti (COVID-19) vaccine attitude, but I would have expected to see here a more questioning tone more regularly, as I see how strongly voiced HN can be with other topics. For example: discussion of their fast development time vs safety, VAERS stats, vaccination of children and pregnant women, real-world efficacy and the fact that these vaccines are under experimental usage up to 2023 or so. All I’m saying is that I’d expect to see less consensus here on not touching these matters.
- Santosh83 5y ago
  People are strongly voiced and logical until their very life (or way of life) is on the table (or even just the whipped up perception of it being so). Then they retreat into a shell of conformity and xenophobia. We see this over and over again.
- ggm 5y ago
  How many doses worldwide, how many reported incidents. It's that simple. If you think some at-scale public disaster is impending, Can you explain what you think it is, beyond skepticism it might exist and we're not adequately cautious?
  - ghoward 5y ago
    That's just it: we are not adequately cautious. Who knows what the long-term side effects of the vaccines will be? The fact that those concerns are hand-waved away makes me more concerned. I mean, I don't trust Big Pharma, but at the very least, the FDA stood in their way. This time, the FDA gave them a pass called "Emergency Use Authorization," and that worries me.
    - zarzavat 5y ago
      Covid has long term effects too, seemingly much more than vaccines. Were this not the case then yes the calculus for younger people would be very different. But it seems that everybody benefits.
robbiep 5y ago
As I understand it, COVAX is the WHO program name for distribution of vaccines to developing countries, and will potentially include all vaccines, unless you have other information?
- ggm 5y ago
  So.. that would include the vaccines I mentioned, not listed here.
  - robbiep 5y ago
    You phrased COVAX as though it was a vaccine in itself, rather than a program, and it is not at all clear that was your intention
    - ggm 5y ago
      I am sorry I wasn't clearer. I meant, what about ALL the vaccines directed into covax which will at end, affect more of the world than the supset used in eurine and the US
kenny11 5y ago
The Johnson & Johnson vaccine is covered in the article under "Janssen", the J&J subsidiary that developed it.
- ggm 5y ago
  Ah. Thanks! I didn't understand that. But nothing on Sputnik or the ?three? chinese vax or the Cuban one.
gnabgib 5y ago
This looks like a British publication, not a world-wide fact sheet. As another commenter as noted, J&J is the company, their vaccine is called Janssen which is covered (but maybe not administered in the UK) [0] Oxford/AstraZeneca is licensed/sold under several other brand names [1] including Covishield and Vaxzevria but so far the brands are used interchangeably (as long as the batch wasn't bad.. this makes sense, no?) Given this is British, the other brand names aren't particularly relevant to their population (they got the original). Covax, as far as I can tell, is a programme to deliver Oxford/AstraZeneca vaccines (no matter the brand).. perhaps you meant Covaxin (an India developed vaccine)? Vaccine mixtures haven't been explored much (this would mean restarting the trails again mixing and matching, which is tricky given people are either completely against, or want the vaccines yesterday).. but the WHO has cautioned against [2]. Never the less several countries are mixing.. we'll see the results as they play out. Oxford(!) did find that mixing AstraZeneca + Pfizer was more effective than double AstraZeneca [3] [0]: https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/janssen.html https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different... [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxford%E2%80%93AstraZeneca_COVID-19_vaccine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxford%E2%80%93AstraZeneca_COV... [2]: https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/who-warns-against-mixing-covid-vaccines-here-s-what-we-know-so-far/ar-AAM7xm3 https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/who-warns-against-m... [3]: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/study-shows-mixing-astrazeneca-and-pfizer-vaccines-generates-strong-immune-response-against-covid-19/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/study-shows-mixing-astrazeneca-...
jacquesm 5y ago
I think this covers 'Janssen': https://pharmaceutical-journal.com/article/feature/everything-you-need-to-know-about-covid-19-vaccines#h-adenoviral-vector-vaccines https://pharmaceutical-journal.com/article/feature/everythin...

flocial 5y ago

It’s crazy how we’re expected to cope with myocarditis, blood clots, other mystery symptoms and even death by participating in a large scale clinical trial for experimental gene therapy. The shot is usually free or cheap but god forbid you end up one of the unlucky ones with ruined health and expensive medical bills with no one to sue or take responsibility but yourself. You’ll most likely get censored on social media and gas lighted by health care providers if you speak out too. All this for the greater good of society?

hrkipp 5y ago
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brandolini%27s_law https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brandolini%27s_law
guywhocodes 5y ago
I got pericarditis, I'm expected to make a full recovery and the gas lightning is probably the worst part of it. Lost a couple of friends to it, "maybe it's just anxiety". EDIT: I've been diagnosed, all my doctors agree, still: "maybe it's just anxiety".
- flocial 5y ago
  We have an environment of fear and denial about these adverse effects. Many people like you are afraid or weary of sharing experiences because of personal attacks, gaslighting, and censorship. There isn’t adequate informed consent. Btw you might want to look into mitochondrial supplements, N -acetylcysteine (NAC), zinc, vit D, even ivermectin, etc. Look at the literature and make your own decisions. There are lots of good supplements that could help manage symptoms with safety.
avalys 5y ago
The alternative is to participate in the more ad-hoc yet even larger-scale clinical trial for an objectively dangerous virus of unknown (possibly artificial) origin, with its own profile of unpleasant side effects and potential long term sequelae even if you survive. No one is saying this is an ideal situation! The vaccine is merely the best of the options, all of them bad.

josh_today 5y ago

Serious question: Is going straight to a vaccine the typical route for new infectious diseases? Are treatments the equivalent of a Z Pack or Tamiflu more challenging to develop?

arrosenberg 5y ago
The COVID vaccine is pretty specific to the infection mechanism the virus uses. Azithromycin is a general purpose antibiotic that will kill most bacteria that aren't specifically resistant to it. Definitely more complex to develop - antibiotics can be found in the dirt, mRNA designer vaccines can not. However, the effort that went into the COVID vaccine is akin to a moonshot for the mRNA tech. Costs should come down and the number of ways it's deployed should go up, hopefully both of those will drive further innovation. It really comes down to cost-benefit. Cancer and global pandemics, yes. Designer drugs for minor inconveniences, probably not in the near future.
wiml 5y ago
Antivirals are a relatively new development. Historically, your only options for most viral diseases have been supportive care (keep you comfortable or at least alive while your body fights off the infection), vaccination, and of course prevention (hygiene, quarantine, and so on).
rsynnott 5y ago
The first licensed flu vaccine became available in the 40s; tamiflu in 1999. And realistically, if we had an antiviral that was as effective against covid as tamiflu is against flu, that… would not be very interesting and we’d still be vaccinating everyone. Antivirals are difficult and slow to develop, relatively new tech, and often not particularly good.

gtm1260 5y ago

Does anyone know how the number of times you are exposed to the Covid 19 virus affects the efficacy statistics?

NiceWayToDoIT 5y ago

Uk population is around 67 million (3 doses would be 210m) does anyone know why is the order 517 million vaccine in total? Are those orders by UK or orders to company producing vaccines?

fsh 5y ago
It was not clear which vaccine development projects would succeed and which would not. For a reasonably wealthy country, the cost of the vaccine doses is completely negligible compared to the cost of the pandemic. This is why it made sense to massively overpurchase doses.
- NiceWayToDoIT 5y ago
  Thanks, I was curious to check : Pfizer-BioNTech $19.50 per dose Moderna $25-$37 per dose AstraZeneca $3-4 (U.S.) in the UK and U.S Johnson & Johnson $10 per dose Sputnik V Vaccine $10 per dose Sinovac Biotech $60 per dose in China ($29.75 per dose) https://www.biospace.com/article/comparing-covid-19-vaccines-pfizer-biontech-moderna-astrazeneca-oxford-j-and-j-russia-s-sputnik-v/ https://www.biospace.com/article/comparing-covid-19-vaccines...
  - NiceWayToDoIT 5y ago
    Interesting enough testes are ranging from £50-250 and usually u need few, even self-test kits have similar range. I wonder is there a way to have a really cheap tests (£3-5) ? I guess it would be interesting to find out PCR test cost break down.
    - fsh 5y ago
      Rapid antigen test kits have reached retail prices well below 1€ now. They probably cost cents to produce. I guess a significant factor in the cost of PCR tests are the thermocyclers and the lab staff. Not nearly as easy to scale as rapid test kits.
      - 5y ago

kaskakokos 5y ago

This is the EudraVigilance web [1]: European database of suspected adverse drug reaction reports. On this website you can view data on suspected drugs side-effects, COVID vaccines included. This is the Med Alerts web [2]: The U.S. Government database incidents of adverse health events that follow the administration of a vaccine. [1] https://www.adrreports.eu/en/index.html https://www.adrreports.eu/en/index.html [2] https://medalerts.org/vaersdb/findfield.php?TABLE=ON&GROUP1=CAT&EVENTS=ON&VAX=COVID19 https://medalerts.org/vaersdb/findfield.php?TABLE=ON&GROUP1=...

fsh 5y ago
Pretty much any possible medical problem has a non-zero background rate in the population. When you vaccinate hundreds of millions of people, you probably sample all of those at least once. One needs to do a proper statistical analysis to determine if there is any causal link to the vaccination.
- kaskakokos 5y ago
  I agree with you, and with all this uncertainty, does anyone know if: Covid-associated problems > Vaccine-associated problems? I imagine that this is not so easy, probably we can split the response by age, previous medical issues, etc. An also I am sure that Covid-associated problems (including dead) have been decreasing since it was first discovered in humans. So, which is the status?
  - fsh 5y ago
    The clinical studies clearly show that the benefit from getting the vaccine outweighs the possible risks. Otherwise the regulatory agencies would not have approved them. Why don't you simply look up the reports from the approval agency of your choice if you want to know the details?
    - kaskakokos 5y ago
      I am not sure that this is accurate. For me it is like a coin: - One side shows the benefits of the vaccine, and let's not forget that this side is promoted by the vaccine sellers. No problem with that, they do their job, in a few months we will see a 3rd and 4th dose being promoted to ensure immunity. - The other side shows the cons of the vaccine, but as you said it is not sufficiently studied. It seems to me insufficient to make decisions.

taxicabjesus 5y ago

Maybe you all can help me out. For someone who's not yet vaccinated, what's the point? 1. We now know that most of the carnage of February/March/April 2020 had to do with the aggressive use of ventilators. Once doctors stopped ventilating the majority of their patients, survival became the likely outcome of a SARS-CoV-2 infection. 2. We now know that severe COVID-19 is basically a Serotonin Syndrome (without the customary drug trigger), whereby plasma levels of serotonin becomes elevated, platelets release cluster-bombs of serotonin in the lungs, and lungs damaged by the bacterial/viral infections aren't able to remove excess serotonin from the blood. [0], for example. 3. Serotonin Syndrome is easily controlled with the anti-serotonin drug Cyproheptadine, and other similar substances [0]. 4. We know that lungs are damaged by pure oxygen, and that 5% CO2 completely alleviates the problem of #OxygenToxicity. 5. We now know that severe COVID-19 is likely a post-viral auto-immune condition [1]. 6. Most cases of severe viral lung infections also have concomitant bacterial infections such as tuberculosis [2]. Treating the concomitant bacterial infection is easier, more important and more effective than treating viral infections. 7. People who are already immune due to natural infection display robust immunity already, and have little-to-no potential for benefit from a vaccine jab. 8. While vaccination may be somewhat protective against SARS-CoV-2, it does not improve the population's overall health levels. Malnourished people will still be malnourished and vulnerable to other infections, or "breakthrough infections", due to their Vitamin B-1 deficiency, Zinc deficiency, etc. We know how to successfully treat severe COVID-19 cases (though most doctors are not yet aware of 'best practices'). A vast number of people already benefit from natural immunity to SARS-Cov-2. Old people do not benefit from flu vaccine [3], and probably won't benefit during the coming winter season from their COVID-19 vaccines either. What's the point of promoting vaccines, when we now have any number of cost-effective health-improving interventions that will prevent almost all of the not-yet-immune from dying from COVID-19 (save those who are statistically likely to die in the coming year anyways)? [0] Unprovoked serotonin syndrome-like presentation of SARS-CoV-2 infection: A small case series - https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/2050313X211032089 https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/2050313X211032... [1] "Our study explaining the pathophysiology of acute COVID has been published by ERJ, the flagship scientific journal of the European Respiratory Society @ERSpublications. Here, we describe how severe COVID-19 is NOT a viral pneumonia, but a post-viral autoimmune attack of the lung. -- https://twitter.com/DaveLeeERMD/status/1413816137570205697 https://twitter.com/DaveLeeERMD/status/1413816137570205697 [2] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3948857/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3948857/ [3] Turning 65 was associated with a statistically and clinically significant increase in rate of seasonal influenza vaccination. However, no evidence indicated that vaccination reduced hospitalizations or mortality among elderly persons. The estimates were precise enough to rule out results from many previous studies. - https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32120383/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32120383/

Archelaos 5y ago

The title of the article completely devalues it in my eyes. How does the author know that the reader does not want to know something else? This seems to me to be a very paternalistic attitude. What is not discussed at all, for example, are cross-vaccinations with different vaccines, e.g. AstraZeneca + mRNA.

nprateem 5y ago
I think they assume you're not autistic
kaskakokos 5y ago
Agree. I need to know a lot of additional things about Covid. Indeed it seems to me like the article is quite superficial. A lot of people here is doing smart questions that the article does not response.

raxxorrax 5y ago

This should be labeled as misinformation just out of spite. And it is, it lacks information and no doctor would accept this as a consultation. So flag happy Google should label it as misinformation.