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For all their faults, phone numbers do provide some limited level of identity. If you provide me with a phone number +12121234567, and I send you a unique code

For all their faults, phone numbers do provide some limited level of identity. If you provide me with a phone number +12121234567, and I send you a unique code via SMS / voice call, and you provide the code back, and I haven't had anyone else register with that phone number, I can conclude with some limited degree of confidence that: 1) You are a human. 2) You are in the United States present, or usually are. 3) You have money and an address and are capable of buying things (after all, you have apparently succeeded in buying a phone and maintaining an account). 4) There's some prospect you could become a customer, or a vendor, and we could do business. If you give me an email address john@example.org, I have none of those assurances, and it's entirely likely that you are not a human, or are a human overseas who is in the business of scamming people. Sure, someone can get access to phone numbers anonymously, from overseas, or to scam people, but it's enough of a minor hassle (for all the reasons listed in the post) that they tend not to. It's like if someone walks into your shop/restaurant in a disheveled state, unshaven, and with body odor, versus in a suit and tie and recently shaven and aftershave. The latter is rather more likely to be someone you'll want to do business with, even though there's always the feint possibility that the former is actually a billionaire playing an elaborate trick on you. It easy to imagine an improvement on phone numbers for providing this limited level of identity verification, but email addresses aren't it.

JohnFen 5y ago
True, they do provide a level of identity, albeit imperfect. But it's good enough that I don't give my phone number to companies outside of very limited circumstances (to keep my number from being sold or used for marketing purposes).
necovek 5y ago
> If you give me an email address john@example.org, I have none of those assurances, and it's entirely likely that you are not a human, or are a human overseas who is in the business of scamming people. Wow, "entirely likely" — what do you base that estimation on? Your analogy to a walk-in is completely on point too: surely only people in "disheveled state, unshaven, and with body odor" would sport an email address and think that's a good representation of their identity on the internet. I've conducted business with a bunch of US companies, sometimes shipping to mail forwarding companies based in US to forward stuff home (eg. that's how I got my last few $2-3k laptops). Businesses that build in some silly protections like the phone number in do not get my business. For us who've been using the internet long enough, phone number is a weird requirement: Google and eBay keep asking me to confirm my number upon login for 15 year old accounts (with eBay there's even no recourse on the page, but you do get logged in, so you can just reload the page you wanted and the screen is gone).
zvr 5y ago
You do realize that children/minors have phones which have numbers, right? Your conclusion (3) is not valid.
- BizarroLand 5y ago
  Even children typically have some money. Not a lot, yes, but some, however, not all people who have phone numbers have addresses, as even homeless people will utilize cheap prepaid numbers or take advantage of programs designed to provide cheap cellphones to the needy.
hdjjhhvvhga 5y ago
For the same reasons you listed you won't receive my phone number unless I'm buying a physical product from you and the phone number is required by the shipping company. Whenever I see an online form that requires a phone number, I just close the tab, simply because I hate people who interrupt my life with what they consider important and I don't - and the sale could have been closed without all this hassle.

JohnFen 5y ago

True, they do provide a level of identity, albeit imperfect. But it's good enough that I don't give my phone number to companies outside of very limited circumstances (to keep my number from being sold or used for marketing purposes).

necovek 5y ago

> If you give me an email address john@example.org, I have none of those assurances, and it's entirely likely that you are not a human, or are a human overseas who is in the business of scamming people. Wow, "entirely likely" — what do you base that estimation on? Your analogy to a walk-in is completely on point too: surely only people in "disheveled state, unshaven, and with body odor" would sport an email address and think that's a good representation of their identity on the internet. I've conducted business with a bunch of US companies, sometimes shipping to mail forwarding companies based in US to forward stuff home (eg. that's how I got my last few $2-3k laptops). Businesses that build in some silly protections like the phone number in do not get my business. For us who've been using the internet long enough, phone number is a weird requirement: Google and eBay keep asking me to confirm my number upon login for 15 year old accounts (with eBay there's even no recourse on the page, but you do get logged in, so you can just reload the page you wanted and the screen is gone).

zvr 5y ago

You do realize that children/minors have phones which have numbers, right? Your conclusion (3) is not valid.

BizarroLand 5y ago
Even children typically have some money. Not a lot, yes, but some, however, not all people who have phone numbers have addresses, as even homeless people will utilize cheap prepaid numbers or take advantage of programs designed to provide cheap cellphones to the needy.

hdjjhhvvhga 5y ago

For the same reasons you listed you won't receive my phone number unless I'm buying a physical product from you and the phone number is required by the shipping company. Whenever I see an online form that requires a phone number, I just close the tab, simply because I hate people who interrupt my life with what they consider important and I don't - and the sale could have been closed without all this hassle.