3 ms·

disclaimer: I don't mean this to come across as arrogant or anything (I'm just ignorant). I'm totally self-taught and have never worked a programming job (only

disclaimer: I don't mean this to come across as arrogant or anything (I'm just ignorant). I'm totally self-taught and have never worked a programming job (only programmed for fun). Do professional SWEs not actually understand or have the capability to do these things? I've hacked on hobby operating systems, written assembly, worked on a toy compiler and written libraries... I just kind of assumed that was all par for the course

woleium 5y ago
yes, some intermediate devs I've worked with are unable to do almost anything except write code. e.g. unable to generate an ssh key without assistance or detailed cut and paste instructions.
- shpongled 5y ago
  Maybe I should apply for some senior dev roles then :)
  - kanzenryu2 5y ago
    Many/most senior devs do not have the experience you described. But there are often a lot of meetings, reports, and managing other devs.
  - jimbokun 5y ago
    Yes, you absolutely should, unless you are already making a ton of money in a more fulfilling job.
- handrous 5y ago
  Shit, I google or manpage or tealdeer ssh key generation every single time.... Pretty much any command I don't run several times a month, I look up. Unless ctrl+r finds it in my history.
mathgladiator 5y ago
The challenge is that lower level work doesn't always translate into value for businesses. For instance, knowledge of sockets is very interesting. On one hand, I spent my youth learning sockets. For me to bang out a new network protocol takes a few weeks. For others, it can take months. This manifested in my frustration when I lead building a new transport layer using just sockets. While the people working with me were smart, they had limited low level experience to debug things.
- shpongled 5y ago
  I understand that that stuff is all relatively niche/not necessarily useful in every day life (I know nothing about sockets or TCP/IP) - I just figured your average SWE would at least be familiar with the concepts, especially if they had formal training. Guess it just comes down to individual interests
kanzenryu2 5y ago
It's extremely common. And many of them are fairly productive until an awkward bug shows up.
rantwasp 5y ago
I think you may have missed the point (as probably a lot of people did) I was trying to make. It's one thing to know what assembly is and to even be able to dabble in a bit of assembly, it's another thing to be proficient in assembly for a specific CPU/instruction set. It's orders of magnitude harder to be proficient and/or actually write tooling for it vs understanding what a MOV instruction does or to conceptually get what CPU registers are. Professional SWE are professional in the sense that they know what needs to happen to get the job done (but I am not surprised when someone else does not get or know something that I consider "fundamental")

woleium 5y ago

yes, some intermediate devs I've worked with are unable to do almost anything except write code. e.g. unable to generate an ssh key without assistance or detailed cut and paste instructions.

shpongled 5y ago
Maybe I should apply for some senior dev roles then :)
- kanzenryu2 5y ago
  Many/most senior devs do not have the experience you described. But there are often a lot of meetings, reports, and managing other devs.
- jimbokun 5y ago
  Yes, you absolutely should, unless you are already making a ton of money in a more fulfilling job.
handrous 5y ago
Shit, I google or manpage or tealdeer ssh key generation every single time.... Pretty much any command I don't run several times a month, I look up. Unless ctrl+r finds it in my history.

mathgladiator 5y ago

The challenge is that lower level work doesn't always translate into value for businesses. For instance, knowledge of sockets is very interesting. On one hand, I spent my youth learning sockets. For me to bang out a new network protocol takes a few weeks. For others, it can take months. This manifested in my frustration when I lead building a new transport layer using just sockets. While the people working with me were smart, they had limited low level experience to debug things.

shpongled 5y ago
I understand that that stuff is all relatively niche/not necessarily useful in every day life (I know nothing about sockets or TCP/IP) - I just figured your average SWE would at least be familiar with the concepts, especially if they had formal training. Guess it just comes down to individual interests

kanzenryu2 5y ago

It's extremely common. And many of them are fairly productive until an awkward bug shows up.

rantwasp 5y ago

I think you may have missed the point (as probably a lot of people did) I was trying to make. It's one thing to know what assembly is and to even be able to dabble in a bit of assembly, it's another thing to be proficient in assembly for a specific CPU/instruction set. It's orders of magnitude harder to be proficient and/or actually write tooling for it vs understanding what a MOV instruction does or to conceptually get what CPU registers are. Professional SWE are professional in the sense that they know what needs to happen to get the job done (but I am not surprised when someone else does not get or know something that I consider "fundamental")