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I would guess most under 35 wouldn't even think to use a paper map honestly, I wouldn't and I'm actually closer to 40, but I've been getting my information from

I would guess most under 35 wouldn't even think to use a paper map honestly, I wouldn't and I'm actually closer to 40, but I've been getting my information from online sources since the the late 90's, I don't use paper anything in any other part of my life, there's no obvious reason to use a paper map over google maps or some specialist mountaineering app.

ghaff 5y ago
I essentially always have a paper map with me unless I know the place in question (and know it's on OSM). For relatively advanced hiking? I'll have a paper map and compass and will have looked up the details of routes in a guide book or online. But, yes, I am older although probably more to the point I lead group hikes so I'm a bit anal about prep and safety. And hike in winter when electronics are especially suspect. I would never consider heading up Ben Nevis based on Google Maps.
- spaetzleesser 5y ago
  I don't use paper maps but always look at maps on gaiagps and alltrails to compare. I also look at guide books or articles about the route.
  - ghaff 5y ago
    That's certainly fair but, probably because I often hike in winter, I really don't want to potentially end up in a situation where I have a serious issue if my phone fails. Though they're pretty reliable, phones just have failure modes that physical maps don't. I don't worry about it in casual situations especially when there are other people around. Shoot a photo of the map at the parking area for a casual hike? Sure. But I like having backups when I can.
andyjohnson0 5y ago
It's about the affordances. I hike and climb in the UK and I would never head into serious mountain country without a physical paper map. Paper maps (with a simple map case) are more durable than a smartphone or tablet. They don't stop working when it gets too cold or wet, or when you lose connectivity and realise you forgot to download, or when you drop them. The battery doesn't run down. You can spread a paper map out and get the context of the terrain for miles around without losing resolution. I dont need to wipe snow or rain off the screen of a paper map, or try to scroll it with gloves on. They have a physicality that matches the physicality of being in the mountains. I have Ordnance Survey mapping for the whole of the UK on my phone, but paper maps are in a different league. For what it's worth, I'm the other side of fifty to you.
- daleharvey 5y ago
  > or when you drop them Paper maps very often stop working when you (unknowingly) drop them, the advantage phones have is that usually everybody has a phone, less so with paper maps.
- Dylan16807 5y ago
  It's not nearly that one-sided. Wetness can definitely screw up a paper map, and if it's currently snowing or raining I'd much rather be using a phone than actual paper. You can forget to download a map, and you can forget to bring a map, so that's about equal. For paper the battery doesn't run down but also it doesn't work at night. Spreading paper out is great sometimes, yes. I have no idea what you mean when you say the physicality "matches".
  - thombles 5y ago
    > Wetness can definitely screw up a paper map This is why map shops have a laminator. It's always worth the extra. > if it's currently snowing or raining I'd much rather be using a phone than actual paper I wouldn't. Even with a fancy new waterproof iPhone, face ID won't work with all my gear on, the screen touch sensor is all over the place, and that's after I've taken off my glove. You're not wrong that phones are often more convenient. If I wander off a poorly marked track, OSM & GPS is my plan A to get back. When it works it's incredibly efficient. But the first time you've been leaning on that GPS a bit too much, you're out on your own at 10% battery and you don't have a backup, the map and headlamp solution begins to make sense in a very visceral way. I'll carry both phone and paper even for daywalks unless it's a super clear track. It's not a matter of "forgetting to bring a map", it's a basic item like water.
    - Dylan16807 5y ago
      > But the first time you've been leaning on that GPS a bit too much, you're out on your own at 10% battery and you don't have a backup, the map and headlamp solution begins to make sense in a very visceral way. That's the value of having a fallback though. You'd be just as relieved to have a backup battery or phone. (Though 10% isn't that bad if at that point you only use it for stopping and navigating.)
FormFollowsFunc 5y ago
I used carry a paper map and compass a lot more but not so much anymore, especially not for a day hike. I probably would for a multi-day hike as a backup. Ben Nevis is quite a touristy mountain with a very clear wide busy path up it if you go the tourist route so no map is needed - just follow the person in front of you.

ghaff 5y ago

I essentially always have a paper map with me unless I know the place in question (and know it's on OSM). For relatively advanced hiking? I'll have a paper map and compass and will have looked up the details of routes in a guide book or online. But, yes, I am older although probably more to the point I lead group hikes so I'm a bit anal about prep and safety. And hike in winter when electronics are especially suspect. I would never consider heading up Ben Nevis based on Google Maps.

spaetzleesser 5y ago
I don't use paper maps but always look at maps on gaiagps and alltrails to compare. I also look at guide books or articles about the route.
- ghaff 5y ago
  That's certainly fair but, probably because I often hike in winter, I really don't want to potentially end up in a situation where I have a serious issue if my phone fails. Though they're pretty reliable, phones just have failure modes that physical maps don't. I don't worry about it in casual situations especially when there are other people around. Shoot a photo of the map at the parking area for a casual hike? Sure. But I like having backups when I can.

andyjohnson0 5y ago

It's about the affordances. I hike and climb in the UK and I would never head into serious mountain country without a physical paper map. Paper maps (with a simple map case) are more durable than a smartphone or tablet. They don't stop working when it gets too cold or wet, or when you lose connectivity and realise you forgot to download, or when you drop them. The battery doesn't run down. You can spread a paper map out and get the context of the terrain for miles around without losing resolution. I dont need to wipe snow or rain off the screen of a paper map, or try to scroll it with gloves on. They have a physicality that matches the physicality of being in the mountains. I have Ordnance Survey mapping for the whole of the UK on my phone, but paper maps are in a different league. For what it's worth, I'm the other side of fifty to you.

daleharvey 5y ago
> or when you drop them Paper maps very often stop working when you (unknowingly) drop them, the advantage phones have is that usually everybody has a phone, less so with paper maps.
Dylan16807 5y ago
It's not nearly that one-sided. Wetness can definitely screw up a paper map, and if it's currently snowing or raining I'd much rather be using a phone than actual paper. You can forget to download a map, and you can forget to bring a map, so that's about equal. For paper the battery doesn't run down but also it doesn't work at night. Spreading paper out is great sometimes, yes. I have no idea what you mean when you say the physicality "matches".
- thombles 5y ago
  > Wetness can definitely screw up a paper map This is why map shops have a laminator. It's always worth the extra. > if it's currently snowing or raining I'd much rather be using a phone than actual paper I wouldn't. Even with a fancy new waterproof iPhone, face ID won't work with all my gear on, the screen touch sensor is all over the place, and that's after I've taken off my glove. You're not wrong that phones are often more convenient. If I wander off a poorly marked track, OSM & GPS is my plan A to get back. When it works it's incredibly efficient. But the first time you've been leaning on that GPS a bit too much, you're out on your own at 10% battery and you don't have a backup, the map and headlamp solution begins to make sense in a very visceral way. I'll carry both phone and paper even for daywalks unless it's a super clear track. It's not a matter of "forgetting to bring a map", it's a basic item like water.
  - Dylan16807 5y ago
    > But the first time you've been leaning on that GPS a bit too much, you're out on your own at 10% battery and you don't have a backup, the map and headlamp solution begins to make sense in a very visceral way. That's the value of having a fallback though. You'd be just as relieved to have a backup battery or phone. (Though 10% isn't that bad if at that point you only use it for stopping and navigating.)

FormFollowsFunc 5y ago

I used carry a paper map and compass a lot more but not so much anymore, especially not for a day hike. I probably would for a multi-day hike as a backup. Ben Nevis is quite a touristy mountain with a very clear wide busy path up it if you go the tourist route so no map is needed - just follow the person in front of you.