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I'm shocked by the clear, simple and thoughtful advice this booklet gives. It just feels like the antithesis to the kind of official government communications t

I'm shocked by the clear, simple and thoughtful advice this booklet gives. It just feels like the antithesis to the kind of official government communications today that use needlessly complex language and seem to try to avoid actually saying anything of substance.

inglor_cz 5y ago
Follow the incentives. Vague language dilutes responsibility and offends no one.
baybal2 5y ago
USA had it easy when in the days immediate toppling of Sadam, and the prognosis was bright. Even when Fallujah happened, they had more good popular disposition than not. It took US repeated, conscious, and really best to say concerted mistakes to make Iraqis hate them. 1. Fallujah 2. Fallujah repeated 3. Fallujah fiasco repeated in other cities 4. Relinquishing of control of civil administration 5. Botched ellections 6. Propping the unpopular government elected under dubious circumstances 7. Tolerance to massive levels of corruption 8. Tolerating Iranian interference early on 9. Staging, and intentional exploitation of Sunni vs. Shia confrontation. This truly was the "Genie out of the bottle" moment
- meepmorp 5y ago
  You forgot step 0: ban every member of the Ba'ath party from participating in the government, thus ensuring a large supply of insurgents with military experience and access to weapons depots we didn't bother to secure.
  - lostlogin 5y ago
    Additionally, “With us or against us” isn’t an ideal stance in a region as old and complicated. Oversimplification of complex issues seemed the method of dealing with allies and enemies.
  - DSingularity 5y ago
    Thank you! Paul Brennan will go down in history as a malicious individual who wanted above all to destroy Iraq and it back centuries. Of course, he also wanted to setup the US to profit nicely from the rebuilding efforts but that is a secondary pain.
    - SturgeonsLaw 5y ago
      It's a case study in shock doctrine. Make money destroying the place then make money rebuilding it
    - meepmorp 5y ago
      Bremner, not Brennan; which is odd, because I thought it was Brennan, too. Also, I forgot that he disbanded the army separately from the general de-baathification of the government. Genius moves all around, the guy was obviously playing 0.3D chess.
  - baybal2 5y ago
    Banning Baath was a very correct decision, were they let them stay, Iraq would've exploded, and boiled over earlier, and more violently. What was wrong was them failing to deal with Baathists themselves, not the party. Without Baathists question being ever given a final solution, it came to bit them back. While USA was struggling with rebranded Baathist remnants, actual Saudi backed extremists, and Iranian militias sneaked in, some times even with US own backing, ensuring far bigger troubles to come. Lastly, what I forgot to mention was US finally look every bit of face, and any rapport it had left with Iraqi population. US wasn't able to talk to people of Iraq with a straight face at a after around 2007-2008. Then, they resorted to pitting Shia vs. Sunni. It was not a bright idea, and I have no idea why they even came up with it.
- Pxtl 5y ago
  You also neglected to mention Abu Ghraib. Which, realistically, the Iraqis knew the details about long before the photos appeared.
- lumost 5y ago
  10. A 13 year long war/occupation spread over 2 decades. If the US had been conducting military operations in post ww2 France for that long the French wouldn’t look kindly on the US either. The fundamental mistake was believing that occupation could be indefinite, and that there wasn’t an urgently ticking clock until civil unrest.
  - jdavis703 5y ago
    The continued occupation of Germany and Japan is far less fraught. Yes controversies arise, but not on the level of hostilities experienced in Afghanistan and Iraq.
    - lumost 5y ago
      Occupation of Germany/Japan was also substantially different in nature. By the end of ww2 both countries had been depleted of all war making capacity in people, equipment, and industrial capacity. Even then, the occupations were limited to specific military bases that both sides would view as positive for defense against external threats.
    - jonplackett 5y ago
      There was a proper plan too of massively rebuilding those nations - no surprise they’re both now industrial powerhouses. Where’s Iraq now?
reaperducer 5y ago
It just feels like the antithesis to the kind of official government communications today that use needlessly complex language and seem to try to avoid actually saying anything of substance. That is changing. Slowly. The U.S. government has a program to train its people to speak and write clearly and in ways that ordinary people can understand. But it's a big government, and it's going to take a while to spread everywhere. A similar thing is happening in healthcare, which is where I work. It's called "health literacy," and everyone in a customer-facing role at my company gets lots and lots of training in it. I can't speak about the government's motivation, but for us in healthcare, it's because people who understand the state of their health get sick less and cost less money to heal. Sad that it took a bunch of studies to come to that conclusion, but bean counters gotta count beans.

inglor_cz 5y ago

Follow the incentives. Vague language dilutes responsibility and offends no one.

baybal2 5y ago

USA had it easy when in the days immediate toppling of Sadam, and the prognosis was bright. Even when Fallujah happened, they had more good popular disposition than not. It took US repeated, conscious, and really best to say concerted mistakes to make Iraqis hate them. 1. Fallujah 2. Fallujah repeated 3. Fallujah fiasco repeated in other cities 4. Relinquishing of control of civil administration 5. Botched ellections 6. Propping the unpopular government elected under dubious circumstances 7. Tolerance to massive levels of corruption 8. Tolerating Iranian interference early on 9. Staging, and intentional exploitation of Sunni vs. Shia confrontation. This truly was the "Genie out of the bottle" moment

meepmorp 5y ago
You forgot step 0: ban every member of the Ba'ath party from participating in the government, thus ensuring a large supply of insurgents with military experience and access to weapons depots we didn't bother to secure.
- lostlogin 5y ago
  Additionally, “With us or against us” isn’t an ideal stance in a region as old and complicated. Oversimplification of complex issues seemed the method of dealing with allies and enemies.
- DSingularity 5y ago
  Thank you! Paul Brennan will go down in history as a malicious individual who wanted above all to destroy Iraq and it back centuries. Of course, he also wanted to setup the US to profit nicely from the rebuilding efforts but that is a secondary pain.
  - SturgeonsLaw 5y ago
    It's a case study in shock doctrine. Make money destroying the place then make money rebuilding it
  - meepmorp 5y ago
    Bremner, not Brennan; which is odd, because I thought it was Brennan, too. Also, I forgot that he disbanded the army separately from the general de-baathification of the government. Genius moves all around, the guy was obviously playing 0.3D chess.
- baybal2 5y ago
  Banning Baath was a very correct decision, were they let them stay, Iraq would've exploded, and boiled over earlier, and more violently. What was wrong was them failing to deal with Baathists themselves, not the party. Without Baathists question being ever given a final solution, it came to bit them back. While USA was struggling with rebranded Baathist remnants, actual Saudi backed extremists, and Iranian militias sneaked in, some times even with US own backing, ensuring far bigger troubles to come. Lastly, what I forgot to mention was US finally look every bit of face, and any rapport it had left with Iraqi population. US wasn't able to talk to people of Iraq with a straight face at a after around 2007-2008. Then, they resorted to pitting Shia vs. Sunni. It was not a bright idea, and I have no idea why they even came up with it.
Pxtl 5y ago
You also neglected to mention Abu Ghraib. Which, realistically, the Iraqis knew the details about long before the photos appeared.
lumost 5y ago
10. A 13 year long war/occupation spread over 2 decades. If the US had been conducting military operations in post ww2 France for that long the French wouldn’t look kindly on the US either. The fundamental mistake was believing that occupation could be indefinite, and that there wasn’t an urgently ticking clock until civil unrest.
- jdavis703 5y ago
  The continued occupation of Germany and Japan is far less fraught. Yes controversies arise, but not on the level of hostilities experienced in Afghanistan and Iraq.
  - lumost 5y ago
    Occupation of Germany/Japan was also substantially different in nature. By the end of ww2 both countries had been depleted of all war making capacity in people, equipment, and industrial capacity. Even then, the occupations were limited to specific military bases that both sides would view as positive for defense against external threats.
  - jonplackett 5y ago
    There was a proper plan too of massively rebuilding those nations - no surprise they’re both now industrial powerhouses. Where’s Iraq now?

reaperducer 5y ago

It just feels like the antithesis to the kind of official government communications today that use needlessly complex language and seem to try to avoid actually saying anything of substance. That is changing. Slowly. The U.S. government has a program to train its people to speak and write clearly and in ways that ordinary people can understand. But it's a big government, and it's going to take a while to spread everywhere. A similar thing is happening in healthcare, which is where I work. It's called "health literacy," and everyone in a customer-facing role at my company gets lots and lots of training in it. I can't speak about the government's motivation, but for us in healthcare, it's because people who understand the state of their health get sick less and cost less money to heal. Sad that it took a bunch of studies to come to that conclusion, but bean counters gotta count beans.