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From the article. > They also lease land to neighboring ranchers, whose grazing cattle aerate the soil with their hooves and add organic matter and nutrients v

From the article. > They also lease land to neighboring ranchers, whose grazing cattle aerate the soil with their hooves and add organic matter and nutrients via manure. Meat can and should be a part of regenerative ag. I recently visited a family friend's place/farm. A year ago, the soil was the typical cracked dry light tan clay ground that I have in my yard. It's quite typical in Oregon. This time, the soil was a dark color with tons of organic material and great water retention. This was entirely due to the grazing. They have goats and an alpaca. Ruminants are excellent for soil health, and the meat they produce is also great for human health.

EricE 5y ago
Yes - people dramatically underestimate the value of ruminants that can process plants that we can't.
- pacomerh 5y ago
  I wish more people knew about this. It's amazing how little we know (as a whole) about what we eat
knuthsat 5y ago
There's really not that much meat in regenerative agriculture. Given the current per capita consumption of meat in kg, a regenerative ag operation could never accomplish that. Reducing to 4-30kg of meat per capita per year seems impossible. No one can even accomplish that with ruminants. That's why there's so much chicken everywhere, because accomplishing that with ruminants is near impossible, so chicken is advertised massively instead. A nitpick, there's no single food that is great for human health or bad for human health. Diet can contain various things and be healthy and it can also lack meat and be healthy.
- andscoop 5y ago
  Do you have sources for this? I used to think similarly, but now I’m not so sure. Gabe Brown, the author of Dirt to Soil, changed my outlook on animals place in a healthy ecosystem. On his farmland he puts about 700k lbs of cattle on 1acre of land at a time, rotating those cattle frequently across 40 acres. He claims this practice has been an integral part of his regenerative ag method. http://brownsranch.us/grazing/ http://brownsranch.us/grazing/
  - Jeff_Brown 5y ago
    I don't think that math works out. That works out to around 6 square meters per cow. Google says cows eat about 160 pounds of grass per day.
    - andscoop 5y ago
      Brown has bred his cattle for efficiency. > A large-framed cow is one that requires a higher intake level for maintenance alone https://brownsranch.us/livestock/ https://brownsranch.us/livestock/ My math came out similarly to yours but I don’t think it’s unreasonable for there to be 150lbs of waste high cover crop biomass in a 6 square meter area. Again he is rotating these cattle daily and never depleting the crops of any one area, giving them a chance to grow back by the time the cattle are rotated back through. Another term you can search for to find visuals of what this sort of density looks like is mobgrazing.
    - phillc73 5y ago
      I think in this case Google might not be right. Other sources say it's more like 10-15kg (22-33lbs)[1] for beef cattle. Dairy might be higher. [1] https://www.thebeefsite.com/articles/3154/how-much-forage-does-a-beef-cow-consume-each-day/ https://www.thebeefsite.com/articles/3154/how-much-forage-do...
- daddylongstroke 5y ago
  You speak as if a goat is a goat, a cow is a cow, a pig is a pig, a calorie is a calorie, and a protein is a protein. No. The world is much more nuanced than that. Ruminants are thee biggest factor is driving soil-building as part of regenerative agriculture. Goats are by far (in my experience) the quickest way to rebuild parched top soil, or just build soil in a place that badly needs it (say run-through dirt that won't even grow lentils).
  - knuthsat 5y ago
    Well, I did not say that ruminants aren't a part of regenerative agriculture. There's just not that many to support the current meat consumption levels. If you're going to grow ruminants just on grass, it takes a lot of time and land to eventually sell the meat compared to what's happening now. We could argue that a reduction from 100+ kg to 4-30kg of meat per capita per year could be supported this way but I have no idea.
spoonjim 5y ago
Yes, meat is a good component of a healthy diet, but as with many things, Americans take the quantity about 10 miles past the advisable point.
TaylorAlexander 5y ago
I do work at a farm and around farms that use regenerative grazing. It works great. However as a vegan my hope is that we eventually let animals graze and simply do not kill and consume them. One could argue “the meat is there” but that meat is beings with a heart and a mind. When I see the grazing animals with their babies in toe, I think about how they will be separated and the pain the mothers will go through. We can take great care of our soil with regenerative grazing but that is quite apart from whether or not we need to treat those animals as mere property and eat them.
- matmatmatmat 5y ago
  I'm a meat-eater (have been my whole life), but I've always been partial to this argument. This is why I'm looking forward to lab-grown meat and would pay a bit of a premium for it.
  - TaylorAlexander 5y ago
    Lab grown meat is promising, for sure. FWIW I am now in year three of veganism and it feels like I have made it past all the "teething" stages to the point where I am absolutely loving my vegan meals. It is rare for me these days to eat a meat or cheese substitute - more like the occasional junk food throwback than a normal meal. Lentils, tofu, potatoes, carrots, broccoli, brown rice, peanut sauce, lettuce, zucchini, and just some of the foods that bring me joy to eat. Hopefully you're already learning to make vegan meals but if anyone out there is on the fence I highly encourage you to learn how to make delicious vegan food. It's so tasty and you won't feel the guilt of eating meat.
    - inreverse 5y ago
      Are there any chefs who unify veganism with traditional cuisines that use lots of animal products, e.g. french or chinese? I would love to be vegetarian but I'm lucky in that my partner makes fantastic traditional food and I don't want to give it up. Vegan modifications along the lines of 'substitute the meat in your burger for mushroom' seem depressing, like they're unengaged with the balance of flavours in the dish.

EricE 5y ago

Yes - people dramatically underestimate the value of ruminants that can process plants that we can't.

pacomerh 5y ago
I wish more people knew about this. It's amazing how little we know (as a whole) about what we eat

knuthsat 5y ago

There's really not that much meat in regenerative agriculture. Given the current per capita consumption of meat in kg, a regenerative ag operation could never accomplish that. Reducing to 4-30kg of meat per capita per year seems impossible. No one can even accomplish that with ruminants. That's why there's so much chicken everywhere, because accomplishing that with ruminants is near impossible, so chicken is advertised massively instead. A nitpick, there's no single food that is great for human health or bad for human health. Diet can contain various things and be healthy and it can also lack meat and be healthy.

andscoop 5y ago
Do you have sources for this? I used to think similarly, but now I’m not so sure. Gabe Brown, the author of Dirt to Soil, changed my outlook on animals place in a healthy ecosystem. On his farmland he puts about 700k lbs of cattle on 1acre of land at a time, rotating those cattle frequently across 40 acres. He claims this practice has been an integral part of his regenerative ag method. http://brownsranch.us/grazing/ http://brownsranch.us/grazing/
- Jeff_Brown 5y ago
  I don't think that math works out. That works out to around 6 square meters per cow. Google says cows eat about 160 pounds of grass per day.
  - andscoop 5y ago
    Brown has bred his cattle for efficiency. > A large-framed cow is one that requires a higher intake level for maintenance alone https://brownsranch.us/livestock/ https://brownsranch.us/livestock/ My math came out similarly to yours but I don’t think it’s unreasonable for there to be 150lbs of waste high cover crop biomass in a 6 square meter area. Again he is rotating these cattle daily and never depleting the crops of any one area, giving them a chance to grow back by the time the cattle are rotated back through. Another term you can search for to find visuals of what this sort of density looks like is mobgrazing.
  - phillc73 5y ago
    I think in this case Google might not be right. Other sources say it's more like 10-15kg (22-33lbs)[1] for beef cattle. Dairy might be higher. [1] https://www.thebeefsite.com/articles/3154/how-much-forage-does-a-beef-cow-consume-each-day/ https://www.thebeefsite.com/articles/3154/how-much-forage-do...
daddylongstroke 5y ago
You speak as if a goat is a goat, a cow is a cow, a pig is a pig, a calorie is a calorie, and a protein is a protein. No. The world is much more nuanced than that. Ruminants are thee biggest factor is driving soil-building as part of regenerative agriculture. Goats are by far (in my experience) the quickest way to rebuild parched top soil, or just build soil in a place that badly needs it (say run-through dirt that won't even grow lentils).
- knuthsat 5y ago
  Well, I did not say that ruminants aren't a part of regenerative agriculture. There's just not that many to support the current meat consumption levels. If you're going to grow ruminants just on grass, it takes a lot of time and land to eventually sell the meat compared to what's happening now. We could argue that a reduction from 100+ kg to 4-30kg of meat per capita per year could be supported this way but I have no idea.

spoonjim 5y ago

Yes, meat is a good component of a healthy diet, but as with many things, Americans take the quantity about 10 miles past the advisable point.

TaylorAlexander 5y ago

I do work at a farm and around farms that use regenerative grazing. It works great. However as a vegan my hope is that we eventually let animals graze and simply do not kill and consume them. One could argue “the meat is there” but that meat is beings with a heart and a mind. When I see the grazing animals with their babies in toe, I think about how they will be separated and the pain the mothers will go through. We can take great care of our soil with regenerative grazing but that is quite apart from whether or not we need to treat those animals as mere property and eat them.

matmatmatmat 5y ago
I'm a meat-eater (have been my whole life), but I've always been partial to this argument. This is why I'm looking forward to lab-grown meat and would pay a bit of a premium for it.
- TaylorAlexander 5y ago
  Lab grown meat is promising, for sure. FWIW I am now in year three of veganism and it feels like I have made it past all the "teething" stages to the point where I am absolutely loving my vegan meals. It is rare for me these days to eat a meat or cheese substitute - more like the occasional junk food throwback than a normal meal. Lentils, tofu, potatoes, carrots, broccoli, brown rice, peanut sauce, lettuce, zucchini, and just some of the foods that bring me joy to eat. Hopefully you're already learning to make vegan meals but if anyone out there is on the fence I highly encourage you to learn how to make delicious vegan food. It's so tasty and you won't feel the guilt of eating meat.
  - inreverse 5y ago
    Are there any chefs who unify veganism with traditional cuisines that use lots of animal products, e.g. french or chinese? I would love to be vegetarian but I'm lucky in that my partner makes fantastic traditional food and I don't want to give it up. Vegan modifications along the lines of 'substitute the meat in your burger for mushroom' seem depressing, like they're unengaged with the balance of flavours in the dish.