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I saw and touched the sub; it was featured at a science expo in Bangkok not long after the rescue. It was a metal tube with some plexiglass plates on it with ai

I saw and touched the sub; it was featured at a science expo in Bangkok not long after the rescue. It was a metal tube with some plexiglass plates on it with air valves mounted in them. I'm sure there was some engineering involved, but didn't seem at all impressive. My son was a big fan of Elon, the "cool rocket guy". But after his comments about Unsworth he asked me "Why did Elon say that stuff about the man who is a hero?" My son is a Thai boy living in Thailand, close the the same age as the boys who were rescued. Sadly I had to walk back the idea that Elon was a good role model. I thought Unsworth should have sued Elon in Thailand. It wouldn't have meant much since Elon would never travel here again. But in Thailand defamation is a criminal offense that carries jail time. And since Unsworth is a national hero there's little doubt the court would have found in his favor and Elon would have had an outstanding arrest warrant. Again, wouldn't mean much unless Elon forgot about it and ended up traveling to or through a country that would arrest him on behalf of Thailand.

roenxi 5y ago
> But in Thailand defamation is a criminal offense that carries jail time. And since Unsworth is a national hero there's little doubt the court would have found in his favor and Elon would have had an outstanding arrest warrant. While Thailand is certainly within their rights to run their justice system how they want: 1) The punishment doesn't in any way fit the crime. 2) "He's such a hero" is a terrible reason to do something. Focusing on who the person being wronged was is a bad path to justice - it is better to focus on what the perpetrator did. So I hope the courts in Thailand would have found in Musk's favour.
- Dah00n 5y ago
  How do you know the punishment doesn't fit the crime when the case is a thought experiment at most? Or are you saying that because it would be a criminal case it is too much no matter what? It makes no sense to me that it is too much just because it isn't US style justice. Criminal doesn't mean prison time. It's not like the US justice system is much better (clearly not working at all in this case). Compared to those countries justice systems the US should be compared to it's broken, corrupt and unfair (to the extreme for minorities).
  - roenxi 5y ago
    The comment was hoping that Elon would have an arrest warrant out on him, of the belief that he would never enter Thailand and was pointing out that the maximum penalty was imprisonment. There is an element of crazy - nobody should be facing arrest for saying nasty things. Maybe a fine, after a difficult court case. Leaving aside that Thailand's defamation laws are largely a club to stop people criticising the government and not really intended for use against people like Musk.
    - geomark 5y ago
      More than "a club to stop people criticising the government", it's used extensively by the rich and powerful to stop anyone from criticising them. Another funny thing about it is that the truth is not a defense. So even if Unsworth was a pedo and Musk could prove it, that would not be a defense against a defamation case. All that is needed is to show that the person making the defamatory remark intended to cause the victim to lose face.
hyperpallium2 5y ago
"impressive" is not a relevant criterion for prototypes
loceng 5y ago
So now you can update your son based on another comment we know that Elon was lied to by a private investigator - and seems safe to assume his comments based on that faulty/made up information; https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27796249 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27796249 Elon is a good role model, he's not perfect though. I'm not sure why so many people blindly put him on a pedestal assuming he should be superhuman - especially at the abnormal level of pressures and responsibility he has.
- geomark 5y ago
  That's a good idea. A demonstration of that old phrase "birds of a feather flock together." Musk employs a sleazebag to do Unsworth dirty, gets done dirty himself. Or maybe karma is a better word for it. I don't know about that putting on a pedestal thing. Musk is a brilliant guy, but has demonstrated that he has a pretty rotten character. IMO, a good role model for a kid really needs to have good quality of character above all else.
- andi999 5y ago
  To me hiring an investigator to find dirt on a guy who bruised your ego by pointing out correctly that the sub sucks, is already crossing a lot of lines for me.
  - jb775 5y ago
    It wasn't just bruised ego, the guy brought legal charges against Musk claiming libel. How is hiring a 3rd party to investigate the underlying libel not a good initial response? Especially if he could easily afford it.
    - j4yav 5y ago
      He had already called him pedo guy amongst other things at that point (i.e., the libel in question in the first place). So it couldn’t have come from the investigation that came later about the libel. The timeline just doesn’t make sense.
- 5y ago

roenxi 5y ago

> But in Thailand defamation is a criminal offense that carries jail time. And since Unsworth is a national hero there's little doubt the court would have found in his favor and Elon would have had an outstanding arrest warrant. While Thailand is certainly within their rights to run their justice system how they want: 1) The punishment doesn't in any way fit the crime. 2) "He's such a hero" is a terrible reason to do something. Focusing on who the person being wronged was is a bad path to justice - it is better to focus on what the perpetrator did. So I hope the courts in Thailand would have found in Musk's favour.

Dah00n 5y ago
How do you know the punishment doesn't fit the crime when the case is a thought experiment at most? Or are you saying that because it would be a criminal case it is too much no matter what? It makes no sense to me that it is too much just because it isn't US style justice. Criminal doesn't mean prison time. It's not like the US justice system is much better (clearly not working at all in this case). Compared to those countries justice systems the US should be compared to it's broken, corrupt and unfair (to the extreme for minorities).
- roenxi 5y ago
  The comment was hoping that Elon would have an arrest warrant out on him, of the belief that he would never enter Thailand and was pointing out that the maximum penalty was imprisonment. There is an element of crazy - nobody should be facing arrest for saying nasty things. Maybe a fine, after a difficult court case. Leaving aside that Thailand's defamation laws are largely a club to stop people criticising the government and not really intended for use against people like Musk.
  - geomark 5y ago
    More than "a club to stop people criticising the government", it's used extensively by the rich and powerful to stop anyone from criticising them. Another funny thing about it is that the truth is not a defense. So even if Unsworth was a pedo and Musk could prove it, that would not be a defense against a defamation case. All that is needed is to show that the person making the defamatory remark intended to cause the victim to lose face.

hyperpallium2 5y ago

"impressive" is not a relevant criterion for prototypes

loceng 5y ago

So now you can update your son based on another comment we know that Elon was lied to by a private investigator - and seems safe to assume his comments based on that faulty/made up information; https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27796249 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27796249 Elon is a good role model, he's not perfect though. I'm not sure why so many people blindly put him on a pedestal assuming he should be superhuman - especially at the abnormal level of pressures and responsibility he has.

geomark 5y ago
That's a good idea. A demonstration of that old phrase "birds of a feather flock together." Musk employs a sleazebag to do Unsworth dirty, gets done dirty himself. Or maybe karma is a better word for it. I don't know about that putting on a pedestal thing. Musk is a brilliant guy, but has demonstrated that he has a pretty rotten character. IMO, a good role model for a kid really needs to have good quality of character above all else.
andi999 5y ago
To me hiring an investigator to find dirt on a guy who bruised your ego by pointing out correctly that the sub sucks, is already crossing a lot of lines for me.
- jb775 5y ago
  It wasn't just bruised ego, the guy brought legal charges against Musk claiming libel. How is hiring a 3rd party to investigate the underlying libel not a good initial response? Especially if he could easily afford it.
  - j4yav 5y ago
    He had already called him pedo guy amongst other things at that point (i.e., the libel in question in the first place). So it couldn’t have come from the investigation that came later about the libel. The timeline just doesn’t make sense.
5y ago