7 ms·

Microsoft executive says U.S. overuses secret orders for Americans' data

93 points by dlcmh 5y ago

raxxorrax 5y ago
If even Microsoft says that, government really seem to be afraid of their constituency by now. Deservedly so in my opinion.
- BuyMyBitcoins 5y ago
  >”government really seem to be afraid of their constituency by now.” Call me a cynic, but I just don’t see things changing. The US government didn’t see a big change after the Snowden leaks and those were dramatically more revealing than this statement is. Sadly, Congress has a really high incumbency/re-election rate and most Americans just can’t bring themselves to vote for the other party. Congress usually has a single digit to to teen approval rating yet they continue to act the same way.
  - raxxorrax 5y ago
    I feel you. If it brings you solace, other governments are as old, angry and afraid as yours.
  - hanniabu 5y ago
    > Congress usually has a single digit to to teen approval rating yet they continue to act the same way. They don't need to worry because they've successfully redirected citizen rage against each other instead of towards them. Classic divide and conquer.
  - Aboh33 5y ago
    Agreed. The only thing I see changing is certain user behavior (e.g. thinking twice about searching on certain topics and/or using certain search engines etc.)
- alisonkisk 5y ago
  Afraid how? MS is complaining, but not effectively resisting.
  - xahrepap 5y ago
    I think the commenter is saying that the Gov is afraid so they spy. And that MS’s comment helps us see that. (Rather than the Gov is afraid because MS is speaking out. )
smoldesu 5y ago
This should come as no surprise by now. Google, Apple, Microsoft and Amazon are all fairly familiar bedfellows with the NSA at this point, you should really only use their services to store data that you're comfortable having exposed.
- lrem 5y ago
  As a Googler I feel offended by part of your comment. It's like calling inmates bedfellows of the prison system.
  - Red_Leaves_Flyy 5y ago
    Are you comparing you at will employment with Google to convicted felons who’ve had their right to freedom stripped of them by a jury of their peers or a guilty plea deal?
    - mikepurvis 5y ago
      I think the poster's employment is just context. The "inmates" here are the tech companies being held hostage by the NSA. But I'm not sure I really agree. At this point "bedfellows" seems like an apt description, given how feeble and ineffective their opposition (certainly publicly, anyway) to it seems to have been.
    - alisonkisk 5y ago
      Please don't violate site guidelines by posting "gotcha" comments that misinterpret other posters. Find a charitable interpretation. It's a metaphor, following the example of "bedfellows", which doesn't mean they are literally in bed together. Inmates and busineses alike are required to obey the government under threat of force.
  - tupac_speedrap 5y ago
    I think Google is more like a partner in crime at this point. The NSA don't even have to put the legwork in anymore they just get the data off Google and it's easier because they don't have to work through the red tape.
dukeofdoom 5y ago
MS should be concerned, because eventually people will stop trusting their products and switch over to alternatives. The erosion of civil liberties under COVID rules is extremely concerning. Canada is about to pass draconian laws for the purpose of monitoring and restrict Canadian's online free speech rights and jail people for 2 years, and pay 70k fine for things like saying the N word online.
- Jcowell 5y ago
  I sincerely doubt this and can’t envision a world moving away from Microsoft and it’s back comparability with legacy software. Not to mention the Business world and academics world dependence on Microsoft’s Business Suite (and no Google Sheets only advantage over excel is collaboration. Excel beats it every other metric and no one is moving sensitive documents from Excel over to Sheets.) Also take into account that the common person who works on Windows at work might also work at windows at home. And then there is gaming. Microsoft is not going away anytime soon. Especially with Apple’s move towards dropping 32-bit and the general consumers not adopting Linux anytime soon.
  - fragileone 5y ago
    On the gaming front since Steam released Proton the future is now uncertain for Microsoft hegemony. Linux can now run AAA titles on launch, with the only significant barrier that's left being kernel-level anti-cheats. But with WINE's rapid development, cloud gaming becoming more popular (just yesterday for instance Xbox Cloud Gaming became available for Linux browsers) and VFIO becoming easier I don't expect this to be an issue still in the next few years.
    - Jcowell 5y ago
      I still doubting that regular consumers will go out of their way to buy Linux Ready Laptops/Gaming PCs (and no they’re not installing Linux on their computers) I think HN in general severely overestimates how willing to normal consumer is to use Linux over Windows and how much utility Windows has.
- 5y ago
jsnell 5y ago
Dupe (203 points, 52 comments): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27693929 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27693929
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
127 5y ago
So, what's the current situation running Windows under a Linux system with QEMU?
- smoldesu 5y ago
  Basically perfect, GPU passthrough and security isn't flawless yet though afaik

93 points by dlcmh 5y ago

If even Microsoft says that, government really seem to be afraid of their constituency by now. Deservedly so in my opinion.

BuyMyBitcoins 5y ago
>”government really seem to be afraid of their constituency by now.” Call me a cynic, but I just don’t see things changing. The US government didn’t see a big change after the Snowden leaks and those were dramatically more revealing than this statement is. Sadly, Congress has a really high incumbency/re-election rate and most Americans just can’t bring themselves to vote for the other party. Congress usually has a single digit to to teen approval rating yet they continue to act the same way.
- raxxorrax 5y ago
  I feel you. If it brings you solace, other governments are as old, angry and afraid as yours.
- hanniabu 5y ago
  > Congress usually has a single digit to to teen approval rating yet they continue to act the same way. They don't need to worry because they've successfully redirected citizen rage against each other instead of towards them. Classic divide and conquer.
- Aboh33 5y ago
  Agreed. The only thing I see changing is certain user behavior (e.g. thinking twice about searching on certain topics and/or using certain search engines etc.)
alisonkisk 5y ago
Afraid how? MS is complaining, but not effectively resisting.
- xahrepap 5y ago
  I think the commenter is saying that the Gov is afraid so they spy. And that MS’s comment helps us see that. (Rather than the Gov is afraid because MS is speaking out. )

smoldesu 5y ago

This should come as no surprise by now. Google, Apple, Microsoft and Amazon are all fairly familiar bedfellows with the NSA at this point, you should really only use their services to store data that you're comfortable having exposed.

lrem 5y ago
As a Googler I feel offended by part of your comment. It's like calling inmates bedfellows of the prison system.
- Red_Leaves_Flyy 5y ago
  Are you comparing you at will employment with Google to convicted felons who’ve had their right to freedom stripped of them by a jury of their peers or a guilty plea deal?
  - mikepurvis 5y ago
    I think the poster's employment is just context. The "inmates" here are the tech companies being held hostage by the NSA. But I'm not sure I really agree. At this point "bedfellows" seems like an apt description, given how feeble and ineffective their opposition (certainly publicly, anyway) to it seems to have been.
  - alisonkisk 5y ago
    Please don't violate site guidelines by posting "gotcha" comments that misinterpret other posters. Find a charitable interpretation. It's a metaphor, following the example of "bedfellows", which doesn't mean they are literally in bed together. Inmates and busineses alike are required to obey the government under threat of force.
- tupac_speedrap 5y ago
  I think Google is more like a partner in crime at this point. The NSA don't even have to put the legwork in anymore they just get the data off Google and it's easier because they don't have to work through the red tape.

dukeofdoom 5y ago

MS should be concerned, because eventually people will stop trusting their products and switch over to alternatives. The erosion of civil liberties under COVID rules is extremely concerning. Canada is about to pass draconian laws for the purpose of monitoring and restrict Canadian's online free speech rights and jail people for 2 years, and pay 70k fine for things like saying the N word online.

Jcowell 5y ago
I sincerely doubt this and can’t envision a world moving away from Microsoft and it’s back comparability with legacy software. Not to mention the Business world and academics world dependence on Microsoft’s Business Suite (and no Google Sheets only advantage over excel is collaboration. Excel beats it every other metric and no one is moving sensitive documents from Excel over to Sheets.) Also take into account that the common person who works on Windows at work might also work at windows at home. And then there is gaming. Microsoft is not going away anytime soon. Especially with Apple’s move towards dropping 32-bit and the general consumers not adopting Linux anytime soon.
- fragileone 5y ago
  On the gaming front since Steam released Proton the future is now uncertain for Microsoft hegemony. Linux can now run AAA titles on launch, with the only significant barrier that's left being kernel-level anti-cheats. But with WINE's rapid development, cloud gaming becoming more popular (just yesterday for instance Xbox Cloud Gaming became available for Linux browsers) and VFIO becoming easier I don't expect this to be an issue still in the next few years.
  - Jcowell 5y ago
    I still doubting that regular consumers will go out of their way to buy Linux Ready Laptops/Gaming PCs (and no they’re not installing Linux on their computers) I think HN in general severely overestimates how willing to normal consumer is to use Linux over Windows and how much utility Windows has.
5y ago

jsnell 5y ago

Dupe (203 points, 52 comments): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27693929 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27693929

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

127 5y ago

So, what's the current situation running Windows under a Linux system with QEMU?

smoldesu 5y ago
Basically perfect, GPU passthrough and security isn't flawless yet though afaik