5 ms·

Why is deploying through docker images not OK? I always thought that's what docker is meant to solve.

willis936 5y ago
Docker was made for development and testing of code, not production. It has been co-opted for production with good success. It seems fine to do it for hobbyist projects, but still feels dirty in a commercial setting.
- ramtatatam 5y ago
  I'm using docker in commercial environments for years and cannot complain... But I don't distribute software, which is where the problem is probably more visible.
- iainmerrick 5y ago
  Why?
  - willis936 5y ago
    Why what?
- evgen 5y ago
  The largest internet services on the planet were using LXC containers for production ops before you ever heard of the term 'docker'. In its earliest iterations it was easier to push a container to production than to run it on your laptop.
  - KaiserPro 5y ago
    > using LXC containers for production which isn't docker. From what I recall, spotify were the first company with a large footprint to use docker. However for some reason they skipped VMs and went screaming into docker when it was _very_ new. Personally that seemed like a mistake, but you know, each to their own. If you're wanting to get into a bun fight about containers, then IBM 360 and JCL has some time for you.
- Daishiman 5y ago
  If we stopped using software in prod because it feels "dirty" we would not be using computers at all.
stult 5y ago
Desktop/local usage, especially for non technical users or people working in environments where they can’t install docker (eg locked down corporate machine). There isn’t a great way to pass around a single executable or installer for a Python app. There’s pyinstaller, but it’s finicky and doesn’t quite work cross platform (you have to build the executable on the target OS). On the other hand, OP’s setup makes it very easy to publish packages. So you can create a tarball and have a user pip install that, then run your app with a simple CLI. Or publish to pypi if you want it public. The downside is you assume the user has the right version of Python and knows how to switch versions if need be and all the weirdness that comes with that. But for web apps, packaging your app also makes it easy to wrap in a simple dockerfile that basically just installs the package and then runs it.
- marderfarker2 5y ago
  I’ve deployed Python desktop apps quite successfully by using onedir with pysintaller and then package the contents using NSIS.
- codethief 5y ago
  > There isn’t a great way to pass around a single executable or installer for a Python app. Have you tried Nuitka or mypyc? (Haven't tried them myself but I've heard very good things about Nuitka.)
  - nerdponx 5y ago
    Also Briefcase: https://beeware.org/project/projects/tools/briefcase/ https://beeware.org/project/projects/tools/briefcase/. "Convert a Python project into a standalone native application."
  - stult 5y ago
    Personally I have not. I have only had one particularly weird use case where I really needed to deliver a Python executable alongside an Electron app, and made it work with Pyinstaller. We’re actually reworking things to use Pyodide to compile the Python to WASM so we don’t have to deliver any separate Python code at all. It’s a real Rube Goldberg machine of an application, but we had a lot of weird constraints we had to meet (eg, we couldn’t use sockets to communicate between Python and Node, so had to package the Python as an executable). It works beautifully but it was a mess to get running.

Docker was made for development and testing of code, not production. It has been co-opted for production with good success. It seems fine to do it for hobbyist projects, but still feels dirty in a commercial setting.

ramtatatam 5y ago
I'm using docker in commercial environments for years and cannot complain... But I don't distribute software, which is where the problem is probably more visible.
iainmerrick 5y ago
Why?
- willis936 5y ago
  Why what?
evgen 5y ago
The largest internet services on the planet were using LXC containers for production ops before you ever heard of the term 'docker'. In its earliest iterations it was easier to push a container to production than to run it on your laptop.
- KaiserPro 5y ago
  > using LXC containers for production which isn't docker. From what I recall, spotify were the first company with a large footprint to use docker. However for some reason they skipped VMs and went screaming into docker when it was _very_ new. Personally that seemed like a mistake, but you know, each to their own. If you're wanting to get into a bun fight about containers, then IBM 360 and JCL has some time for you.
Daishiman 5y ago
If we stopped using software in prod because it feels "dirty" we would not be using computers at all.

stult 5y ago

Desktop/local usage, especially for non technical users or people working in environments where they can’t install docker (eg locked down corporate machine). There isn’t a great way to pass around a single executable or installer for a Python app. There’s pyinstaller, but it’s finicky and doesn’t quite work cross platform (you have to build the executable on the target OS). On the other hand, OP’s setup makes it very easy to publish packages. So you can create a tarball and have a user pip install that, then run your app with a simple CLI. Or publish to pypi if you want it public. The downside is you assume the user has the right version of Python and knows how to switch versions if need be and all the weirdness that comes with that. But for web apps, packaging your app also makes it easy to wrap in a simple dockerfile that basically just installs the package and then runs it.

marderfarker2 5y ago
I’ve deployed Python desktop apps quite successfully by using onedir with pysintaller and then package the contents using NSIS.
codethief 5y ago
> There isn’t a great way to pass around a single executable or installer for a Python app. Have you tried Nuitka or mypyc? (Haven't tried them myself but I've heard very good things about Nuitka.)
- nerdponx 5y ago
  Also Briefcase: https://beeware.org/project/projects/tools/briefcase/ https://beeware.org/project/projects/tools/briefcase/. "Convert a Python project into a standalone native application."
- stult 5y ago
  Personally I have not. I have only had one particularly weird use case where I really needed to deliver a Python executable alongside an Electron app, and made it work with Pyinstaller. We’re actually reworking things to use Pyodide to compile the Python to WASM so we don’t have to deliver any separate Python code at all. It’s a real Rube Goldberg machine of an application, but we had a lot of weird constraints we had to meet (eg, we couldn’t use sockets to communicate between Python and Node, so had to package the Python as an executable). It works beautifully but it was a mess to get running.