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I have a friend that spends 500$ / month on water alone. This person thinks they might have a pool leak, but hasn't looked into in the past 2 years. My parent

I have a friend that spends 500$ / month on water alone. This person thinks they might have a pool leak, but hasn't looked into in the past 2 years. My parents use 900kwh of electricity / month and complain that PG&E are ripping them off when their bill is 400$ / month. Have they bothered to do anything to bring down their consumption? Nope. I have a T2 diabetic friend that complains about the cost of insulin, yet refuses to exercise and loose weight. People have not been suckered into anything. Most people lack the agency to change their circumstances.

zemvpferreira 5y ago
I don't mean to put those people down - it is what it is. I'm privileged to be able to live frugally without sacrifice. I do object however at calling your parents' utility costs essential or mandatory. I hope some good counterexamples can help them/others see it's not impossible to spend less if they invest their energy in making changes.
- kiba 5y ago
  It is a good idea to lower your utility cost, but the utility can still charge outrageous prices.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
kiba 5y ago
I have a T2 diabetic friend that complains about the cost of insulin, yet refuses to exercise and loose weight. Losing weight and keeping the weight is hard. It isn't a coincidence that we have an obesity epidemic for a reason. Suppose your friend did try to lose weight? More likely than not your friend will gain weight back. Yes, there's no excuse to try. but there's no expectation of success. People have not been suckered into anything. Most people lack the agency to change their circumstances. This is called learned helplessness and it is a big problem, but there are also contributing problems other than learned helplessness, such as structural problems surrounding housing options. In any case, blaming people for their lack of moral fortitude isn't really a solution at all. It means we stopped asking questions and looking for solutions.
- anonuser123456 5y ago
  In the case of weight loss, just knowing that regaining weight is likely is very atypical. Most dieters labor under the delusion they will be part of the 3% that can make a permanent change. I don't think that's de-motivating a considerable portion of people from making the change. I do not believe the status quo bias is learned helplessness. I believe it is the natural state of most people and that rational agency is an outlier. We are, as individuals, extremely predisposed to just doing what we do and discounting alternatives.
  - adrianN 5y ago
    Most dieters labor under the delusion that they can stop dieting after a couple of weeks, return to their previous eating habits, and not regain the fat. This is actively encouraged by most of the dieting industry, so it's not surprising.
- beebeepka 5y ago
  What is so hard about not consuming a lot more food than you need? It's an honest question
  - anonuser123456 5y ago
    We do not currently know why it is so hard. Empirically it is know to be true. But it is clear that parts of the brain involved in feeding behavior can override the cortex.
    - lotsofpulp 5y ago
      It is hard because bad habits are hard to break. It starts in childhood for most people, and parents who foster an environment full of soda, junk food, and other sugar/carb/sat fat/salt/alcohol laden foods basically decide their kids’ future for the most part. And, of course, people use food to deal with stress. You drink water almost all the time and eat mostly green stuff, you should be fine.
bluescrn 5y ago
Exercise and weight loss won't fix the obscenity that is the US healthcare system
cloudfifty 5y ago
> My parents use 900kwh of electricity / month and complain that PG&E are ripping them off when their bill is 400$ / month. Well, in Sweden the price for that would be $160. You seem to be kicking downwards by reflex.
watwut 5y ago
> I have a T2 diabetic friend that complains about the cost of insulin, yet refuses to exercise and loose weight Neither of those cures diabetes. It can help little but, but if he needs insulin he will continue to need insulin. There is no cure currently. Also, insulin has no reason to be expensive.
- anonuser123456 5y ago
  The statement that you cannot 'cure' T2 diabetes with weight loss is semantic sleight of hand. You can absolutely regain normal glycemic control by weight loss and exercise. People diagnosed with T2 diabetes who lose weight and re-gain it will lose control of their blood glucose with the regained weight. For semantic reasons, this is called remission, not 'curative'. Note this is also seen in people who lose weight via gastric bypass. Note this does not apply to T1 or mixed T1, T2 diabetics.
nine_k 5y ago
Losing weight while controlling one's blood sugar is not as easy (harhar) as losing weight while being otherwise healthy. Exercise and dieting still work but need a whole lot more of planning and monitoring. T2 diabetes has been successfully cured by a special diet and exercise — but inside a hospital due to these needs of constant micromanagement. If you have e.g. a day job, it becomes much less realistic.

zemvpferreira 5y ago

I don't mean to put those people down - it is what it is. I'm privileged to be able to live frugally without sacrifice. I do object however at calling your parents' utility costs essential or mandatory. I hope some good counterexamples can help them/others see it's not impossible to spend less if they invest their energy in making changes.

kiba 5y ago
It is a good idea to lower your utility cost, but the utility can still charge outrageous prices.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

kiba 5y ago

I have a T2 diabetic friend that complains about the cost of insulin, yet refuses to exercise and loose weight. Losing weight and keeping the weight is hard. It isn't a coincidence that we have an obesity epidemic for a reason. Suppose your friend did try to lose weight? More likely than not your friend will gain weight back. Yes, there's no excuse to try. but there's no expectation of success. People have not been suckered into anything. Most people lack the agency to change their circumstances. This is called learned helplessness and it is a big problem, but there are also contributing problems other than learned helplessness, such as structural problems surrounding housing options. In any case, blaming people for their lack of moral fortitude isn't really a solution at all. It means we stopped asking questions and looking for solutions.

anonuser123456 5y ago
In the case of weight loss, just knowing that regaining weight is likely is very atypical. Most dieters labor under the delusion they will be part of the 3% that can make a permanent change. I don't think that's de-motivating a considerable portion of people from making the change. I do not believe the status quo bias is learned helplessness. I believe it is the natural state of most people and that rational agency is an outlier. We are, as individuals, extremely predisposed to just doing what we do and discounting alternatives.
- adrianN 5y ago
  Most dieters labor under the delusion that they can stop dieting after a couple of weeks, return to their previous eating habits, and not regain the fat. This is actively encouraged by most of the dieting industry, so it's not surprising.
beebeepka 5y ago
What is so hard about not consuming a lot more food than you need? It's an honest question
- anonuser123456 5y ago
  We do not currently know why it is so hard. Empirically it is know to be true. But it is clear that parts of the brain involved in feeding behavior can override the cortex.
  - lotsofpulp 5y ago
    It is hard because bad habits are hard to break. It starts in childhood for most people, and parents who foster an environment full of soda, junk food, and other sugar/carb/sat fat/salt/alcohol laden foods basically decide their kids’ future for the most part. And, of course, people use food to deal with stress. You drink water almost all the time and eat mostly green stuff, you should be fine.

bluescrn 5y ago

Exercise and weight loss won't fix the obscenity that is the US healthcare system

cloudfifty 5y ago

> My parents use 900kwh of electricity / month and complain that PG&E are ripping them off when their bill is 400$ / month. Well, in Sweden the price for that would be $160. You seem to be kicking downwards by reflex.

watwut 5y ago

> I have a T2 diabetic friend that complains about the cost of insulin, yet refuses to exercise and loose weight Neither of those cures diabetes. It can help little but, but if he needs insulin he will continue to need insulin. There is no cure currently. Also, insulin has no reason to be expensive.

anonuser123456 5y ago
The statement that you cannot 'cure' T2 diabetes with weight loss is semantic sleight of hand. You can absolutely regain normal glycemic control by weight loss and exercise. People diagnosed with T2 diabetes who lose weight and re-gain it will lose control of their blood glucose with the regained weight. For semantic reasons, this is called remission, not 'curative'. Note this is also seen in people who lose weight via gastric bypass. Note this does not apply to T1 or mixed T1, T2 diabetics.

nine_k 5y ago

Losing weight while controlling one's blood sugar is not as easy (harhar) as losing weight while being otherwise healthy. Exercise and dieting still work but need a whole lot more of planning and monitoring. T2 diabetes has been successfully cured by a special diet and exercise — but inside a hospital due to these needs of constant micromanagement. If you have e.g. a day job, it becomes much less realistic.