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Gap to close all 81 stores in UK and Ireland
- an_opabinia 5y agoFrom a former Gap exec: > How did your time at The Gap shape your thinking about what you do at Herman Miller? > I interviewed a guy who became my head of digital. He had worked in retail, and he said, “Do you know what excites me most about coming to this industry? I feel like I’m going from making landfill to making heirlooms.” The fashion industry is the landfill industry.
- helloplanets 5y agoMaking a generalization off of that specific anecdote is pretty unfair IMO, there's a huge difference between Gap and Herman Miller. Gap is closer to IKEA while Herman Miller is closer to a well tailored suit. A range of quality exists in both industries.
- ryanlol 5y agoThe fast fashion industry is the landfill industry.
- homero 5y agoMuch less toxic than most landfill though
- qmmmur 5y agoIn what sense? Clothes contain tonnes of a chemicals which break down when left in the ground and the rate which we are dumping them is disgusting.
- ClumsyPilot 5y agoA cotton t-shitt doesn't contain 'chemicals', but a synthetic one is obviously made of microplastic, and it's manufacturing process might produce them and release them .
- colinjoy 5y agothat statement is false for the majority of cotton clothing. from dyes to preservation or even agents that prevent wrinkles, a new cotton shirt can be blessed with a nice array of potentially carcinogenic substances. and since you mention the manufacturing process: look up some studies on the deaths and environmental havoc caused by pesticides used in cotton production. chemicals are everywhere.
- ClumsyPilot 5y agoDyes are meant to be non-toxic, pesticides are super dangerous, but they are meant to decay in a few weeks, I dont know anything aboit wrincle agents.
- teclordphrack2 5y ago"Dyes are meant to be non-toxic" On a shirt? Yes. In your drinking water? No.
- globular-toast 5y agoThere is also the water consumption. One cotton t-shirt uses more than 2000 litres of water. That's about a month's worth of daily showers. It wouldn't be too bad if the garment would last 10+ years, but they don't. Unfortunately the people (mostly women) who drive this are addicted to the churn of clothes. It's not about a basic need to be warm and protected. It's about maintaining a constant source of novelty by buying new clothes almost every week. In my experience, half of the clothes they buy don't fit and/or they don't like them when they get them home. When I was little my mum used to buy most our clothes second hand from car boot sales and the like. I can't believe people buy brand new children's clothes. You know they are going to grow out of them. Unfortunately, in the UK at least, second-hand clothes have been largely stigmatised and many people won't even consider them. I have recently seen apps which specialise in second-hand clothes. This would be great but I think it's going to take a lot to convince people not to think of clothes and consumables.
- himinlomax 5y ago> There is also the water consumption. One cotton t-shirt uses more than 2000 litres of water. That's about a month's worth of daily showers. It wouldn't be too bad if the garment would last 10+ years, but they don't. What does that even mean? Does the water just disappear?
- jonplackett 5y agoNo but it had to be turned into fresh water suitable for use which uses energy and also can’t be used by someone else. There are water shortages all over the place.
- himinlomax 5y agoWell those areas with low water shouldn't be used to grow cotton, like almonds shouldn't be grown in water-poor California to make vegan milk ersatz. Instead, cattle adapted to grazing in those arid areas could be a better and more environmentally friendly use of the land.
- bgeeek 5y agoFor me that depends on the position in the market. I doubt some of the major clothes designers feel quite the same way.
- tebbers 5y agoTheir quality dropped a long, long time ago. I would never buy anything there now. I'm wearing a plain white Gap t shirt today - only 5 years old and not worn much, but the fabric is very thin and has stretched comically.
- throwawaysea 5y agoIt sounds like a move made out of desperation. But personally I don't see them surviving the online marketplace long-term. At least in a mall your competition is limited to the local stores. Online, it's everyone. Want to offer cheap clothing? You are competing with everyone from H&M to Amazon Essentials (https://www.amazon.com/stores/page/F8FB6F3C-F896-455C-BC52-7879F4CEF0CF/ https://www.amazon.com/stores/page/F8FB6F3C-F896-455C-BC52-7...). Want to offer slightly better quality at slightly higher prices? Congratulations, you're now going to face off against Uniqlo (https://www.uniqlo.com https://www.uniqlo.com). Want to go higher? Then you need quality and brand power, which are hard to recover once you go for cheaper fast fashion the way Gap has. I struggle to identify a competitive advantage for Gap.
- underseacables 5y agoWell, that doesn’t work for everyone, there are still some of us out here that would really like to try on clothes before we buy them. I hate having to return something that doesn’t fit, I don’t care how easy they try to make it, if I had tried it on at a retailer first, it would have saved us time, money, and effort.
- tayo42 5y agoIdk if that's really a big deal, they already compete at other prices with old navy and banana republic. Unless those are struggling brands too, that would be news to me.
- tonyedgecombe 5y agoThe UK high street was struggling before Covid came along. I suspect it's going to be decimated when we come out of furlough.
- Reason077 5y agoJudging by all the signs up in windows, many retailers (and pubs/restaurants) seem to be struggling to find staff right now, at least in London. There can’t be that many retail workers still on the furlough scheme?
- karlward 5y agoThat is partially (probably mostly) due to brexit - https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/may/17/uk-faces-labour-shortage-as-covid-and-brexit-fuel-exodus-of-overseas-workers https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/may/17/uk-faces-la... which is mostly being felt in hospitality and retail.
- bencollier49 5y agoInteresting problem - we're going to have to downgrade people's aspirations if we're not going to import people to do base-level jobs. Will cause social unrest.
- Reason077 5y agoNot sure that anyone's aspirations need to be downgraded. Businesses may need to be more willing to invest in efficiency improvements and automation. They may need to take on and train lower-skilled employees that they might not have considered before. And pay higher wages to attract the skills/talent they need.
- airpoint 5y ago…and they’ll be trying to get that investment back from the customer by charging £9+ for a glass of red wine, sigh
- sirius87 5y agoI wonder if this is a short-term strategy to force commercial property rents further down, and re-enter when they hit a feasible low. In India, GAP apparently uses their retail stores in an omnichannel strategy to "warehouse" products closer to customers in an attempt to provide next-day delivery. [1] [1] https://yourstory.com/2021/06/fashion-brands-omnichannel-flipkart-amazon-unicommerce/ https://yourstory.com/2021/06/fashion-brands-omnichannel-fli... (paywalled, use reader-mode)
- dageshi 5y agoYou might need to do that in India, in the UK it's so small relatively speaking that a couple of distribution centers in the right places can probably serve the entire country.
- WesleyHale 5y ago> In India, GAP apparently uses their retail stores in an omnichannel strategy to "warehouse" products closer to customers in an attempt to provide next-day delivery. I believe this is the eventual move a lot of brick and mortar stores are going to make to compete with Amazon. I've been told by a Best Buy manager their end goal is to turn a majority of their stores into fulfilment centers.
- detritus 5y agoThis is what Sainsbury's appear to be doing - consolidating some of their Argos branches with larger Sainsburys stores and added general fulfillment centres. Not sure if this is across the country, but it was interesting to see the apparently-quick turnaround during Lockdown at some local stores here.
- radiKal07 5y agoWhat about their partnership with Yeezy? I thought that's going to save them.
- trwhite 5y agoFor tall guys, Gap is one of the few places you can buy 36" leg trousers and jeans. I wouldn't consider buying them anywhere else and the quality is pretty good too. I wonder if they even realise they almost have a monopoly on that.
- ppf 5y agoIt's a struggle, looking for long-leg trousers in the UK. Next also has them, and their one-from-cheapest range is good enough for me.
- mywacaday 5y agoI get nearly all my jeans from Next, they are the only retailer I trust to be consistent in their sizing across styles, makes buying from them online much easier. Other retailers could learn a lot I'm that area alone.
- Kaotique 5y agoI'm 1.70m tall and living in the Netherlands with exactly the opposite problem. Most pants and other clothes are for taller men. I used to buy my clothes in River Island which had a good fit, but they closed the store last year. Buying men's clothes outside the norm is a pain.
- ivrrimum 5y agoGod, i need to lose weight
- lukas099 5y agoYep, Gap is good for talloids like us.
- Mumps 5y agobut what about 'long torso' tall folk? I'm yet to ever find a good place for that - beside bespoke clothes (which just feels weird to order a v-neck from)
- 5y ago
- chrisstu 5y agoI'd say things have been heading south for Gap UK shops for the last 10 years and accelerated recently. They have been on a downward quality path for a long time with no apparent strategy. Every time you go back, they have different ranges, so no repeat purchases are even possible. Found something you like and want to buy again? Tough. And the quality got progressively worse. For basics like jeans and t-shirts, I switched to H&M and Muji about 5 years ago. I suspect we will lose Muji soon as well though.
- detritus 5y agoWhy do you think we'll lose Muji? Presumably you've tried UniQlo too?
- chrisstu 5y agoI base the Muji prediction on their hopeless online presence, frequently changing stock items, the lack of customers in the clothing section and my experience with other UK retailers. I hope I'm wrong. I've tried UniQlo but so far have been unable to find an item I want to buy in there. I seem to recall on a recent visit that their winter coats have goose down, which I avoid.
- detritus 5y ago> I base the Muji prediction on their hopeless online presence Isn't that "A Thing" with Japanese companies? :) Well, as long as their retail stores don't all disappear, I'm ok - I don't much like shopping for stuff like thay sell online.
- ksec 5y agoMuji is very very very late to online purchase. Mostly because of their attitude that customer should go to the store and see the product first. But that is changing, my guess is that UK is lower down on the list for those upgrade. I mean those online improvement only started with Japan and China in the last few years.
- bgeeek 5y ago
- kerrsclyde 5y agoThey were deep discounting everything, it couldn't continue. I bought my 3-year old three hoodies last month for £10, and the quality of their stuff I found was still good.
- henvic 5y agoI've been working on a startup (owned by a large fashion corp.) that develops a digital showroom for the fashion industry, and this is a clear shift I've been noticing. It's quite interesting.
- bgeeek 5y agoGap's problems for me: 1) Sticking Gap on everything. That kind-of logo/advertisement in huge lettering is great on the way up, but not on the way down. Superdry take note. You could not pay me to wear either. 2) Pricing and price point. It's frankly been bizarre for years. Overpriced when compared to new competitors, such as Uniqlo. Not quite good enough to compete with other stores, such as Levi's or more designer brands. Its position in the market felt awkward in recent times. I still buy chinos and plain t-shirts from Gap. No logo and so nobody knows. Despite their crazy vanity sizing, they still offer a range of sizes unlike Uniqlo, which only offers tailoring in-store at present in the UK.
- durnygbur 5y ago> 1) Tommy Hilfiger and Guess are doing the same and it's obnoxious.
- bgeeek 5y agoAgreed, although they're not at the same price point in the market and haven't run into problems yet, at least not here in the UK. There was a period in time where Gap rapidly expanded and had stores almost everywhere. Once the shoppers deserted the brand, the logos themselves became a problem itself, at least for those of us that were bothered by it :) The logos/branding can be good, but also a massive negative once its no longer a desirable brand.
- dayvid 5y ago1) The only thing GAP has going for them IS brand recognition. Otherwise, they’re in some weird in-between of Old Navy and Banana Republic and there are numerous brands out there that have taken their market share (H&M, Uniqlo, etc.).
- bgeeek 5y agoNot in the UK - Old Navy is unknown here, Banana Republic pretty much the same (you can buy it online). H&M, Uniqlo, and Zara have certainly affected Gap's standing in the market.
- durnygbur 5y agoMy dream is not paying 100-200 EUR for clothing which cost 1-10 EUR to produce. Don't care about your lifestyle, philosophy, trends, influencers, brand and logo. I want it vulgar - cash for good quality clothes.
- dalmo3 5y agoWhat's stopping you?
- durnygbur 5y agoMost new jeans, jackets, sweaters, chinos, trouses, etc below 50-60 EUR per item look and wear like rags.
- open-source-ux 5y agoThere are lots of mid-price clothing retailers across Europe who produce reasonable quality clothes (better than Primark quality). I find it hard to believe these stores sell poor quality chinos, jeans, etc in the 30-50 price range. Having said that, I'm sure everyone has a story of how a cheaply priced item of clothing turned out to be of better quality and durability than a equalivent expensive item. (Aside: In the UK, I'd place clothing retailers like John Lewis and Marks & Spencer in the mid-price to high-price category.)
- sveme 5y agoIn Germany, there's also the excellent grundstoff.net, which has remarkably cheap basics that are still of high quality and fairly produced. Highly recommended to anyone who is in Europe (though I don't know whether they deliver outside the EU).
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- e2e4 5y agoUniqlo
- thenanyu 5y agoWorth keeping in mind that Old Navy continues to print money and Athleta grows at a very healthy pace for them. Gap is like Facebook blue app.
- bgeeek 5y agoNot in the UK it doesn't. Old Navy is unknown here.
- twobitshifter 5y agoLooking at old navy versus gap - gap no longer has any point of differentiation from their sister store. Why would I want to spend more at the gap for the same cheap quality as at old navy? The clothes are generic, and there’s not anything that the Gap has that makes them cooler, better designed, or a better value than something anywhere else. Looking broader Uniqlo at least has some points of differentiation with their sizing and styling, and primark beats the gap and everyone else on price.
- bgeeek 5y agoOld Navy doesn't exist in the UK, though. Primark is something else entirely - it beats everyone on price, but attracts a different shopper.
- physicsguy 5y agoMy sister used to work at Primark. Someone once urinated in the changing rooms... grim.
- gpvos 5y agoI never buy clothes online (apart from t-shirts). Have they fixed the problem that returned items are thrown away instead of used again?
- qwerty456127 5y agoI would never prefer to buy anything online except in cases when it really is much cheaper this way and there is a pick-up place available during evenings. Delivery is never convenient (as I rarely am at home when they deliver) and pick-up places, when available, also tend to work very inconvenient hours.
- sergiomattei 5y agoDo young folks even buy at Gap?
- RicoElectrico 5y agoTangential: Can someone from the industry chime in and say what was the reason for a drastic degradation in fabric quality over the last decade? I have some T-shirts from 10 years ago and they hold color, and didn't become fuzzy after dozen washes. The only keyword I was able to find regarding cotton fabric quality was "ring-spun" vs "open-end" cotton. The brand in question is Cropp (of Polish LPP, which makes most T-shirts in Bangladesh), but this degradation seems to be industry-wide. Even buying T-shirts from higher positioned brands doesn't make a difference. They're all crap quality.
- listenallyall 5y agoAmerican Apparel still exists as an online-only brand... wonder what their sales are. However it is owned by Gildan and despite the name, most of its goods are NOT made in America. Dov Charney (AA's founder) now runs Los Angeles Apparel, which does produce all its clothes in the U.S. (Los Angeles), and is employee-owned.
- bgeeek 5y agoI can remember when they were the hot thing in fast fashion, but they were pretty much crushed due to the horrendously bad PR. Grim company.
- listenallyall 5y agoGrim is a funny word here. AA was a small local company that, over a 20 year period, outsmarted and out-sold the giants of the clothing industry. And unlike those giant companies, all products were made domestically, sweatshop-free, at relatively high wages, while providing opportunities for undocumented workers. Of course instead of focusing on anything positive, the press decided it didn't like the male founder and kept reporting on sexual harassment allegations that were never proven and mostly not even addressed in a court of law. And eventually about 2400 workers (says Wikipedia) lost their jobs when the new owner decided to make "American Apparel" somewhere besides America. Yea, that last part is pretty grim, actually.
- bgeeek 5y agoI take it you saw the photos then?