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As a counterpoint, QR code menus work very well in China. I've been to places where you scan the code to open a menu that lets you place all your orders. You ca

by er4hn 5y ago

As a counterpoint, QR code menus work very well in China. I've been to places where you scan the code to open a menu that lets you place all your orders. You can also pay for your table via per table QR codes. As a side note, you don't customarily tip in restaurants in China, so a non high-end place with good food will typically have rushed and curt wait staff. Ordering through the phone will give you a better experience!

barbazoo 5y ago
If only we could upload the food more efficiently. Then we wouldn't need restaurants at all.
dabfiend19 5y ago
every restaurant and bar I've been to in Brooklyn in the last week now also has the menu, ordering, and payment entirely through the QR codes. most using the Toast platform. I don't see this trend going back the other way.
whimsicalism 5y ago
It would be lovely if we could move closer to the Chinese consumer model re: QR codes in general. Wechat pay/Alipay are incredibly convenient.
- seanmcdirmid 5y ago
  I find paying via QR code to be much less convenient than NFC that is more popular in the west. Tap and pay is really quick, especially in countries like Australia.
  - Spivak 5y ago
    With "App Clips" or "Instant Apps" or whatever you want to call them QR codes for me take the lead again. Get a receipt at the table, open camera, scan, app pops up with receipt, add tip, click click pay, done. Skipping the second waiter trip to swipe all the cards or the awkwardness of bringing out the PoS system to the table is immediately worth it to me.
    - seanmcdirmid 5y ago
      Ya, I get that. Red Robin has screens/computers/payment kiosks at each table to avoid that problem. They won't use QR codes at sit down restaurants in the states for payments because of tipping, however. Psychologically, you are more likely to tip more if the waiter is directly involved in the billing.
  - whimsicalism 5y ago
    Hm, maybe. But can they afford to have an NFC reader at every single table? Can street vendors without access to electricity/mobile connection just hold up a QR code cut into some wood and you can pay that way? NFC seems to put the onus on the vendor, Wechat pay/Alipay has no such problem. It's definitely not quick in the US, where it hasn't been really adopted at the same level, it might be fast in Australia.
    - seanmcdirmid 5y ago
      Different culture. You pay at one place, no or few street vendors, modern convenience stores abound. I've seen and used NFC pads attached to cellphones using Square adapters, so you can go that route if you want. NFC is definitely much faster in Australia than in the USA.
- cunthorpe 5y ago
  Unlocking your phone, opening an app, possibly unlocking that one, tapping to scan, and then accept is NOT more convenient than NFC in your card. Unless your talking about costs. For private free money transfer, the US and many other places have similar if not better methods.
  - barbazoo 5y ago
    Or NFC in your phone. I can't imagine it being more convenient than that.
    - samatman 5y ago
      NFC on my watch is in fact more convenient than NFC on my phone. The difference is slight, but real.
      - barbazoo 5y ago
        Is there a good smart watch that's not an iWatch?
        foxpurple 5y ago
        Not yet.
        jbluepolarbear 5y ago
        Google dropped the ball on wearable tech. Apples slow but steady increase of features has made it hard for competitors to catch up.
        jabroni_salad 5y ago
        If NFC isn't common in your area and you really want to do watch payments, you can do Samsung Pay on any terminal with a magstrip reader, which is all of them.
      - KptMarchewa 5y ago
        You have to use watch then, and having something on my hand is not convenient (or, maybe, pleasant) for me.
vxNsr 5y ago
>so a non high-end place with good food will typically have rushed and curt wait staff. Ordering through the phone will give you a better experience! Not sure why that’s something we want to encourage.
- wokwokwok 5y ago
  Talk about low value comments. Why not? Just because you don’t like it doesn’t mean it’s not actually better for some people and some situations. This is obviously a decent use case for QR code’s; your comments seem just like you don’t like it, and you’re not interested in even considering any other option.
  - Cederfjard 5y ago
    I’m assuming that the GP is an American used to American standards of being waited on (where the staff are incentivized by tips and thus have to impress their customers), and so does not want ”rushed and curt” service to be encouraged (which would diminish their experience), rather than them having an aversion to QR codes per se.
  - vxNsr 5y ago
    Because encouraging people to be rude to each other is distasteful, I thought it was obvious. Similarly, calling someone a “low value comment” and then taking the least charitable view of their comment is directly against hn community guidelines.
seanmcdirmid 5y ago
Unless you are a visiting foreigner without cell phone service and the WiFi requires you to login with a working cell phone number, then you are in 没办法 territory.
- advanced-DnD 5y ago
  As an overseas Chinese visiting China, the cashier always look at me weirdly when I told them (in Chinese) I don't have online wallet/mobile internet. They think I'm taking them for a laugh.
- 542354234235 5y ago
  Somehow I think that a visiting foreigner that can read Chinese to order off a paper menu is probably also going to have a working phone number in China. Someone that can't read Chinese and needs to use their phone for google translate is probably not going to be able to order off a paper menu either.
  - seanmcdirmid 5y ago
    You’d be surprised how many overseas Chinese (who have immigrated to somewhere else) who are visiting China are trapped by this. And even foreigners who don’t read Chinese can pick out certain characters of the food they like to eat (you don’t need to read Chinese very well to recognize stereotypical 宫保鸡丁). China is really bad at exceptions. Many of those restaurants have gotten rid of their paper menus (which didn’t have English anyways, so they aren’t worried about foreigners). It’s like the train station kiosks that can’t deal with you if you don’t have a Chinese ID card.
    - whimsicalism 5y ago
      Yes, it is helpful to have cell service, both in China and in the United States.
      - seanmcdirmid 5y ago
        You can get by without cell phone service in the USA. On all my business trips back to the USA while living in China, I didn't have much a problem (free open wifi is pretty common, you can even use Uber pretty easily without a phone number). In China...if someone else can get you a SIM, you'll be OK, or maybe you can get one at the airport in customs (that used to be possible), though they have been cracking down on SIMs without ID numbers or resident visas associated with them.
dheera 5y ago
Also because WeChat scans QR codes very fast, and you have to only hit 1 tap to do the whole thing. Once WeChat sees a QR it opens the link immediately and automatically. The ordering also makes it more useful. Most restaurants in US just have a horrible HTML 1.0 menu with no ordering system, no pictures, and sometimes even goddamn frames. With default Android it's like Home -> swipe -> camera -> 模式 -> 智慧鏡頭 and then point at the QR code while trying to tap the link that pops up as a tiny tooltip on the screen at the same time without making it go out of focus at the same time. It's awful.
- Liquid_Fire 5y ago
  I don't have stock Android on my phone so this may be a feature my manufacturer has added, but I'm pretty sure you can press the shutter button instead of clicking on the popup to open the QR code. Also, as others have pointed out, with Firefox you can scan and open a QR core in two taps, so no need to go to the camera app at all.
vmception 5y ago
Same experience scattered across US as well, aside from compulsory tipping and added sympathy for service industry working - different conversation but I do love paying with Apple Pay, I always hated how wait staff doesn't carry around Point of Sale systems in the US and that it takes multiple steps to 1) wait to get their attention again to get the bill 2) wait to get their attention again to pay for the bill 3) wait for them to return with your payment method and hope they don't get sidetracked. Now its down to just 1) in places with QR codes on receipts.

by er4hn 5y ago

barbazoo 5y ago

If only we could upload the food more efficiently. Then we wouldn't need restaurants at all.

dabfiend19 5y ago

every restaurant and bar I've been to in Brooklyn in the last week now also has the menu, ordering, and payment entirely through the QR codes. most using the Toast platform. I don't see this trend going back the other way.

whimsicalism 5y ago

It would be lovely if we could move closer to the Chinese consumer model re: QR codes in general. Wechat pay/Alipay are incredibly convenient.

seanmcdirmid 5y ago
I find paying via QR code to be much less convenient than NFC that is more popular in the west. Tap and pay is really quick, especially in countries like Australia.
- Spivak 5y ago
  With "App Clips" or "Instant Apps" or whatever you want to call them QR codes for me take the lead again. Get a receipt at the table, open camera, scan, app pops up with receipt, add tip, click click pay, done. Skipping the second waiter trip to swipe all the cards or the awkwardness of bringing out the PoS system to the table is immediately worth it to me.
  - seanmcdirmid 5y ago
    Ya, I get that. Red Robin has screens/computers/payment kiosks at each table to avoid that problem. They won't use QR codes at sit down restaurants in the states for payments because of tipping, however. Psychologically, you are more likely to tip more if the waiter is directly involved in the billing.
- whimsicalism 5y ago
  Hm, maybe. But can they afford to have an NFC reader at every single table? Can street vendors without access to electricity/mobile connection just hold up a QR code cut into some wood and you can pay that way? NFC seems to put the onus on the vendor, Wechat pay/Alipay has no such problem. It's definitely not quick in the US, where it hasn't been really adopted at the same level, it might be fast in Australia.
  - seanmcdirmid 5y ago
    Different culture. You pay at one place, no or few street vendors, modern convenience stores abound. I've seen and used NFC pads attached to cellphones using Square adapters, so you can go that route if you want. NFC is definitely much faster in Australia than in the USA.
cunthorpe 5y ago
Unlocking your phone, opening an app, possibly unlocking that one, tapping to scan, and then accept is NOT more convenient than NFC in your card. Unless your talking about costs. For private free money transfer, the US and many other places have similar if not better methods.
- barbazoo 5y ago
  Or NFC in your phone. I can't imagine it being more convenient than that.
  - samatman 5y ago
    NFC on my watch is in fact more convenient than NFC on my phone. The difference is slight, but real.
    - barbazoo 5y ago
      Is there a good smart watch that's not an iWatch?
      - foxpurple 5y ago
        Not yet.
      - jbluepolarbear 5y ago
        Google dropped the ball on wearable tech. Apples slow but steady increase of features has made it hard for competitors to catch up.
      - jabroni_salad 5y ago
        If NFC isn't common in your area and you really want to do watch payments, you can do Samsung Pay on any terminal with a magstrip reader, which is all of them.
    - KptMarchewa 5y ago
      You have to use watch then, and having something on my hand is not convenient (or, maybe, pleasant) for me.

vxNsr 5y ago

>so a non high-end place with good food will typically have rushed and curt wait staff. Ordering through the phone will give you a better experience! Not sure why that’s something we want to encourage.

wokwokwok 5y ago
Talk about low value comments. Why not? Just because you don’t like it doesn’t mean it’s not actually better for some people and some situations. This is obviously a decent use case for QR code’s; your comments seem just like you don’t like it, and you’re not interested in even considering any other option.
- Cederfjard 5y ago
  I’m assuming that the GP is an American used to American standards of being waited on (where the staff are incentivized by tips and thus have to impress their customers), and so does not want ”rushed and curt” service to be encouraged (which would diminish their experience), rather than them having an aversion to QR codes per se.
- vxNsr 5y ago
  Because encouraging people to be rude to each other is distasteful, I thought it was obvious. Similarly, calling someone a “low value comment” and then taking the least charitable view of their comment is directly against hn community guidelines.

seanmcdirmid 5y ago

Unless you are a visiting foreigner without cell phone service and the WiFi requires you to login with a working cell phone number, then you are in 没办法 territory.

advanced-DnD 5y ago
As an overseas Chinese visiting China, the cashier always look at me weirdly when I told them (in Chinese) I don't have online wallet/mobile internet. They think I'm taking them for a laugh.
542354234235 5y ago
Somehow I think that a visiting foreigner that can read Chinese to order off a paper menu is probably also going to have a working phone number in China. Someone that can't read Chinese and needs to use their phone for google translate is probably not going to be able to order off a paper menu either.
- seanmcdirmid 5y ago
  You’d be surprised how many overseas Chinese (who have immigrated to somewhere else) who are visiting China are trapped by this. And even foreigners who don’t read Chinese can pick out certain characters of the food they like to eat (you don’t need to read Chinese very well to recognize stereotypical 宫保鸡丁). China is really bad at exceptions. Many of those restaurants have gotten rid of their paper menus (which didn’t have English anyways, so they aren’t worried about foreigners). It’s like the train station kiosks that can’t deal with you if you don’t have a Chinese ID card.
  - whimsicalism 5y ago
    Yes, it is helpful to have cell service, both in China and in the United States.
    - seanmcdirmid 5y ago
      You can get by without cell phone service in the USA. On all my business trips back to the USA while living in China, I didn't have much a problem (free open wifi is pretty common, you can even use Uber pretty easily without a phone number). In China...if someone else can get you a SIM, you'll be OK, or maybe you can get one at the airport in customs (that used to be possible), though they have been cracking down on SIMs without ID numbers or resident visas associated with them.

dheera 5y ago

Also because WeChat scans QR codes very fast, and you have to only hit 1 tap to do the whole thing. Once WeChat sees a QR it opens the link immediately and automatically. The ordering also makes it more useful. Most restaurants in US just have a horrible HTML 1.0 menu with no ordering system, no pictures, and sometimes even goddamn frames. With default Android it's like Home -> swipe -> camera -> 模式 -> 智慧鏡頭 and then point at the QR code while trying to tap the link that pops up as a tiny tooltip on the screen at the same time without making it go out of focus at the same time. It's awful.

Liquid_Fire 5y ago
I don't have stock Android on my phone so this may be a feature my manufacturer has added, but I'm pretty sure you can press the shutter button instead of clicking on the popup to open the QR code. Also, as others have pointed out, with Firefox you can scan and open a QR core in two taps, so no need to go to the camera app at all.

vmception 5y ago

Same experience scattered across US as well, aside from compulsory tipping and added sympathy for service industry working - different conversation but I do love paying with Apple Pay, I always hated how wait staff doesn't carry around Point of Sale systems in the US and that it takes multiple steps to 1) wait to get their attention again to get the bill 2) wait to get their attention again to pay for the bill 3) wait for them to return with your payment method and hope they don't get sidetracked. Now its down to just 1) in places with QR codes on receipts.