4 ms·
> There needs to be a wider discussion of responsibility of hosting providers for the actions of their customers How about holding the actual bullies accountab
by umvi 5y ago
> There needs to be a wider discussion of responsibility of hosting providers for the actions of their customers
How about holding the actual bullies accountable instead of shifting accountability to the ISP/Host? What happens in real life (i.e. outside the context of the internet) if bullies harass someone with hate mail until that person commits suicide? Does the blame shift away from the bullies to USPS or FedEx for failing to shield the recipient from the hate mail?
I could see a case made against kiwi farms, but cloudflare? They are infrastructure level and should not get in user content moderation imo
- falcolas 5y agoCloudflare has already proven willing to stop supporting sites based on their content. They’ve opened the doors, so it’s not unreasonable to expect that they could/would/should do it again.
- philpem 5y agoPeople have been complaining for years about some of the content they shield (KF especially). The site is responsible for at least one previous suicide. Their response is always the same... to forward the complaints onto the abuser for them to laugh at. Cloudflare has only ever intervened in matters like this when the mainstream press has given them an absolute and utter kicking. The sad fact is, when you have your own AS-number and peering agreement, you can do pretty much whatever you like on the Internet. De-peering a few of the worst network abusers and "it's not my problem, I just want the money" merchants would go a long way to improving the internet for the rest of us. This might seem hardline, but it's not without precedent: the precedent is the Internet itself, in its earlier days.
- shadowgovt 5y agoWould anything stop the de-peered providers from peeing with each other, leading to a balkanized internet?
- sitkack 5y agoISVs would love it, you could sign up for multiple networks. It would be like paying for a gateway provider to reach an existing walled garden like China.
- to11mtm 5y agoOne challenge that may be perceived is that while 'eggshell rule' exists [0], any wrongful death case involves a jury of people, a decent portion of which would rather not think about the damages their own bad actions towards others have caused. [0] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eggshell_skull https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eggshell_skull
- philpem 5y agoI absolutely agree with making the bullies accountable, and making the networks accountable should only be in addition to that. The guy who runs the site is a US citizen. If the police don't give a damn (which seems to be the case)... why aren't US citizens writing to their representatives about this?
- dahfizz 5y ago> why aren't US citizens writing to their representatives about this? Does that actually do anything?
- user-the-name 5y agoThe aim here is to stop the people who bully others to suicide. That is what is important. Kiwifarms is self hosted, there is no host to complain to.