5 ms·

any theory why girls were more affected?

ErrolMusk 5y ago
facebook
deep-root 5y ago
Not a theory, but additional info: female teenage suicide is one-third the rate of male in US[1], but typically grows faster per year. [1] https://time.com/5590344/youth-suicide-rates/ https://time.com/5590344/youth-suicide-rates/ Edit: The Time article links to original JAMA
- supergirl 5y ago
  I was thinking about this. it would explain the increase. but actually the CDC numbers show that absolute numbers are much higher for girls; although, it's only for this narrow study
  - pedrosorio 5y ago
    As people have mentioned elsewhere in the thread, suicide != suicide attempt. The former is higher in boys whereas the latter is higher in girls.
float4 5y ago
Suicide attempts have always been way more frequent among women/girls, whereas men/boys actually commit suicide more often. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_differences_in_suicide https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_differences_in_suicide
- supergirl 5y ago
  Yeah, I was thinking about this. probably the definition of "suicide attempt" is too broad then.
  - slipframe 5y ago
    How do you come to that conclusion? The CDC data is tracking the number of hospitalizations. If the suicide attempt results in a hospitalization, that sounds pretty serious to me.
    - GavinMcG 5y ago
      Hospitalization is generally mandated for any expression of an immediate intent to kill one's self, even if there isn't an attempt at all. So there is a line-drawing problem; if someone says they tried to kill themselves even if what they tried obviously wouldn't work (e.g. surface-level cuts away from blood vessels) their attempt could "result in hospitalization" even though hospitalization would have theoretically resulted even if no attempt had been made.
      - slipframe 5y ago
        This still doesn't sound like an overly broad definition of suicide-attempt to me. Somebody saying they want to die and giving themselves minor cuts seems like a pretty serious situation. Unless the supposition is that boys don't get hospitalized when they do the same sort of thing, number of hospitalizations sounds like a robust metric.
        GavinMcG 5y ago
        It is serious. Just pointing out a way that someone could think there's room for narrowing the definition. Obviously any suicidal ideation may need help; categories that aren't totally clear can just make it harder to decide what sorts of resources and interventions to prioritize on a systems level.
    - supergirl 5y ago
      how else to explain the fact that number of attempts is higher for women yet number of suicides is lower? it means number of attempts can't predict number of suicides, so it is counting something unrelated.
- NaturalPhallacy 5y ago
  This is actually a myth. The data for suicide statistics have been polluted in in some rather peculiar ways. Hospitalizations for any self-harm-related injury, no matter how obviously sublethal, are categorized as suicide attempts. https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/en/pub/82-003-x/2001002/article/6060-eng.pdf?st=hGT4w_AQ https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/en/pub/82-003-x/2001002/arti... (pdf) >Hospitalizations related to suicide attempts were defined as the presence of ICD-9 codes E950 to E959 in the first accident code for a patient discharged alive. This ICD-9 category includes injuries resulting from attempted suicide, as well as self-inflicted injuries specified as intentional, but without suicidal intent. So that will deceptively inflate the statistics for whichever gender self harms more frequently... which turns out to be girls and women. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25795294 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25795294 >The goal of the current study was to use meta-analytic techniques to better conceptualize the presence and size of gender differences in the prevalence of NSSI (non-suicidal self injury) The results showed that across studies women were significantly more likely to report a history of NSSI than men. This next study tries to investigate that issue by breaking down "suicide attempts" by degree of actual suicidal intent. They devised a spectrum ranging from deliberate self harm to suicidal gestures to serious attempts to end one's life. Surprise surprise, the self-harm end of that spectrum is more populated by females and the serious-attempt end is more populated by males. >*A significant association between suicide intent and gender was found, where ‘Serious Suicide Attempts’ (SSA) were rated significantly more frequently in males than females.* There is also an undercounting of men who attempt suicide by hospital staff. A recent Australian study showed that the number of men attempting suicide was much greater based on reports of first responders compared to hospital staff, but the latter being the current source of statistics. https://www.beyondblue.org.au/media/news/news/2019/05/28/suicide-figures-are-the-tip-of-the-iceberg-new-research https://www.beyondblue.org.au/media/news/news/2019/05/28/sui...
  - float4 5y ago
    Thanks for commenting; interesting sources.
bloaf 5y ago
From the report: > Provisional mortality data found an overall decrease in the age-adjusted suicide rate from quarter 3 (July–September) of 2019 to quarter 3 of 2020. The suicide rate among young persons aged 15–24 years during this same period saw no significant change (9). So in other words: what changed was the rate of emergency department admissions, not actual suicides. I would wonder if lockdowns meant that more suicide attempts were made near family, who would then notice the attempt and take the person to the ED.
rossdavidh 5y ago
In the context of cyberbullying, I have seen assertions that teenage girls are typically more impacted by social stress than teenage boys. If this were the case, then we might expect that being deprived of social contact entirely would also have a bigger impact on teenage girls than teenage boys. How one could objectively measure whether girls are, in fact, more impacted by social stress, is not something I know the answer to.
stareatgoats 5y ago
Girls and women can tend to communicate distress through self-harm, i.e. "martyrdom". It is a potent "tool" because because harm to women is considered so heinous, and something that requires alleviation. It has deep roots in gender-roles where females are supposed to passive and males active, possibly even biology.

facebook

Not a theory, but additional info: female teenage suicide is one-third the rate of male in US[1], but typically grows faster per year. [1] https://time.com/5590344/youth-suicide-rates/ https://time.com/5590344/youth-suicide-rates/ Edit: The Time article links to original JAMA

supergirl 5y ago
I was thinking about this. it would explain the increase. but actually the CDC numbers show that absolute numbers are much higher for girls; although, it's only for this narrow study
- pedrosorio 5y ago
  As people have mentioned elsewhere in the thread, suicide != suicide attempt. The former is higher in boys whereas the latter is higher in girls.

float4 5y ago

Suicide attempts have always been way more frequent among women/girls, whereas men/boys actually commit suicide more often. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_differences_in_suicide https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_differences_in_suicide

supergirl 5y ago
Yeah, I was thinking about this. probably the definition of "suicide attempt" is too broad then.
- slipframe 5y ago
  How do you come to that conclusion? The CDC data is tracking the number of hospitalizations. If the suicide attempt results in a hospitalization, that sounds pretty serious to me.
  - GavinMcG 5y ago
    Hospitalization is generally mandated for any expression of an immediate intent to kill one's self, even if there isn't an attempt at all. So there is a line-drawing problem; if someone says they tried to kill themselves even if what they tried obviously wouldn't work (e.g. surface-level cuts away from blood vessels) their attempt could "result in hospitalization" even though hospitalization would have theoretically resulted even if no attempt had been made.
    - slipframe 5y ago
      This still doesn't sound like an overly broad definition of suicide-attempt to me. Somebody saying they want to die and giving themselves minor cuts seems like a pretty serious situation. Unless the supposition is that boys don't get hospitalized when they do the same sort of thing, number of hospitalizations sounds like a robust metric.
      - GavinMcG 5y ago
        It is serious. Just pointing out a way that someone could think there's room for narrowing the definition. Obviously any suicidal ideation may need help; categories that aren't totally clear can just make it harder to decide what sorts of resources and interventions to prioritize on a systems level.
  - supergirl 5y ago
    how else to explain the fact that number of attempts is higher for women yet number of suicides is lower? it means number of attempts can't predict number of suicides, so it is counting something unrelated.
NaturalPhallacy 5y ago
This is actually a myth. The data for suicide statistics have been polluted in in some rather peculiar ways. Hospitalizations for any self-harm-related injury, no matter how obviously sublethal, are categorized as suicide attempts. https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/en/pub/82-003-x/2001002/article/6060-eng.pdf?st=hGT4w_AQ https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/en/pub/82-003-x/2001002/arti... (pdf) >Hospitalizations related to suicide attempts were defined as the presence of ICD-9 codes E950 to E959 in the first accident code for a patient discharged alive. This ICD-9 category includes injuries resulting from attempted suicide, as well as self-inflicted injuries specified as intentional, but without suicidal intent. So that will deceptively inflate the statistics for whichever gender self harms more frequently... which turns out to be girls and women. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25795294 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25795294 >The goal of the current study was to use meta-analytic techniques to better conceptualize the presence and size of gender differences in the prevalence of NSSI (non-suicidal self injury) The results showed that across studies women were significantly more likely to report a history of NSSI than men. This next study tries to investigate that issue by breaking down "suicide attempts" by degree of actual suicidal intent. They devised a spectrum ranging from deliberate self harm to suicidal gestures to serious attempts to end one's life. Surprise surprise, the self-harm end of that spectrum is more populated by females and the serious-attempt end is more populated by males. >*A significant association between suicide intent and gender was found, where ‘Serious Suicide Attempts’ (SSA) were rated significantly more frequently in males than females.* There is also an undercounting of men who attempt suicide by hospital staff. A recent Australian study showed that the number of men attempting suicide was much greater based on reports of first responders compared to hospital staff, but the latter being the current source of statistics. https://www.beyondblue.org.au/media/news/news/2019/05/28/suicide-figures-are-the-tip-of-the-iceberg-new-research https://www.beyondblue.org.au/media/news/news/2019/05/28/sui...
- float4 5y ago
  Thanks for commenting; interesting sources.

bloaf 5y ago

From the report: > Provisional mortality data found an overall decrease in the age-adjusted suicide rate from quarter 3 (July–September) of 2019 to quarter 3 of 2020. The suicide rate among young persons aged 15–24 years during this same period saw no significant change (9). So in other words: what changed was the rate of emergency department admissions, not actual suicides. I would wonder if lockdowns meant that more suicide attempts were made near family, who would then notice the attempt and take the person to the ED.

rossdavidh 5y ago

In the context of cyberbullying, I have seen assertions that teenage girls are typically more impacted by social stress than teenage boys. If this were the case, then we might expect that being deprived of social contact entirely would also have a bigger impact on teenage girls than teenage boys. How one could objectively measure whether girls are, in fact, more impacted by social stress, is not something I know the answer to.

stareatgoats 5y ago

Girls and women can tend to communicate distress through self-harm, i.e. "martyrdom". It is a potent "tool" because because harm to women is considered so heinous, and something that requires alleviation. It has deep roots in gender-roles where females are supposed to passive and males active, possibly even biology.