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It seems that they do, but they don't. Plenty of information flows through emails, chat, social media, direct search on websites like Amazon. The internet is la

It seems that they do, but they don't. Plenty of information flows through emails, chat, social media, direct search on websites like Amazon. The internet is large, and Google is a very big player, but they're not controlling all the information flow on the internet, and if they really tried people would leave.

warkdarrior 5y ago
> they're not controlling all the information flow on the internet, and if they really tried people would leave. I am not sure about that. People are generally slow to change habits, especially that Google's control will not grow in a sudden fashion, but rather incrementally.
haswell 5y ago
That Google controls/censors information is well established [0]. The side effects of their search algorithms and how they control the flow of information has also been a topic of regular discussion/scrutiny for many years (just one example here [1]) > and if they really tried people would leave Where would they go? - [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_by_Google https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_by_Google - [1] https://mindmatters.ai/2019/07/google-engineer-reveals-search-engine-bias/ https://mindmatters.ai/2019/07/google-engineer-reveals-searc...
- minsc__and__boo 5y ago
  I know you're trying to make a point about censorship existing, but I'm not sure if loli porn and scam online pharmacies were really contributing to the internet.
  - haswell 5y ago
    I agree with you; however, that's kind of the point. Google has the power to organize and control a significant amount of information. These statements are very different: - Google doesn't censor anything - Google censors things that a lot of people agree are offensive The 2nd gets into tricky territory, because not everyone agrees on what is/is not offensive. I happen to think that most of the things they remove are probably good to remove. But the implication is still that Google wields (and at times uses) enormous power. Things get even more grey (and potentially problematic) when you get into ranking algorithms, which have the power to sway opinions on major topics/events. And as you mentioned, my parent comment is also a response to the very direct (and incorrect) claim: > It seems that they do [control information], but they don't.
- iso1631 5y ago
  search - microsoft maps - apple, microsoft, openstreetmap mail - dozens of providers compute - amazon, microsoft, digital ocean, linode, rackspace Not sure what else google do, I rarely use them
bingidingi 5y ago
How much email flows through gmail? Should Amazon have 50% of all ecommerce transaction data? How much of the chat space and social media does Facebook own? You're not wrong, but I think rather than bringing up counter-examples, you've produced a list of similar problems. When someone tries to find a new website someone told them about for the first time... what % of that is filtered through Google? If it's a majority, which I suspect it is, then it's still definitely a problem.
agloeregrets 5y ago
Well yeah, but you now have listed basicly 3 companies with most of them having a majority market share in their domain. (Gmail, FB, FB, Amazon; respectively) Plus google search is the end-all-be-all answer. People treat these results as the truth.

warkdarrior 5y ago

> they're not controlling all the information flow on the internet, and if they really tried people would leave. I am not sure about that. People are generally slow to change habits, especially that Google's control will not grow in a sudden fashion, but rather incrementally.

haswell 5y ago

That Google controls/censors information is well established [0]. The side effects of their search algorithms and how they control the flow of information has also been a topic of regular discussion/scrutiny for many years (just one example here [1]) > and if they really tried people would leave Where would they go? - [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_by_Google https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_by_Google - [1] https://mindmatters.ai/2019/07/google-engineer-reveals-search-engine-bias/ https://mindmatters.ai/2019/07/google-engineer-reveals-searc...

minsc__and__boo 5y ago
I know you're trying to make a point about censorship existing, but I'm not sure if loli porn and scam online pharmacies were really contributing to the internet.
- haswell 5y ago
  I agree with you; however, that's kind of the point. Google has the power to organize and control a significant amount of information. These statements are very different: - Google doesn't censor anything - Google censors things that a lot of people agree are offensive The 2nd gets into tricky territory, because not everyone agrees on what is/is not offensive. I happen to think that most of the things they remove are probably good to remove. But the implication is still that Google wields (and at times uses) enormous power. Things get even more grey (and potentially problematic) when you get into ranking algorithms, which have the power to sway opinions on major topics/events. And as you mentioned, my parent comment is also a response to the very direct (and incorrect) claim: > It seems that they do [control information], but they don't.
iso1631 5y ago
search - microsoft maps - apple, microsoft, openstreetmap mail - dozens of providers compute - amazon, microsoft, digital ocean, linode, rackspace Not sure what else google do, I rarely use them

bingidingi 5y ago

How much email flows through gmail? Should Amazon have 50% of all ecommerce transaction data? How much of the chat space and social media does Facebook own? You're not wrong, but I think rather than bringing up counter-examples, you've produced a list of similar problems. When someone tries to find a new website someone told them about for the first time... what % of that is filtered through Google? If it's a majority, which I suspect it is, then it's still definitely a problem.

agloeregrets 5y ago

Well yeah, but you now have listed basicly 3 companies with most of them having a majority market share in their domain. (Gmail, FB, FB, Amazon; respectively) Plus google search is the end-all-be-all answer. People treat these results as the truth.