3 ms·

I'm terrified of interacting with female coworkers. I don't have a "-ist" bone in my body. When I review code, I only see the code and not the person that wrot

by throwaway111999 5y ago

I'm terrified of interacting with female coworkers. I don't have a "-ist" bone in my body. When I review code, I only see the code and not the person that wrote it. When I pick a team, I look at engineering ability and nothing else. I abhor discriminatory behavior and would be the first to put my career on the line to defend someone getting discriminated against. And of course I keep anything sexual FAR FAR FAAAR outside of work. Sometimes I write "guys" in chat (out of habit) and get a rush of anxiety. Did I offend someone? Should I correct it? If I correct it, will it make it more obvious? What if I get called out for using that word? How should I respond without making myself look like a goon? I've stopped giving negative feedback. It started when I needed to give negative feedback to a female engineer who wasn't doing well. I was terrified of being perceived as sexist so I just gave neutral/positive feedback to protect myself. I didn't want it to look bad so I did the same for male coworkers. Now I just give everyone positive feedback all the time. Yea, it looks like I'm a doormat or just dumb but it's worth the sense of safety I feel. I never EVER make jokes at work. I don't tell stories about my life. I certainly don't share political opinions. I don't talk about my hobbies because those might (at some point, not now) be correlated with something "-ist". Not worth the risk. I obviously don't post on social media. I do intend to start at some point, but everything I post will go through a heavy handed PR filter. I'm thinking it'll all be positive/supportive. No complaining, no calling anyone out, no responding to politicians or popular figures, and definitely never supporting anyone that I don't know personally. It's exhausting but at least it's opt-in. I just want a calm day to day life.

tw04 5y ago
Or you know, just don't be a creep and treat women like human beings and you'll be fine? If you're giving negative feedback because they did something wrong/substandard work, you document it and move on. If there are questions later, you refer back. I've literally never had this be a problem. I'm not sure why talking about your personal life would be grounds for issues unless you decided to talk about your bedroom, politics, or religion. "I went hiking on X trail this weekend, it was pretty cool" isn't going to get you called into HR.
- throwaway111999 5y ago
  > Or you know, just don't be a creep and treat women like human beings and you'll be fine? You don't understand. When I interact with people, I don't see race/color/age/sex. I'm just focused on the problem at hand. I also have a deep compassion for people in general. What I'm worried about is saying or doing the wrong thing due to a lapse in judgement in the moment. I'll give you an example. I love fashion. At a previous company it was all guys. When a guy came to work and was wearing new shoes, I'd notice, and compliment the shoes. Or if they were wearing a new shirt I might say that it "brings out your X". I'm straight so there's nothing sexual here. I just think fashion is cool. It's a hobby of mine. Making any comments about female coworker fashion terrifies me. What if I say something that's perceived as a sexual advance? Don't forget that men often disguise sexual advances as seemingly innocent compliments. It's a big gray area. > If you're giving negative feedback because they did something wrong/substandard work, you document it and move on. If there are questions later, you refer back. I've literally never had this be a problem. Maybe I wasn't clear in my post, but my point is that I have an irrational fear. I'd much rather sacrifice a little bit of professional perception of skill to not mess around in an area I'm very paranoid about. > I'm not sure why talking about your personal life would be grounds for issues unless you decided to talk about your bedroom, politics, or religion. "I went hiking on X trail this weekend, it was pretty cool" isn't going to get you called into HR. Irrationally, I worry that I'll get to comfortable and mention something that, to me, is obviously not "-ist" but comes off that way.
  - tw04 5y ago
    >When I interact with people, I don't see race/color/age/sex. No offense but this is such a silly thing to say. EVERYONE sees race/age/sex. Most people also change how they interact with others based on their age/sex and that's perfectly fine (if you're basing it on race that's an issue unless you're literally in a foreign country with a different culture). I don't talk to a 2 year old girl in the same tone of voice and vocabulary that I talk to a 40 year old man. If you're treating a 2 year old and a 40 year old the same, we've probably discovered one of many problems with your interpersonal skills. >Making any comments about female coworker fashion terrifies me. Why? Again this is all pretty straightforward. Couple simple rules: don't stop by the same persons desk every day and compliment their fashion, that gets creepy. "I like those earrings, they look great" - no problem. "Hey I really like the way that shirt fits your body" - problem >Maybe I wasn't clear in my post, but my point is that I have an irrational fear. And my point is that you're saying you are knowingly and intentionally treating your female coworkers significantly different than your male coworkers, and that's kind of weird, and will likely lead to more issues than if you just treat them the same...
watt 5y ago
Good! Nobody actually wants you to do the other thing that you're already not doing. Keep your head down. Be positive. Keep trying to move the needle: but in a neutral, inoffensive way. And everything will get better.
sktrdie 5y ago
It's funny because I behave entirely the opposite. I'm as transparent and open as possible. I'm just myself and no way I can live hiding my own personality because of other people's feelings. If the people around me don't like it or my work won't accept it then I simply move to new friends/work where my "character" is understood or accepted. I find similarities in this with some standup comedy I do & the group of friends I found there. They accept my "naughtier" funny side because we all talk shit about everything and about each other. We're constantly roasting each other and we all love it. Politics & drama is welcome here! Surely I can't bring the same character into an office meeting but you'll easily see where the line is - no need to go completely all out as you are. You wouldn't talk to your grandma about your sex life the same way you talk about it with your buddies. Adapt and move on, but maybe no need to hide your true self.

tw04 5y ago

Or you know, just don't be a creep and treat women like human beings and you'll be fine? If you're giving negative feedback because they did something wrong/substandard work, you document it and move on. If there are questions later, you refer back. I've literally never had this be a problem. I'm not sure why talking about your personal life would be grounds for issues unless you decided to talk about your bedroom, politics, or religion. "I went hiking on X trail this weekend, it was pretty cool" isn't going to get you called into HR.

throwaway111999 5y ago
> Or you know, just don't be a creep and treat women like human beings and you'll be fine? You don't understand. When I interact with people, I don't see race/color/age/sex. I'm just focused on the problem at hand. I also have a deep compassion for people in general. What I'm worried about is saying or doing the wrong thing due to a lapse in judgement in the moment. I'll give you an example. I love fashion. At a previous company it was all guys. When a guy came to work and was wearing new shoes, I'd notice, and compliment the shoes. Or if they were wearing a new shirt I might say that it "brings out your X". I'm straight so there's nothing sexual here. I just think fashion is cool. It's a hobby of mine. Making any comments about female coworker fashion terrifies me. What if I say something that's perceived as a sexual advance? Don't forget that men often disguise sexual advances as seemingly innocent compliments. It's a big gray area. > If you're giving negative feedback because they did something wrong/substandard work, you document it and move on. If there are questions later, you refer back. I've literally never had this be a problem. Maybe I wasn't clear in my post, but my point is that I have an irrational fear. I'd much rather sacrifice a little bit of professional perception of skill to not mess around in an area I'm very paranoid about. > I'm not sure why talking about your personal life would be grounds for issues unless you decided to talk about your bedroom, politics, or religion. "I went hiking on X trail this weekend, it was pretty cool" isn't going to get you called into HR. Irrationally, I worry that I'll get to comfortable and mention something that, to me, is obviously not "-ist" but comes off that way.
- tw04 5y ago
  >When I interact with people, I don't see race/color/age/sex. No offense but this is such a silly thing to say. EVERYONE sees race/age/sex. Most people also change how they interact with others based on their age/sex and that's perfectly fine (if you're basing it on race that's an issue unless you're literally in a foreign country with a different culture). I don't talk to a 2 year old girl in the same tone of voice and vocabulary that I talk to a 40 year old man. If you're treating a 2 year old and a 40 year old the same, we've probably discovered one of many problems with your interpersonal skills. >Making any comments about female coworker fashion terrifies me. Why? Again this is all pretty straightforward. Couple simple rules: don't stop by the same persons desk every day and compliment their fashion, that gets creepy. "I like those earrings, they look great" - no problem. "Hey I really like the way that shirt fits your body" - problem >Maybe I wasn't clear in my post, but my point is that I have an irrational fear. And my point is that you're saying you are knowingly and intentionally treating your female coworkers significantly different than your male coworkers, and that's kind of weird, and will likely lead to more issues than if you just treat them the same...

watt 5y ago

Good! Nobody actually wants you to do the other thing that you're already not doing. Keep your head down. Be positive. Keep trying to move the needle: but in a neutral, inoffensive way. And everything will get better.

sktrdie 5y ago

It's funny because I behave entirely the opposite. I'm as transparent and open as possible. I'm just myself and no way I can live hiding my own personality because of other people's feelings. If the people around me don't like it or my work won't accept it then I simply move to new friends/work where my "character" is understood or accepted. I find similarities in this with some standup comedy I do & the group of friends I found there. They accept my "naughtier" funny side because we all talk shit about everything and about each other. We're constantly roasting each other and we all love it. Politics & drama is welcome here! Surely I can't bring the same character into an office meeting but you'll easily see where the line is - no need to go completely all out as you are. You wouldn't talk to your grandma about your sex life the same way you talk about it with your buddies. Adapt and move on, but maybe no need to hide your true self.