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This has to be one of the sillier things I've ever seen. Highlighted in the article is Phoenix arizona in Maricopa County which is one of the most responsibly m

This has to be one of the sillier things I've ever seen. Highlighted in the article is Phoenix arizona in Maricopa County which is one of the most responsibly managed metropolitan areas in the country if not the world. More than 50% of the power derived from nuclear at Palos Verdes just 45 miles from the city which evaporates wastewater to drive turbines and provide cooling. Another 14% from solar. Plumbed grey water throughout 80% of the metropolitan area. Per-capita water used declined by 20% over the past 40 years. Net groundwater contributor with 100 year plan for water usage anticipating drought conditions. This is actually the picture of a sustainable metropolitan area with low taxes and high quality of life. Meanwhile the author lives in a city (somerville, ma) which routinely dumps its sewage and into the nearest rivers, in a part of the country that burns diesel to stay warm for months out of the year and where without a precision engineered weather suit between dec and may you will die from just being outside. I'm not saying 118 is for everyone but if you have shade you won't die. Just comically out of touch.

mempko 5y ago
Highest eviction rates in the country. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0qf0dv6jjE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0qf0dv6jjE
- judge2020 5y ago
  Are there any statistics on homelessness per city? There seems to be a rise in homelessness in Atlanta as well, so I wouldn't be surprised if it was a country-wide thing for big cities.
adamvalve 5y ago
If you move to Phoenix now and plan to live in your house for 30 years, then you are going to have a bad time because Phoenix will be unlivable if there aren’t drastic measures put in place. 118 is the ceiling now. Not the ceiling forever.
- JKCalhoun 5y ago
  I think many of the people moving there (retirees) actually don't plan to even be alive in 30 years. :-/
- exporectomy 5y ago
  Yes but You'll've always had a bad time because it was always bad. Yet people somehow still live there. So having a "bad time" isn't a reason not to live there. "Arizona already averages more than 50 dangerous heat days a year, the second highest in the nation. By 2050, Arizona is projected to see almost 80 such days a year." From 50 days to 80 is the difference between good and bad place to live? No. This is just handwaving nonsense. Not every worsening is a showstopper.
ajcp 5y ago
Couldn't agree more. On a more socio-economic note: I moved from DC to PHX 5 years ago thinking I'd gtfo after 3 months, because, you know, it's PHX. Despite my best efforts I really love it; you find so much more value in places you believe to have none. Great cost of living, a HUGE variety human experiences, and a massive airport where you can catch a cheap flight out! I live in downtown PHX (I can see the basketball arena as I type this) and it's wonderful. I truly believe that PHX is seeing a boom akin to Detroit's in the mid-20th century. Hopefully we don't get that bust.
systemvoltage 5y ago
I hope 'Californication' doesn't take over Phoenix. > In 2017 Portland ranked third. Now it has dropped to 66th out of 80. https://www.economist.com/united-states/2021/06/12/portland-was-once-a-byword-for-tattooed-vegan-microbrewers https://www.economist.com/united-states/2021/06/12/portland-... Oakland is similar in SF Bay Area, used to be quite livable 15 years ago. Californians (and people from west coast states) that move there also bring their unchecked progressive views and will lead to the situation that we have in SF Bay Area, Portland, Seattle, LA and now Austin, Denver. Rampant homelessness, housing crisis, exploding crime rates, etc. No one wants to live in a society that keeps peddling failed policies. I can't wait to move out of Bay Area. I will still be a democrat but it's getting harder.
- germinalphrase 5y ago
  Honest question: what keeps you in the Democratic Party if you dislike places that seek to implement Democratic social policies?
  - systemvoltage 5y ago
    General election: Mostly international diplomacy, health policies, climate policies, funding for R&D, EPA, NASA, Infra (I think Republicans usually vote for defense spending), and the obvious derailment of the Republican party for past 20 years. It is unreconizeable today and there is no way I am voting for Trumpism. I have voted for local Republican leaders in the past.
- Tiktaalik 5y ago
  The housing crisis that California is exporting is rich people buying up single family homes then demanding that no apartments get built near them anywhere. This is not a "progressive view". This is rich, elitist, anti-renter landed gentry shit.
ectopod 5y ago
> I'm not saying 118 is for everyone but if you have shade you won't die. Yeah, barely. I once spent a day in the shade at 113F waiting for a bus with a friend. We played chess and it was the dumbest game ever. We could barely function. Without aircon nobody is doing anything very much at that temperature. You can survive, just, at 118F but you can't live.
selimnairb 5y ago
It doesn’t matter how efficiently the city is run. At some point, it may become impossible to support current levels of population. For instance, if drought conditions continue to be more common, there will be less and less water available, which means less wastewater for use in thermoelectric plants. Also, this means less water to maintain urban vegetation, which will also demand more water as temperatures rise and vapor pressure deficit rises. Less urban vegetation means less evapotranspiration, less latent heat flux, and greater urban heat island effects, which will further increase air conditioning & power loads above and beyond what would be the case with warmer temperatures assuming current land use/vegetation cover. It’s very easy to envision ways that places like Phoenix collapse.
germinalphrase 5y ago
“Without a precision engineered weather suit between dec and may you will die from just being outside” You’re laying it on a bit thick. Here in Minnesota we call it a coat and boots.
- AnimalMuppet 5y ago
  OK, but if I wore what I consider a coat and boots, I would still die if I were outside for very long.
  - germinalphrase 5y ago
    Well, ya see - now, that’s your problem. You need to start measuring your clothes in inches.
- scruple 5y ago
  The same thing is true in hot climates.
xref 5y ago
Phoenix has made strides, but largely because it started from such a low, low bar. Exemplified by the Navajo Generating Plant, one of the largest coal fired power plants ever built, just to power pumps for lifting Colorado River water 2900ft up to Phoenix. Not to mention the damage to the Colorado, which no longer has enough flow to reach the ocean. That “Net groundwater contributor” comment? It’s because Phoenix drains the Colorado and pumps it into the city’s private aquifers
BuckRogers 5y ago
Maricopa County is the place that had the sheriff that was found guilty of criminal contempt for ignoring federal orders. I’m not sure if those sorts of attitudes exist there that I’d be too interested. But far worse, it’s a desert. Nothing grows there. That should be your first hint to not try and live there. Fresh water is the new oil. As a business you may be in good shape there as you’ll always be taken care of, as an individual I’d suggest you’re going to get the short end of the stick as supply tightens.
- dekhn 5y ago
  It's not fair to say nothing grows there; Arizona is the world's winter lettuce provider. Irrigation is pretty standard. It makes sense to move water to fertile land.
  - BuckRogers 5y ago
    Not naturally, which I thought would've been implied. You can even sustain a major city in the desert if you pipe in water from other places that are already suited for life on Earth.

mempko 5y ago

Highest eviction rates in the country. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0qf0dv6jjE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0qf0dv6jjE

judge2020 5y ago
Are there any statistics on homelessness per city? There seems to be a rise in homelessness in Atlanta as well, so I wouldn't be surprised if it was a country-wide thing for big cities.

adamvalve 5y ago

If you move to Phoenix now and plan to live in your house for 30 years, then you are going to have a bad time because Phoenix will be unlivable if there aren’t drastic measures put in place. 118 is the ceiling now. Not the ceiling forever.

JKCalhoun 5y ago
I think many of the people moving there (retirees) actually don't plan to even be alive in 30 years. :-/
exporectomy 5y ago
Yes but You'll've always had a bad time because it was always bad. Yet people somehow still live there. So having a "bad time" isn't a reason not to live there. "Arizona already averages more than 50 dangerous heat days a year, the second highest in the nation. By 2050, Arizona is projected to see almost 80 such days a year." From 50 days to 80 is the difference between good and bad place to live? No. This is just handwaving nonsense. Not every worsening is a showstopper.

ajcp 5y ago

Couldn't agree more. On a more socio-economic note: I moved from DC to PHX 5 years ago thinking I'd gtfo after 3 months, because, you know, it's PHX. Despite my best efforts I really love it; you find so much more value in places you believe to have none. Great cost of living, a HUGE variety human experiences, and a massive airport where you can catch a cheap flight out! I live in downtown PHX (I can see the basketball arena as I type this) and it's wonderful. I truly believe that PHX is seeing a boom akin to Detroit's in the mid-20th century. Hopefully we don't get that bust.

systemvoltage 5y ago

I hope 'Californication' doesn't take over Phoenix. > In 2017 Portland ranked third. Now it has dropped to 66th out of 80. https://www.economist.com/united-states/2021/06/12/portland-was-once-a-byword-for-tattooed-vegan-microbrewers https://www.economist.com/united-states/2021/06/12/portland-... Oakland is similar in SF Bay Area, used to be quite livable 15 years ago. Californians (and people from west coast states) that move there also bring their unchecked progressive views and will lead to the situation that we have in SF Bay Area, Portland, Seattle, LA and now Austin, Denver. Rampant homelessness, housing crisis, exploding crime rates, etc. No one wants to live in a society that keeps peddling failed policies. I can't wait to move out of Bay Area. I will still be a democrat but it's getting harder.

germinalphrase 5y ago
Honest question: what keeps you in the Democratic Party if you dislike places that seek to implement Democratic social policies?
- systemvoltage 5y ago
  General election: Mostly international diplomacy, health policies, climate policies, funding for R&D, EPA, NASA, Infra (I think Republicans usually vote for defense spending), and the obvious derailment of the Republican party for past 20 years. It is unreconizeable today and there is no way I am voting for Trumpism. I have voted for local Republican leaders in the past.
Tiktaalik 5y ago
The housing crisis that California is exporting is rich people buying up single family homes then demanding that no apartments get built near them anywhere. This is not a "progressive view". This is rich, elitist, anti-renter landed gentry shit.

ectopod 5y ago

> I'm not saying 118 is for everyone but if you have shade you won't die. Yeah, barely. I once spent a day in the shade at 113F waiting for a bus with a friend. We played chess and it was the dumbest game ever. We could barely function. Without aircon nobody is doing anything very much at that temperature. You can survive, just, at 118F but you can't live.

selimnairb 5y ago

It doesn’t matter how efficiently the city is run. At some point, it may become impossible to support current levels of population. For instance, if drought conditions continue to be more common, there will be less and less water available, which means less wastewater for use in thermoelectric plants. Also, this means less water to maintain urban vegetation, which will also demand more water as temperatures rise and vapor pressure deficit rises. Less urban vegetation means less evapotranspiration, less latent heat flux, and greater urban heat island effects, which will further increase air conditioning & power loads above and beyond what would be the case with warmer temperatures assuming current land use/vegetation cover. It’s very easy to envision ways that places like Phoenix collapse.

germinalphrase 5y ago

“Without a precision engineered weather suit between dec and may you will die from just being outside” You’re laying it on a bit thick. Here in Minnesota we call it a coat and boots.

AnimalMuppet 5y ago
OK, but if I wore what I consider a coat and boots, I would still die if I were outside for very long.
- germinalphrase 5y ago
  Well, ya see - now, that’s your problem. You need to start measuring your clothes in inches.
scruple 5y ago
The same thing is true in hot climates.

xref 5y ago

Phoenix has made strides, but largely because it started from such a low, low bar. Exemplified by the Navajo Generating Plant, one of the largest coal fired power plants ever built, just to power pumps for lifting Colorado River water 2900ft up to Phoenix. Not to mention the damage to the Colorado, which no longer has enough flow to reach the ocean. That “Net groundwater contributor” comment? It’s because Phoenix drains the Colorado and pumps it into the city’s private aquifers

BuckRogers 5y ago

Maricopa County is the place that had the sheriff that was found guilty of criminal contempt for ignoring federal orders. I’m not sure if those sorts of attitudes exist there that I’d be too interested. But far worse, it’s a desert. Nothing grows there. That should be your first hint to not try and live there. Fresh water is the new oil. As a business you may be in good shape there as you’ll always be taken care of, as an individual I’d suggest you’re going to get the short end of the stick as supply tightens.

dekhn 5y ago
It's not fair to say nothing grows there; Arizona is the world's winter lettuce provider. Irrigation is pretty standard. It makes sense to move water to fertile land.
- BuckRogers 5y ago
  Not naturally, which I thought would've been implied. You can even sustain a major city in the desert if you pipe in water from other places that are already suited for life on Earth.