7 ms·

Speaking as someone who now works remotely permanently, this has been... life-changing. So for 10 years I lived in NYC and--don't get me wrong--there are lots

by cletus 5y ago

Speaking as someone who now works remotely permanently, this has been... life-changing. So for 10 years I lived in NYC and--don't get me wrong--there are lots of things I liked about NYC but I'm so over the summers and the winters. Also bear in mind that I think NYC is infinitely better for most people to live in than the Bay Area. But I now live in Florida. It's about the 182nd day in a row where it's been 70-80F. Sure it's humid and that may sound weird after the comment about NYC summers but NYC summers are a special kind of hell beyond the heat and humidity. Here there's usually a breeze. I've been here 6 months and I don't even use the AC. Add to that that for the same price as my 50 year old 1 bedroom in NYC I now live in a 3 bedroom duplex apartment. I spend a ton of time outside and this has greatly increased my mood and wellbeing. There are things I definitely miss: camaraderie with my coworkers, free food and the like but honestly I'm just over going into the office. I'm not sure I'll ever do that again. The ability to live anywhere in the country just opens up so many possibilities. It's worth noting that this doesn't enable a true digital nomad lifestyle if that's what you want. That's because you still need to be employed somewhere and you and the company are subject to the employment rules (and taxes) in that locale. Maybe that will change in the future.

torgian 5y ago
It’s possible if you become a contractor. That’s what I am now, and I have worked for two companies so far. I live outside the states now. But it does mean dealing with your own taxes, charging a higher rate to compensate for those taxes and other bills, etc. however, I’ve found that I can charge higher and the company can still save money simply because they don’t have to pay for things they would normally pay a permanent employee. But, it does come with a risk of losing your job more easily.
- nwb 5y ago
  Curious what you do and what your strategy was for being a contractor. Care to share?
- carnitas 5y ago
  Seconded, please share. Do you make significantly more money than full time employee status?
  - ska 5y ago
    Typically for a freelancer/contractor (as against a consultant) yes but also no. On a nominal hourly or whatever rate you come out ahead, but life can throw you curveballs that mean you don't end up ahead.
    - torgian 5y ago
      This. And I started low too. But keep in mind my situation is _not_ typical at all. It’s a bit big to share here and it’s late but I’ll get back on this
minsc__and__boo 5y ago
>It's worth noting that this doesn't enable a true digital nomad lifestyle if that's what you want. This isn't that hard to circumvent with a mailing address. The real blocker has been pre-covid management not being comfortable with 100% remote.
- er4hn 5y ago
  State taxes are generally not something you want to circumvent. Ps - great baldurs gate 2 ref in your username :)
  - minsc__and__boo 5y ago
    Well, tax circumvention never is a good idea, but I know plenty of military folks who get away with it though. I once saw a sailboat named "Minsc", that had a dingy hanging off the stern named "Boo" but it was gone before I could snap a picture. Probably off to do butt kicking.
    - d110af5ccf 5y ago
      It's not tax evasion when active military does it. They have a system and criteria for selecting which state you want to be a legal resident of. I don't recall how it works off the top of my head.
  - bradleyjg 5y ago
    In the digital nomad case you aren’t circumventing state or federal taxes. By saying you are in, say NC, when you are really in Thailand, Croatia, or Costa Rica depending on the time of year—-you are paying more taxes then you’d owe, not less. Leaving aside timezones, which you could adjust to if you wanted to, the real issue is that your employers can’t be sure it’s complying with Thai, Croatian, and Costa Rica law and doesn’t want to be the effort in to figure out how to be sure.
  - toomuchtodo 5y ago
    https://theboatgalley.com/establishing-residency-at-st-brendans-isle/ https://theboatgalley.com/establishing-residency-at-st-brend... This makes Florida your domicile, so no state income taxes (but, of course, you're paying Federal taxes regardless of where you reside in the world). The mail processor in question caters specifically to cruisers/yachties and RVers. Give the address to work and family, no one knows you're living the digital nomad life unless you share. Get a Schwab or Fidelity checking account for fee free ATM withdrawals globally, and a credit card with no foreign transaction fee.
cactus2093 5y ago
> NYC summers are a special kind of hell beyond the heat and humidity That is absolutely wild to me. I also lived in NYC for 10 years, the summers there are magical. The city comes alive in such a unique way, people are outside relaxing in the parks, having backyard and rooftop parties, heading out to the beach on the weekends. There are a bunch of great weekend trips to be had a few hours away by train in Long Island or Connecticut or upstate NY. You can join an after work rec league with friends. There's concerts in the park once or twice a week, and free movie showings on the waterfront. The bars and restaurants are more lively. One of the best parts of NYC in general is just how much there is to do if you like getting out and being social, and in the summer it's just turned up to the max. Most apartments don't come with AC, but as long as you can afford $300 for a good floor unit to put in front of the window you can keep your home temperature very comfortable.
- cletus 5y ago
  > I also lived in NYC for 10 years, the summers there are magical. Summers in NYC can be quite mild. If memory serves 2016-2019 were all quite mild with only very brief hellish patches. Some earlier summers though were... horrible. For me, the magical time in NYC is spring and fall, specifically May and September-October. Those are my favourite times in the city. The days are still relatively long. The weather is nice and mild. But there is something about the oppressive heat radiating off the sidewalk and the buildings and the air is humid and completely still that is just completely draining to me, in the height of a bad summer.
- GongOfFour 5y ago
  Did you commute every day on the subway? If so how long? I lived in NYC for 10 years and I hated the summer daily commute because all that aliveness led to hangovers and me sweating all that magicalness out daily on my walk and wait on the platform. You aren't wrong that NYC is great in the summer but it's also a special kind of hell with heat and humidity. Both can be true.
  - cactus2093 5y ago
    Lol, fair enough. I do remember once being pretty dehydrated and being about to pass out on the subway ride home from work, standing in the middle of the packed, sweltering train with no room to move. Luckily someone saw me looking pale and offered me their seat. But at least in hindsight the good outweighs the bad :)
nkozyra 5y ago
> But I now live in Florida. It's about the 182nd day in a row where it's been 70-80F. What part of Florida? It generally starts hitting 90 in May most of the state and stays there into November. I've lived in NYC and yes, January-March can be tough and a few weeks in September are awful but Florida is just oppressively hot for six+ months of the year. The worst part is it doesn't cool down at night so you don't even get early morning or late night comfortable outside time
- cletus 5y ago
  Miami. I'm not sure it's hit 90F hit but it's definitely hit 85-88F. So close. I'm not sure how much hotter it'll get but I'm all about it still. I've thought about why this is. Not commuting I think is a big part of it. So the weather doesn't have to bother me if I don't want it to. Like I literally don't have to go anywhere. I think the trade winds are a big factor too. Hot, humid and still is a special kind of hell. Another is expectations. Like if you live in Miami you just assume it's going to be relatively warm (even hot) and humid. It's not a surprise. Lastly, I have more space here and more facilities where I live. I can go for a swim easily even if I don't want to go to the beach. I have been to Tampa in June/July years ago and that was hell. My circumstances were different and I'm sure my attitude was too. It actually turned me off Florida for years. Up until last year actually. Funny story: when deciding where to work remotely last year I was strongly considering Dallas (maybe Austin) and decided on a whim to go to Miami instead. I said if I don't like it I'll just go to Texas. I haven't left. Funnily enough, in that time Texas had the big arctic storm and a foot of snow in Austin. I think I made the right choice.
  - nkozyra 5y ago
    I'm not trying to be argumentative, but you said: > It's about the 182nd day in a row where it's been 70-80F. And this is simply untrue (according to Weather.com and Weather Underground). I mention this because there's this big push (I'm sure you've noticed) among tech/VCs/Miami govt to paint a very rosy picture of Miami as an alternative to Silicon Valley. Every day this week is expected to be 86-89. And to folks not from Florida ... that's HOT in Florida. I've lived in NYC, I've lived in Austin, I've lived in "Hotlanta" ... there's nothing like a Florida hot. And unless you're right on the water, it feels ... like much more. The last week in January this year had 4 days above 80. The last week in February every single day was over 80 and two days over 85. In 2018 my NYC-based company decided to come to Orlando in the last week of February. Five of the seven days were OVER 90!
majormajor 5y ago
> But I now live in Florida. It's about the 182nd day in a row where it's been 70-80F. Sure it's humid and that may sound weird after the comment about NYC summers but NYC summers are a special kind of hell beyond the heat and humidity. Here there's usually a breeze. I've been here 6 months and I don't even use the AC. You're comparing FL winters to NYC summers? I'm not sure exactly where you are in FL, but... in most of the state, it gets as hot or hotter than NYC in the summer!
- cletus 5y ago
  Well it's June now. We're pretty close to what summer is. For the record, I'm in the Miami area. I think it's a little cooler here than some places more inland and upstate. Or maybe I'm imagining things. But what a difference the trade winds make (to me at least). Like I said, it's June and I'm still not using the AC. I just open up my house and enjoy the breeze. Some people, particularly up north, like the have their AC on 60 and wear layers indoors. For me that's a meat locker. I'm all about it being 75F with a breeze inside.
  - felideon 5y ago
    Heh. Report back in August.
  - tayo42 5y ago
    Surprised Miami is that breezy but if it is, it makes sense. ac doesn't really exist outside tourist stuff in the usvi either, Hawaii is like that too
  - auston 5y ago
    To be fair, I'm a 35 year Florida resident and this summer has been exceptionally nice. It is usually crazy hot and humid by this time.
  - drewnick 5y ago
    South Florida has has an unusually dry summer so far and I think that has kept the due points down. As another comment said, give it time and it'll catch up to you. I'm in Boca Raton and it feels wonderful, but by July/August it really gets oppressive. September/October, statistically, has the most rain as well.
wtvanhest 5y ago
I grew up in Naples. If you have only been there 6 months, you haven’t lived there during the summer yet. That said, I actually love Florida’s climate. The problem with Florida for me is the lack of outdoor activities, especially in the summer except for the beach and boat. I personally prefer the bay areas hiking, access to park, playgrounds etc, but if you prefer beach, Florida is amazing and you adjust quickly to shorts 320 days a year.
- crossroadsguy 5y ago
  Do these places have similar weather? I mean they’re both on the coast but we are talking about two different continents here.
  - wtvanhest 5y ago
    I’m talking about Naples, Florida. I should have specified.
tshaddox 5y ago
I've never lived or spent significant summer time in Florida or New York City, but your descriptions of summer weather sounded surprising to me. I looked up weather data, and Jacksonville, Miami, and Tampa all get significantly hotter (4-7 degrees Fahrenheit higher average temperatures in the hottest part of summer), muggier, and cloudier in the summer. Only Miami is consistently windier in the summer than NYC. Is the wind the only difference you're talking about? At least on paper, it looks like I would vastly prefer the summer weather in NYC.
- ehsankia 5y ago
  Imo focusing on weather is overrated. I worked in the bay area for 3 years, and year the constant weather is cool but for me, far more important is where my friends, family and the things I want to be near are. A nice house, cool activities, vibrant community and stores, etc. Not saying those things are in NYC, there's many other great cities, but I definitely wouldn't pick a place just for the weather.
  - tshaddox 5y ago
    The importance of weather obviously depends greatly on what you like to do, namely how much time you like to spend outside!
- ianhawes 5y ago
  IIRC part of South Florida (around Ft. Lauderdale) is the only tropical rainforest climate in the CONUS. I've spent time in the mid-Atlantic region and time in South Florida. Miami in July is the closest thing to hell on Earth. But I'd rather deal with that and live in a beautiful climate year-round than deal with north eastern winters.
  - tshaddox 5y ago
    > Miami in July is the closest thing to hell on Earth. But I'd rather deal with that and live in a beautiful climate year-round than deal with north eastern winters. Thank goodness the West Coast exists to relieve us of that dreadful dilemma!
deleted 5y ago
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rdiddly 5y ago
It's the best. I was able to move out of the place I was in, which was a traffic-dominated hellscape and a complete "non-place" and the ultimate marriage of convenience (and not even that convenient), and move to a great place with fresh air near a great beach for a similar price. I've got a tan this year already. Not because I'm trying, but because I went from trying my damnedest to never leave the house (the surroundings were that boring and unpleasant) to now getting outside every chance I get, because I want to. It's so obvious - spend your life in a place where you want to be. But it took a pandemic to give me and my employer the nerve to do it.
Guest42 5y ago
What part of Florida? I’ve only been to Tampa and Fort Lauderdale.
whb07 5y ago
Don’t forget the reasons why you left NY.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
nomy99 5y ago
Nyc isn’t for everyone, I’m glad you found an alternative
auston 5y ago
Hey! Are you in Miami by chance!?
rconti 5y ago
Never been to Florida, but from all the cyclists I know, it sounds like the third circle of hell from about May to October. Between the humidity and the bugs and the rain (rain? in the summer? crazy to this west coaster!), I couldn't do it.
sweetcheeks69 5y ago
Hope you vote Democrat!
- sweetcheeks69 5y ago
  I was being sarcastic. AKA Don't forget why you left NY!

by cletus 5y ago

torgian 5y ago

It’s possible if you become a contractor. That’s what I am now, and I have worked for two companies so far. I live outside the states now. But it does mean dealing with your own taxes, charging a higher rate to compensate for those taxes and other bills, etc. however, I’ve found that I can charge higher and the company can still save money simply because they don’t have to pay for things they would normally pay a permanent employee. But, it does come with a risk of losing your job more easily.

nwb 5y ago
Curious what you do and what your strategy was for being a contractor. Care to share?
carnitas 5y ago
Seconded, please share. Do you make significantly more money than full time employee status?
- ska 5y ago
  Typically for a freelancer/contractor (as against a consultant) yes but also no. On a nominal hourly or whatever rate you come out ahead, but life can throw you curveballs that mean you don't end up ahead.
  - torgian 5y ago
    This. And I started low too. But keep in mind my situation is _not_ typical at all. It’s a bit big to share here and it’s late but I’ll get back on this

minsc__and__boo 5y ago

>It's worth noting that this doesn't enable a true digital nomad lifestyle if that's what you want. This isn't that hard to circumvent with a mailing address. The real blocker has been pre-covid management not being comfortable with 100% remote.

er4hn 5y ago
State taxes are generally not something you want to circumvent. Ps - great baldurs gate 2 ref in your username :)
- minsc__and__boo 5y ago
  Well, tax circumvention never is a good idea, but I know plenty of military folks who get away with it though. I once saw a sailboat named "Minsc", that had a dingy hanging off the stern named "Boo" but it was gone before I could snap a picture. Probably off to do butt kicking.
  - d110af5ccf 5y ago
    It's not tax evasion when active military does it. They have a system and criteria for selecting which state you want to be a legal resident of. I don't recall how it works off the top of my head.
- bradleyjg 5y ago
  In the digital nomad case you aren’t circumventing state or federal taxes. By saying you are in, say NC, when you are really in Thailand, Croatia, or Costa Rica depending on the time of year—-you are paying more taxes then you’d owe, not less. Leaving aside timezones, which you could adjust to if you wanted to, the real issue is that your employers can’t be sure it’s complying with Thai, Croatian, and Costa Rica law and doesn’t want to be the effort in to figure out how to be sure.
- toomuchtodo 5y ago
  https://theboatgalley.com/establishing-residency-at-st-brendans-isle/ https://theboatgalley.com/establishing-residency-at-st-brend... This makes Florida your domicile, so no state income taxes (but, of course, you're paying Federal taxes regardless of where you reside in the world). The mail processor in question caters specifically to cruisers/yachties and RVers. Give the address to work and family, no one knows you're living the digital nomad life unless you share. Get a Schwab or Fidelity checking account for fee free ATM withdrawals globally, and a credit card with no foreign transaction fee.

cactus2093 5y ago

> NYC summers are a special kind of hell beyond the heat and humidity That is absolutely wild to me. I also lived in NYC for 10 years, the summers there are magical. The city comes alive in such a unique way, people are outside relaxing in the parks, having backyard and rooftop parties, heading out to the beach on the weekends. There are a bunch of great weekend trips to be had a few hours away by train in Long Island or Connecticut or upstate NY. You can join an after work rec league with friends. There's concerts in the park once or twice a week, and free movie showings on the waterfront. The bars and restaurants are more lively. One of the best parts of NYC in general is just how much there is to do if you like getting out and being social, and in the summer it's just turned up to the max. Most apartments don't come with AC, but as long as you can afford $300 for a good floor unit to put in front of the window you can keep your home temperature very comfortable.

cletus 5y ago
> I also lived in NYC for 10 years, the summers there are magical. Summers in NYC can be quite mild. If memory serves 2016-2019 were all quite mild with only very brief hellish patches. Some earlier summers though were... horrible. For me, the magical time in NYC is spring and fall, specifically May and September-October. Those are my favourite times in the city. The days are still relatively long. The weather is nice and mild. But there is something about the oppressive heat radiating off the sidewalk and the buildings and the air is humid and completely still that is just completely draining to me, in the height of a bad summer.
GongOfFour 5y ago
Did you commute every day on the subway? If so how long? I lived in NYC for 10 years and I hated the summer daily commute because all that aliveness led to hangovers and me sweating all that magicalness out daily on my walk and wait on the platform. You aren't wrong that NYC is great in the summer but it's also a special kind of hell with heat and humidity. Both can be true.
- cactus2093 5y ago
  Lol, fair enough. I do remember once being pretty dehydrated and being about to pass out on the subway ride home from work, standing in the middle of the packed, sweltering train with no room to move. Luckily someone saw me looking pale and offered me their seat. But at least in hindsight the good outweighs the bad :)

nkozyra 5y ago

> But I now live in Florida. It's about the 182nd day in a row where it's been 70-80F. What part of Florida? It generally starts hitting 90 in May most of the state and stays there into November. I've lived in NYC and yes, January-March can be tough and a few weeks in September are awful but Florida is just oppressively hot for six+ months of the year. The worst part is it doesn't cool down at night so you don't even get early morning or late night comfortable outside time

cletus 5y ago
Miami. I'm not sure it's hit 90F hit but it's definitely hit 85-88F. So close. I'm not sure how much hotter it'll get but I'm all about it still. I've thought about why this is. Not commuting I think is a big part of it. So the weather doesn't have to bother me if I don't want it to. Like I literally don't have to go anywhere. I think the trade winds are a big factor too. Hot, humid and still is a special kind of hell. Another is expectations. Like if you live in Miami you just assume it's going to be relatively warm (even hot) and humid. It's not a surprise. Lastly, I have more space here and more facilities where I live. I can go for a swim easily even if I don't want to go to the beach. I have been to Tampa in June/July years ago and that was hell. My circumstances were different and I'm sure my attitude was too. It actually turned me off Florida for years. Up until last year actually. Funny story: when deciding where to work remotely last year I was strongly considering Dallas (maybe Austin) and decided on a whim to go to Miami instead. I said if I don't like it I'll just go to Texas. I haven't left. Funnily enough, in that time Texas had the big arctic storm and a foot of snow in Austin. I think I made the right choice.
- nkozyra 5y ago
  I'm not trying to be argumentative, but you said: > It's about the 182nd day in a row where it's been 70-80F. And this is simply untrue (according to Weather.com and Weather Underground). I mention this because there's this big push (I'm sure you've noticed) among tech/VCs/Miami govt to paint a very rosy picture of Miami as an alternative to Silicon Valley. Every day this week is expected to be 86-89. And to folks not from Florida ... that's HOT in Florida. I've lived in NYC, I've lived in Austin, I've lived in "Hotlanta" ... there's nothing like a Florida hot. And unless you're right on the water, it feels ... like much more. The last week in January this year had 4 days above 80. The last week in February every single day was over 80 and two days over 85. In 2018 my NYC-based company decided to come to Orlando in the last week of February. Five of the seven days were OVER 90!

majormajor 5y ago

> But I now live in Florida. It's about the 182nd day in a row where it's been 70-80F. Sure it's humid and that may sound weird after the comment about NYC summers but NYC summers are a special kind of hell beyond the heat and humidity. Here there's usually a breeze. I've been here 6 months and I don't even use the AC. You're comparing FL winters to NYC summers? I'm not sure exactly where you are in FL, but... in most of the state, it gets as hot or hotter than NYC in the summer!

cletus 5y ago
Well it's June now. We're pretty close to what summer is. For the record, I'm in the Miami area. I think it's a little cooler here than some places more inland and upstate. Or maybe I'm imagining things. But what a difference the trade winds make (to me at least). Like I said, it's June and I'm still not using the AC. I just open up my house and enjoy the breeze. Some people, particularly up north, like the have their AC on 60 and wear layers indoors. For me that's a meat locker. I'm all about it being 75F with a breeze inside.
- felideon 5y ago
  Heh. Report back in August.
- tayo42 5y ago
  Surprised Miami is that breezy but if it is, it makes sense. ac doesn't really exist outside tourist stuff in the usvi either, Hawaii is like that too
- auston 5y ago
  To be fair, I'm a 35 year Florida resident and this summer has been exceptionally nice. It is usually crazy hot and humid by this time.
- drewnick 5y ago
  South Florida has has an unusually dry summer so far and I think that has kept the due points down. As another comment said, give it time and it'll catch up to you. I'm in Boca Raton and it feels wonderful, but by July/August it really gets oppressive. September/October, statistically, has the most rain as well.

wtvanhest 5y ago

I grew up in Naples. If you have only been there 6 months, you haven’t lived there during the summer yet. That said, I actually love Florida’s climate. The problem with Florida for me is the lack of outdoor activities, especially in the summer except for the beach and boat. I personally prefer the bay areas hiking, access to park, playgrounds etc, but if you prefer beach, Florida is amazing and you adjust quickly to shorts 320 days a year.

crossroadsguy 5y ago
Do these places have similar weather? I mean they’re both on the coast but we are talking about two different continents here.
- wtvanhest 5y ago
  I’m talking about Naples, Florida. I should have specified.

tshaddox 5y ago

I've never lived or spent significant summer time in Florida or New York City, but your descriptions of summer weather sounded surprising to me. I looked up weather data, and Jacksonville, Miami, and Tampa all get significantly hotter (4-7 degrees Fahrenheit higher average temperatures in the hottest part of summer), muggier, and cloudier in the summer. Only Miami is consistently windier in the summer than NYC. Is the wind the only difference you're talking about? At least on paper, it looks like I would vastly prefer the summer weather in NYC.

ehsankia 5y ago
Imo focusing on weather is overrated. I worked in the bay area for 3 years, and year the constant weather is cool but for me, far more important is where my friends, family and the things I want to be near are. A nice house, cool activities, vibrant community and stores, etc. Not saying those things are in NYC, there's many other great cities, but I definitely wouldn't pick a place just for the weather.
- tshaddox 5y ago
  The importance of weather obviously depends greatly on what you like to do, namely how much time you like to spend outside!
ianhawes 5y ago
IIRC part of South Florida (around Ft. Lauderdale) is the only tropical rainforest climate in the CONUS. I've spent time in the mid-Atlantic region and time in South Florida. Miami in July is the closest thing to hell on Earth. But I'd rather deal with that and live in a beautiful climate year-round than deal with north eastern winters.
- tshaddox 5y ago
  > Miami in July is the closest thing to hell on Earth. But I'd rather deal with that and live in a beautiful climate year-round than deal with north eastern winters. Thank goodness the West Coast exists to relieve us of that dreadful dilemma!

deleted 5y ago

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rdiddly 5y ago

It's the best. I was able to move out of the place I was in, which was a traffic-dominated hellscape and a complete "non-place" and the ultimate marriage of convenience (and not even that convenient), and move to a great place with fresh air near a great beach for a similar price. I've got a tan this year already. Not because I'm trying, but because I went from trying my damnedest to never leave the house (the surroundings were that boring and unpleasant) to now getting outside every chance I get, because I want to. It's so obvious - spend your life in a place where you want to be. But it took a pandemic to give me and my employer the nerve to do it.

Guest42 5y ago

What part of Florida? I’ve only been to Tampa and Fort Lauderdale.

whb07 5y ago

Don’t forget the reasons why you left NY.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

nomy99 5y ago

Nyc isn’t for everyone, I’m glad you found an alternative

auston 5y ago

Hey! Are you in Miami by chance!?

rconti 5y ago

Never been to Florida, but from all the cyclists I know, it sounds like the third circle of hell from about May to October. Between the humidity and the bugs and the rain (rain? in the summer? crazy to this west coaster!), I couldn't do it.

sweetcheeks69 5y ago

Hope you vote Democrat!

sweetcheeks69 5y ago
I was being sarcastic. AKA Don't forget why you left NY!