4 ms·

If you read my argument I'm saying the optics don't look good because the margins on phones are high AND they are taking platform fees on top of that. As the ma

If you read my argument I'm saying the optics don't look good because the margins on phones are high AND they are taking platform fees on top of that. As the margins on phones decrease in the future, the optics won't look as bad.

smoldesu 5y ago
That's not an excuse for them to be driving such insane margins then. Plus, who's to say that the iPhone doesn't receive another overhaul in the next few years, driving the margins back down? Apple will continue to play this game of cat-and-mouse for as long as you let them, and that's ultimately how they accumulate wealth. It's a campaign almost entirely ran on deception.
- jimbokun 5y ago
  It's a campaign ran on Apple making products that a lot of people like enough to buy them at the price Apple is selling them.
  - enos_feedler 5y ago
    Yes, and at some point it's possible consumers simply won't pay for some new technology down the road. Say for example, a very expensive health/bio sensor. However, Apple might feel that 1) it's good for the world to be able to monitor/improve health, 2) will give safe access to this sensor to 3rd party developers, so it's good Apple can draw on this revenue source from platform fees to make it happen, by killing margins to ship this sensor. I am not saying this is happening today at all. I just think it's good for the platform to have diverse revenue sources. It's good for Apple, but it might also be good for developers too
    - smoldesu 5y ago
      This is an idyllic situation which has sadly never panned out. Apple has had plenty of times to integrate their hardware and software with open standards, but time and time again they reject it in favor of overcomplicated and inherently insecure solutions. Imagine how simple messaging would be if iMessage was an open protocol, or Airdrop was a standardized and unlicensed. The solution isn't to crush your competitors, it's to coexist with them. Google, Microsoft, Amazon and Facebook have all accepted their postmodern places in the industry, and Apple will continue to stick out like a sore thumb until they return to their core competencies and quit repeating the mistakes Microsoft made in the late 90s.
  - smoldesu 5y ago
    Customers aren't the only factor here, though. Developers are coming out en-masse to denounce Apple's business practices right now, and the government has been starting to intervene lately too. It's obvious that there is contention in Apple's ecosystem, so they'd be much better suited to addressing it outright instead of dragging it into the world's longest media fiasco. This is (and has been) one of Tim Cook's massive pitfalls, and he repeatedly falls into these asinine grudge matches that only further destroy what little digital cogency there is in this world.
jimbokun 5y ago
So basically in your opinion businesses making a lot of money makes for bad optics.
- JKCalhoun 5y ago
  I would have to agree with that. Excessive greed is bad optics.
- smoldesu 5y ago
  Apple is literally the world's largest company. I would argue that increasing their market share of anything, anywhere is harmful to the future of humanity, full stop.
- enos_feedler 5y ago
  No the optics around charging developers large platform fees when they also highly profitable on the phone itself. This whole thread is about double dipping. I am specifically talking about "double dipping" and the optics of that.

smoldesu 5y ago

That's not an excuse for them to be driving such insane margins then. Plus, who's to say that the iPhone doesn't receive another overhaul in the next few years, driving the margins back down? Apple will continue to play this game of cat-and-mouse for as long as you let them, and that's ultimately how they accumulate wealth. It's a campaign almost entirely ran on deception.

jimbokun 5y ago
It's a campaign ran on Apple making products that a lot of people like enough to buy them at the price Apple is selling them.
- enos_feedler 5y ago
  Yes, and at some point it's possible consumers simply won't pay for some new technology down the road. Say for example, a very expensive health/bio sensor. However, Apple might feel that 1) it's good for the world to be able to monitor/improve health, 2) will give safe access to this sensor to 3rd party developers, so it's good Apple can draw on this revenue source from platform fees to make it happen, by killing margins to ship this sensor. I am not saying this is happening today at all. I just think it's good for the platform to have diverse revenue sources. It's good for Apple, but it might also be good for developers too
  - smoldesu 5y ago
    This is an idyllic situation which has sadly never panned out. Apple has had plenty of times to integrate their hardware and software with open standards, but time and time again they reject it in favor of overcomplicated and inherently insecure solutions. Imagine how simple messaging would be if iMessage was an open protocol, or Airdrop was a standardized and unlicensed. The solution isn't to crush your competitors, it's to coexist with them. Google, Microsoft, Amazon and Facebook have all accepted their postmodern places in the industry, and Apple will continue to stick out like a sore thumb until they return to their core competencies and quit repeating the mistakes Microsoft made in the late 90s.
- smoldesu 5y ago
  Customers aren't the only factor here, though. Developers are coming out en-masse to denounce Apple's business practices right now, and the government has been starting to intervene lately too. It's obvious that there is contention in Apple's ecosystem, so they'd be much better suited to addressing it outright instead of dragging it into the world's longest media fiasco. This is (and has been) one of Tim Cook's massive pitfalls, and he repeatedly falls into these asinine grudge matches that only further destroy what little digital cogency there is in this world.

jimbokun 5y ago

So basically in your opinion businesses making a lot of money makes for bad optics.

JKCalhoun 5y ago
I would have to agree with that. Excessive greed is bad optics.
smoldesu 5y ago
Apple is literally the world's largest company. I would argue that increasing their market share of anything, anywhere is harmful to the future of humanity, full stop.
enos_feedler 5y ago
No the optics around charging developers large platform fees when they also highly profitable on the phone itself. This whole thread is about double dipping. I am specifically talking about "double dipping" and the optics of that.