4 ms·

That’s because diversity and inclusion pretty much means “blacks” and “women” fullstop. I was recently hiring a developer and my massive media company insisted

That’s because diversity and inclusion pretty much means “blacks” and “women” fullstop. I was recently hiring a developer and my massive media company insisted I ensure my recruiter is giving me diverse candidates. I selected an individual who is apparently Spanish Jewish. Some very rare tribe of Jews from Spain. Was that considered diverse? Nope. Needs to be black.

winrid 5y ago
I actually had a manager at a company openly say they were having trouble finding an intern as they only wanted a minority. I ended up waiting for months. I am very happy I got out of that place...
- adflux 5y ago
  How is it that some people are so careful about being diverse that they end up being incredibly racist, and yet not notice it ?!
  - nemo44x 5y ago
    Because to be anti-racist you need to implement present discrimination to make up for past discrimination. It’s in their literature and literally a tenant in Kendi’s popular book “How to be an Anti-Racist” that countless diversity councils in corporations suggested their employees read during last years moral panic. Civil rights violation? Probably.
    - frockington1 5y ago
      Anti-Racism is a hard concept for me to grasp. When I was growing up we were taught to judge everyone by the content of their character. To me it made sense, why care about what people look like if they are good people. But now that view is considered racist and judging people by what they look like is "back in style" so to speak.
cik 5y ago
I fully relate to this. Years ago I worked for a Canadian subsidiary of a US company doing work with the US government. On a (illegal in Canada) US government form I accurately marked down that my "Protected Origin Class". I am 50% African and 50% Asian, as a Moroccan-Jewish, Israeli. We were audited. The American auditor was flabbergasted by my values on the form. He literally told me that as a (visible, brown) Jew, I couldn't possibly mark those things down. I had to resort to pulling out maps and asking if Morocco was in Africa and Israel was in Asia. He was flummoxed by my refusal to mark down "white" when a) I'm not white, and b) his form offered me the ability to mark down what I am. Pointing out that percentage-wise as Jew, I was less than 0.006% of Canada's population also didn't make me a minority apparently. That was the last time I ever assumed that minority is supposed to mean anything other than the tokenized narrative of the time.
- FlyingSaucer 5y ago
  Huh, so its not only me. My grandparents came from Libya in the late 1950's, but for some reason the very north of Africa doesn't quite qualify for most people as African "enough" for me to be of African descent. Feels like for many people the benchmark is either skin color or not coming from a traditionally Arab country. A similar thing happens to acquaintances of mine of Tunisian or Algerian descent. I guess the geographical line is somewhere around Mauritania
  - treis 5y ago
    Because it's asking about ethnicity not geographic place of birth.
    - FlyingSaucer 5y ago
      English isn't my native tongue so perhaps i'm missing some subtlety, i thought ethnic groups are people who share a common descent? Honestly asking, not trying to nitpick.
      - SauciestGNU 5y ago
88840-8855 5y ago
Exactly this! In Germany it is women + openly gay + women wearing headscarfs. I was recently invited to a candidate selection process with senior managers and HR. There was one guy who was autistic, but talented and good. He was "weird" by normal standards, but scored very well in all interviews and calls. Long story short, he was considered the "best", but "weird". We hired a less qualified woman wearing a headscarf and the position was then "adjusted" to be more innovation/marketing foused and less hard tech focused. I tried to convince them to take the autistic dude and also argued with diversity, but was told that "he is just strange and will not fit in" and finally overruled.
shlant 5y ago
most actions the majority of corps take when it comes to "diversity" are purely performative. Diversity is important and more people should care about it, but what constitutes as "diverse" in the corporate environment is only what looks good on the outside and has a minimal (perceived) impact on the bottom line. A good example is exactly what is going on now: multinationals all temporarily slapping a rainbow on products to take advantage of a movement (like Raytheon. wtf... https://twitter.com/RaytheonTech https://twitter.com/RaytheonTech)
DrBenCarson 5y ago
Sephardic Jews are far from “very rare.” They’re also some of the wealthiest people per capita the world over during the last century. Lastly, they are genetically and culturally white. The current diversity balance is so far off, companies cannot afford to call different shades of white “diverse” anymore. The 80s came and went. Your company is in the right on this one, I’m afraid.
elzbardico 5y ago
Not that I agree with those mandates too much, but I can see the logic: A group needs to have a story of oppression in your local community to be considered for that. Diversity is a somewhat misleading word here, the aim is equality for historically disfavored groups.
- nemo44x 5y ago
  The aim for it is "equality of outcomes" without merit or actual achievement and that's all. Of course only in certain, sought after, select things. And of course these policies won't stop after we have achieved "equality" if current college admissions and graduation trends are any indication (women represent 60% now, yet nobody says we need to discontinue programs designed to ensure success for them or that we should address the problem of men falling behind - in fact we blame men for it). It's why Asian's are beginning to wake up to this as they've, as a group, been "too successful" and are seeing ever meritocratic device they've used to lift themselves up dismantled and replaced with lotteries, etc that ensure equal outcomes (even they won't).
- stronglikedan 5y ago
  We've had equality (equal opportunity). Now the aim is, unfortunately, equity (equal outcomes, regardless of merit).

winrid 5y ago

I actually had a manager at a company openly say they were having trouble finding an intern as they only wanted a minority. I ended up waiting for months. I am very happy I got out of that place...

adflux 5y ago
How is it that some people are so careful about being diverse that they end up being incredibly racist, and yet not notice it ?!
- nemo44x 5y ago
  Because to be anti-racist you need to implement present discrimination to make up for past discrimination. It’s in their literature and literally a tenant in Kendi’s popular book “How to be an Anti-Racist” that countless diversity councils in corporations suggested their employees read during last years moral panic. Civil rights violation? Probably.
  - frockington1 5y ago
    Anti-Racism is a hard concept for me to grasp. When I was growing up we were taught to judge everyone by the content of their character. To me it made sense, why care about what people look like if they are good people. But now that view is considered racist and judging people by what they look like is "back in style" so to speak.

cik 5y ago

I fully relate to this. Years ago I worked for a Canadian subsidiary of a US company doing work with the US government. On a (illegal in Canada) US government form I accurately marked down that my "Protected Origin Class". I am 50% African and 50% Asian, as a Moroccan-Jewish, Israeli. We were audited. The American auditor was flabbergasted by my values on the form. He literally told me that as a (visible, brown) Jew, I couldn't possibly mark those things down. I had to resort to pulling out maps and asking if Morocco was in Africa and Israel was in Asia. He was flummoxed by my refusal to mark down "white" when a) I'm not white, and b) his form offered me the ability to mark down what I am. Pointing out that percentage-wise as Jew, I was less than 0.006% of Canada's population also didn't make me a minority apparently. That was the last time I ever assumed that minority is supposed to mean anything other than the tokenized narrative of the time.

FlyingSaucer 5y ago
Huh, so its not only me. My grandparents came from Libya in the late 1950's, but for some reason the very north of Africa doesn't quite qualify for most people as African "enough" for me to be of African descent. Feels like for many people the benchmark is either skin color or not coming from a traditionally Arab country. A similar thing happens to acquaintances of mine of Tunisian or Algerian descent. I guess the geographical line is somewhere around Mauritania
- treis 5y ago
  Because it's asking about ethnicity not geographic place of birth.
  - FlyingSaucer 5y ago
    English isn't my native tongue so perhaps i'm missing some subtlety, i thought ethnic groups are people who share a common descent? Honestly asking, not trying to nitpick.
    - SauciestGNU 5y ago

88840-8855 5y ago

Exactly this! In Germany it is women + openly gay + women wearing headscarfs. I was recently invited to a candidate selection process with senior managers and HR. There was one guy who was autistic, but talented and good. He was "weird" by normal standards, but scored very well in all interviews and calls. Long story short, he was considered the "best", but "weird". We hired a less qualified woman wearing a headscarf and the position was then "adjusted" to be more innovation/marketing foused and less hard tech focused. I tried to convince them to take the autistic dude and also argued with diversity, but was told that "he is just strange and will not fit in" and finally overruled.

shlant 5y ago

most actions the majority of corps take when it comes to "diversity" are purely performative. Diversity is important and more people should care about it, but what constitutes as "diverse" in the corporate environment is only what looks good on the outside and has a minimal (perceived) impact on the bottom line. A good example is exactly what is going on now: multinationals all temporarily slapping a rainbow on products to take advantage of a movement (like Raytheon. wtf... https://twitter.com/RaytheonTech https://twitter.com/RaytheonTech)

DrBenCarson 5y ago

Sephardic Jews are far from “very rare.” They’re also some of the wealthiest people per capita the world over during the last century. Lastly, they are genetically and culturally white. The current diversity balance is so far off, companies cannot afford to call different shades of white “diverse” anymore. The 80s came and went. Your company is in the right on this one, I’m afraid.

elzbardico 5y ago

Not that I agree with those mandates too much, but I can see the logic: A group needs to have a story of oppression in your local community to be considered for that. Diversity is a somewhat misleading word here, the aim is equality for historically disfavored groups.

nemo44x 5y ago
The aim for it is "equality of outcomes" without merit or actual achievement and that's all. Of course only in certain, sought after, select things. And of course these policies won't stop after we have achieved "equality" if current college admissions and graduation trends are any indication (women represent 60% now, yet nobody says we need to discontinue programs designed to ensure success for them or that we should address the problem of men falling behind - in fact we blame men for it). It's why Asian's are beginning to wake up to this as they've, as a group, been "too successful" and are seeing ever meritocratic device they've used to lift themselves up dismantled and replaced with lotteries, etc that ensure equal outcomes (even they won't).
stronglikedan 5y ago
We've had equality (equal opportunity). Now the aim is, unfortunately, equity (equal outcomes, regardless of merit).