5 ms·

I hope this won't be similar to decriminalizing weed where people assumed it's also fine to drive while high :/

by takeda 5y ago

whateveracct 5y ago
Legalizing weed didn't do that. There's always been an opinion (argument?) that driving high is fine. Carl Sagan even discusses it in Mr. X (1969): > I have mentioned that in the cannabis experience there is a part of your mind that remains a dispassionate observer, who is able to take you down in a hurry if need be. I have on a few occasions been forced to drive in heavy traffic when high. I’ve negotiated it with no difficulty at all, though I did have some thoughts about the marvelous cherry-red color of traffic lights. I find that after the drive I’m not high at all. There are no flashes on the insides of my eyelids. If you’re high and your child is calling, you can respond about as capably as you usually do. I don’t advocate driving when high on cannabis, but I can tell you from personal experience that it certainly can be done. http://hermiene.net/essays-trans/mr_x.html http://hermiene.net/essays-trans/mr_x.html
- thatcat 5y ago
  Yea, it's actually a banned substance in esports racing because of it's known performance enhancing qualities.
  - whateveracct 5y ago
    hah I did not know that Does this mean all my rhythm game personal best are invalid '-'
- JohnWhigham 5y ago
  And Sigmund Freud spent a decade using cocaine daily. Doesn't mean it's OK for everyone else to.
  - whateveracct 5y ago
    I actually wasn't arguing from authority. I think the paragraph stands alone without the author's name attached (in fact it was originally published under a pseudonym, proving this point.)
    - throwamon 5y ago
      Sure, the paragraph stands alone as a single data point. GP's point stands.
- CheezeIt 5y ago
  Yes it did. Traffic deaths in Colorado have grown much faster than the population and much more than the national rate, since legalization.
  - whateveracct 5y ago
    That doesn't mean it made people's opinion of driving high more favorable. It could just mean more people are high period, but the rate of people who drive high remained the same.
    - CheezeIt 5y ago
      Well, okay. I guess we’d have to read their minds to resolve this question. They might be less afraid of consequences for getting caught with weed, or caught while high, it being “just” a DUI.
  - kstrauser 5y ago
    Traffic deaths in CO were up 3% last year: https://kdvr.com/news/local/colorado-traffic-related-deaths-up-3-in-2020/ https://kdvr.com/news/local/colorado-traffic-related-deaths-... CO population increased by 15% in the last decade: https://www.9news.com/article/news/local/colorado-news/colorado-population-growth-census-2020/73-300040f2-72bf-4ad0-8653-1c2eaf6ab896 https://www.9news.com/article/news/local/colorado-news/color... It seems like it'd be really hard to defend the claim that the death rate (which isn't per-mile-driven, so lacks the context to actually evaluate it meaningfully) is growing "much faster" than the population.
    - CheezeIt 5y ago
      It’s actually really easy. Colorado marijuana legalization happened in 2014, not last year. So why are you looking at last year’s change?
      - kstrauser 5y ago
        I produced figures. Your turn. Edit: Never mind, got 'em. Here's Colorado's own numbers: https://www.codot.gov/safety/traffic-safety/assets/fatal-crash-data-city-county/Colorado_Historical_Fatalities_Graphs.pdf https://www.codot.gov/safety/traffic-safety/assets/fatal-cra... Notice that fatalities are up significantly, but so are vehicle miles traveled. In fact, in 2013, Colorado had .0075 fatalities per million miles driven. In 2019, that number was... .0075. In other words, your likelihood of dying per distance driven was almost exactly equal to 2013. This are the CO government's numbers, not mine or anyone else's. I don't have a dog in this hunt. I'm not from Colorado, and I don't use marijuana. But it's really hard to say that legalizing marijuana in CO had any affect on traffic safety at all, when the fatality rate is essentially identical afterward.
8note 5y ago
The problem you're highlighting is that driving is dangerous, more than anything else. Limiting the speed cars can drive is a much better mitigation, along with better city design to avoid car use, and minizmize fast car use. The approach of "what if the driver's attention is impaired by <thing>" Has to be rehashed for every instance of <thing> and is never going to fix the root of the problem - that cars are dangerous

I hope this won't be similar to decriminalizing weed where people assumed it's also fine to drive while high :/

by takeda 5y ago

I hope this won't be similar to decriminalizing weed where people assumed it's also fine to drive while high :/

Legalizing weed didn't do that. There's always been an opinion (argument?) that driving high is fine. Carl Sagan even discusses it in Mr. X (1969): > I have mentioned that in the cannabis experience there is a part of your mind that remains a dispassionate observer, who is able to take you down in a hurry if need be. I have on a few occasions been forced to drive in heavy traffic when high. I’ve negotiated it with no difficulty at all, though I did have some thoughts about the marvelous cherry-red color of traffic lights. I find that after the drive I’m not high at all. There are no flashes on the insides of my eyelids. If you’re high and your child is calling, you can respond about as capably as you usually do. I don’t advocate driving when high on cannabis, but I can tell you from personal experience that it certainly can be done. http://hermiene.net/essays-trans/mr_x.html http://hermiene.net/essays-trans/mr_x.html

thatcat 5y ago
Yea, it's actually a banned substance in esports racing because of it's known performance enhancing qualities.
- whateveracct 5y ago
  hah I did not know that Does this mean all my rhythm game personal best are invalid '-'
JohnWhigham 5y ago
And Sigmund Freud spent a decade using cocaine daily. Doesn't mean it's OK for everyone else to.
- whateveracct 5y ago
  I actually wasn't arguing from authority. I think the paragraph stands alone without the author's name attached (in fact it was originally published under a pseudonym, proving this point.)
  - throwamon 5y ago
    Sure, the paragraph stands alone as a single data point. GP's point stands.
CheezeIt 5y ago
Yes it did. Traffic deaths in Colorado have grown much faster than the population and much more than the national rate, since legalization.
- whateveracct 5y ago
  That doesn't mean it made people's opinion of driving high more favorable. It could just mean more people are high period, but the rate of people who drive high remained the same.
  - CheezeIt 5y ago
    Well, okay. I guess we’d have to read their minds to resolve this question. They might be less afraid of consequences for getting caught with weed, or caught while high, it being “just” a DUI.
- kstrauser 5y ago
  Traffic deaths in CO were up 3% last year: https://kdvr.com/news/local/colorado-traffic-related-deaths-up-3-in-2020/ https://kdvr.com/news/local/colorado-traffic-related-deaths-... CO population increased by 15% in the last decade: https://www.9news.com/article/news/local/colorado-news/colorado-population-growth-census-2020/73-300040f2-72bf-4ad0-8653-1c2eaf6ab896 https://www.9news.com/article/news/local/colorado-news/color... It seems like it'd be really hard to defend the claim that the death rate (which isn't per-mile-driven, so lacks the context to actually evaluate it meaningfully) is growing "much faster" than the population.
  - CheezeIt 5y ago
    It’s actually really easy. Colorado marijuana legalization happened in 2014, not last year. So why are you looking at last year’s change?
    - kstrauser 5y ago
      I produced figures. Your turn. Edit: Never mind, got 'em. Here's Colorado's own numbers: https://www.codot.gov/safety/traffic-safety/assets/fatal-crash-data-city-county/Colorado_Historical_Fatalities_Graphs.pdf https://www.codot.gov/safety/traffic-safety/assets/fatal-cra... Notice that fatalities are up significantly, but so are vehicle miles traveled. In fact, in 2013, Colorado had .0075 fatalities per million miles driven. In 2019, that number was... .0075. In other words, your likelihood of dying per distance driven was almost exactly equal to 2013. This are the CO government's numbers, not mine or anyone else's. I don't have a dog in this hunt. I'm not from Colorado, and I don't use marijuana. But it's really hard to say that legalizing marijuana in CO had any affect on traffic safety at all, when the fatality rate is essentially identical afterward.

8note 5y ago

The problem you're highlighting is that driving is dangerous, more than anything else. Limiting the speed cars can drive is a much better mitigation, along with better city design to avoid car use, and minizmize fast car use. The approach of "what if the driver's attention is impaired by <thing>" Has to be rehashed for every instance of <thing> and is never going to fix the root of the problem - that cars are dangerous