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The 4:6 method for coffee-brewing (2017) [video]
- natedubyah 5y agoNow if only we can break it down to a 2:3 method,
- neogodless 5y agoBefore seeing the OP video, I've been going on this V60 technique by James Hoffmann. It's similar. For 30g of grounds, 500g of water. 60g (often closer to 90g if you try to get all the grounds wet) initially before waiting 45 seconds. The another 240g over the next 30 seconds. And then the remaining 300g over another 30 seconds. Simple enough to do every morning. I'd like to try going with less water in that initial pour, though, to see if I can get a sweeter taste. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AI4ynXzkSQo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AI4ynXzkSQo
- TurboHaskal 5y agoI do a single pour without bloom and then stir. For me this results in a tastier cup much similar to what I get with the Aeropress. Works with max 20g of coffee (at the usual 1:15 ratio) otherwise the brew will take too long.
- ardfie 5y agoTetsu Kasuya actually also has a similar method https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=miuPSjazpyw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=miuPSjazpyw
- DHPersonal 5y agoI am thankful for having a dulled sense of taste because I like cheap coffee and have found my satisfactory level of flavor from a very basic level of effort. This amount of concern over all the factors of brewing a cup of a hot flavored beverage feels to be on the level of sound quality goals for audiophiles, purchasing ever-increasingly expensive accessories.
- BugsJustFindMe 5y agoYou and me both. I like to joke that I really just love coffee more than everyone else, because I like it equally in all of its forms instead of chasing meticulous preparations.
- lucideer 5y agoIn that case you may enjoy this video from James Hoffman (who is considered one of the most coffee of coffee snobs) on drinking "bad" coffee: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=tU1y7hBSgiY https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=tU1y7hBSgiY
- jldl805 5y agoThe audiophile analogy is valid, but only because you can be an audiophile chasing brand names or status (and you will probably get it if you spend enough), or you can be an audiophile that seeks out high quality gear without the snake oil. Same with coffee makers. I would consider myself a coffee snob but I've ditched all the fancy gear and use a $12 pour over device from OXO. That and a basic water kettle will get you world-class coffee for less than the cost of a basic Mr. Coffee unit.
- DHPersonal 5y agoI was speaking more of the former, through the restless pursuit of a perfect experience, feeling that contentment is akin to (temporary) settling. My setup is using one of those cheap plastic Melitta pour-overs with the paper liners, which has provided me the most consistent, cost-effective, easy-to-use methods of getting the flavor I like.
- moehm 5y agoValid, but you forgot your $600 zero retention burr grinder.
- beeforpork 5y agoHehe, yes, I am sure. Mine was 800€. To pay this, you need to be a coffee nerd, but I think it is absolutely the most important thing to get consistency and satisfaction. I use an inherited antique ceramique (no plastique) pour over filter and do not feel it has any drawbacks. I will try Tetsu's technique.
- hownottowrite 5y agoNot exactly sure how Kasuya claims to have invented this method. Graduated pours are pretty standard. I’ve been doing it with French Press for years and the results are pretty great. Side Note: If you dislike the texture of French Press, puncture the bloom after 4 minutes of brew time then wait 2-3 minutes before plunging.
- unwind 5y agoIf you are not down with the coffee terminology, this [1] is a good explanation of what "the bloom" means. Basically it's a thing that forms when fresh coffee grounds get moist, since that accelerates the release of trapped gasses. The gas leaves the grounds, but gets trapped by the surrounding water and substances extracted from the coffee, forming a foam. My interpretation is that "puncture the bloom" basically means "stir to break the formation of a foam ball on top of the coffee grounds". [1] https://foodal.com/drinks-2/coffee/guides-coffee/what-is-bloom/ https://foodal.com/drinks-2/coffee/guides-coffee/what-is-blo...
- hownottowrite 5y agoYes, the bloom is the foam that forms in the coffee grounds. It’s CO2 and releasing it allows for better extraction. Puncture means to take a knife and cut a few pie slices into the mass of grounds and release the gas beneath. The grounds will sink at that point. I try not to stir aggressively since that is counterproductive to producing a “clear” cup. Once a few minutes have passed, you can plunge accordingly.
- unethical_ban 5y agoI never knew what the bloom was, but I blindly followed directions from smart people on using the french press. Pour the 90C water into the pot, wait a minute, then stir the beans down into the water. Wait a few minutes more. I usually do 1min+4min.
- hownottowrite 5y agoNothing wrong with that. Pretty much textbook. Here’s a thing to try. Pour in the water about half way. Give it a quick stir. Let it sit for 45 seconds and then slowly pour in the rest of the water. Let it sit for 4 minutes. Then puncture the grounds in a couple places. Wait another 2 minutes and then plunge. Also the water should be 93C.
- iamben 5y agoA V60 dripper was one of my best purchases last year. They're about 8 quid. And even without a 'method' the coffee is still so much better than my Nespresso was. Furthermore - I thought I'd hate the faff, but it's actually pretty meditative. Especially first thing in the morning.
- dthul 5y agoThat's also my favorite way of making coffee. Add to that a manual grinder and you can't get much better.
- hinkley 5y agoThe V60 dripper fits almost exactly over the Luminarc quadro pitcher. When I do cold brew, I do it in a large french press, which catches most of the big chunks, then use an unbleached coffee filter to catch the fines. I stopped making cold brew however because it's too easy to drink and my family would like it very much if my heart did not explode.
- creamyhorror 5y agoI have doubts about the reproducibility (and objective quality) of the results of brewing methods like this. Let's see more scientific trials.
- distributedsean 5y agoI own a coffee roasting company and I 100% agree with you. This is pretty trivial to test (even a blind test would determine whether it was subjectively better or worse for an individual) but there is no interest in doing it, everyone comes up with their own dumb "method" and then in a year or two everyone switches to something else. A really good sign of this is to look at the various barista competitions from a couple of years ago and see how many of their amazing techniques are still being used.
- teekert 5y agoI can see why has to go around the world coaching, probably it involves explaining what the different grey levels mean. ;) Is it time? Temperature? Amount (Probably amount)? Am I stupid?
- mckirk 5y agoI feel you; I was more confused after the video than before knowing there was any "method" at all. I think the grey levels are just there to distinguish between different pours. So you take the amount of water you want to use and divide it into chunks which you pour separately (with a 45 second delay between), and depending on how large you make each chunk you get different results. I.e., first chunk large = sweeter; fewer chunks in the last 60% = less strong.
- bhrgunatha 5y agoIf you aren't joking and genuinely confused. They don't mean anything - they're used to show the idea of pouring water 5 times. Use B grams of beans. Use W = 3 * B * 5 grams of water Basic method: 1. Pour 5 times (p0 .. p4) each using 3 * B grams of water. 2. Wait 45 seconds before you pour again. 3. Allow the dripper to keep dripping for 3.5 minutes. Adjust sweet/acidic taste balance: p0 - δ grams, p1 + δ grams - sweeter. p0 + δ grams, p1 - δ grams - more acidic. Adjust strength by dividing the final 9 * B grams of water differently: stronger - pour less water more times. weaker - pour more water less times.
- teekert 5y agoI'm certainly not joking, apparently the grey scale itself means nothing then, that makes it a lot easier. Thanx!
- reedlaw 5y agoThank you, this is clearer and more concise than the video.
- hcrisp 5y agoIt still isn't clear if it is the change in water volume that is key to the technique or change in temperature / brew time, as in waiting longer results in a lower temp second pour but longer brew time. This conflates the temperature and brew time factors. I have always heard the key to a good cup is water temperature (between 195 and 205 F) and then adjust brew time based on preference (too short is green/sour, too long is burnt/bitter). I haven't found stuff like wetting the paper filter or stirring the bloom to make much if a difference.
- michaelgrafl 5y agoMan, I quit drinking coffee 48 hours ago because of bad side effects. This is not helping.
- herodoturtle 5y agoIt's the universe conspiring to test your will power. If you can resist after reading this HN thread, you'll be able to overcome any future temptation. Good luck.
- 300bps 5y agoI have never had a cup of coffee in my life. The comments are hilarious to me though, like everyone is speaking a different language.
- ctdonath 5y agoNeither had I for >35 years. Now I’m a full-on coffee snob. Come to the dark roast side!
- scientaster2 5y agoI switched to decaf and it's really the best of both worlds - water processed beans have a great taste without the caffeine crush
- ValentineC 5y agoIf it's because of acid reflux or heartburn, try darker roasts or cold brew. If it's because of caffeine jitters, try popping some L-theanine: https://examine.com/supplements/theanine/ https://examine.com/supplements/theanine/
- forgotmypw17 5y agoI have worked as a barista before, and also a pretty much life-long coffee drinker and lover, just a little bit of a snob and a seeker of quality. I know more than 20 different ways of making coffee. Here is the best coffee brewing method I've come up with. First, I get some CLEAN water, and I boil it in an unfinished metal or ceramic-finished metal pot. I use a regular pot so that I can see inside. I also like to let a little bit of the water evaporate... While it's getting ready, I get the best and freshest coffee grounds I can muster, it's better if I can grind them on the spot, but that's not always available. I put the coffee grounds, as much as I think is necessary, into a glass or ceramic bowl, and pour the boiling water over them. I optionally cover and/or stir and let steep. After about 5-15 minutes, I pour the coffee into another glass or ceramic bowl, letting the grounds stay at the bottom of the first bowl. The coffee is now ready for drinking. To keep it warm, I cover it and leave it in the oven for insulation, or use an electric plate. It usually doesn't last long. It's good cold too. The second best method I know is cold-brewing in a similar fashion, takes a number of hours I haven't tracked yet. If anyone is interested in learning why this method is better than all the others, please reply with the method you think is better and I will explain why you're wrong. :^) Edit: The method in the video is quite good, and my only complaint is that it uses disposable filters, which leads to unnecessary materials harvesting, human labor, biome squeeze, diesel use, waste output, and other artifacts of production.
- adenozine 5y agoHow does this compare in oil content? I used to be a big, BIG coffee drinker, and I've been using a french press for 15ish years, but I get heartburn now and it hurts more than it used to. What can be done to enjoy coffee, without so much oil?
- forgotmypw17 5y agoI know what you mean... I think I would make a more watery coffee, using less grounds. In order to make it still tasty, I would prioritize getting whole beans and smashing them up yourself not long before brewing. I would do this while avoiding plastic contact, e.g. a metal-bowl coffee grinder or one of those hand grinders (which I have not tried but assume work pretty well.)
- ctdonath 5y agoFor good beans: Get beans green from SweetMarias.com or the like. Not expensive ($6-9/pound). Get a cheap hot air popcorn popper. Mine was $3 used from Goodwill. Pour in 1 cup of beans, turn on. After about 8 minutes you’ll hear beans start to crack - that’s a light roast. Cracking ends for a while - there’s medium. A second round of cracking happens around 9-10 minutes - dark. Past that you get oils extracting and near burned - French roast. Easy, cheap, fresh. ETA: https://youtu.be/mBU47Gzda3o https://youtu.be/mBU47Gzda3o
- reedlaw 5y agoFreshly popcorn popper-roasted beans are better than non-freshly roasted beans but not nearly as good as those of an experienced roaster using better equipment. Try local roasters or order fresh-roasted beans online. Fresh-roasted beans tend to improve in taste over several days and then rapidly decline after around ten days.
- distributedsean 5y ago100%
- ctdonath 5y agoYes, using better equipment with greater skill gets better results. I’m suggesting an easy way to begin the path there.
- ValentineC 5y ago> Fresh-roasted beans tend to improve in taste over several days and then rapidly decline after around ten days. I hear that one hack is to grind your freshly-roasted beans and leave them for a bit to degas. The far greater surface area means that they'll degas much faster than as a whole bean.
- tmaly 5y agoI have my own method with full immersion brewing that I have been making for the last 8 years. It is strong and full bodied. I still drink coffee outside the house, but this is my goto when I want a good cup.
- tamiral 5y agothe best part of making coffee is the experimentation. I'd recommend trying out what works for you and keep at it. My go to for big family gatherings/mornings are just a regular drip coffee pot while throughout the day it might be the aeropress , v60 or even an espresso. It's very easy to get bogged down in the "perfect" cup but no two cups I've made have been identical and I just live with that fact. If you live beside a roaster/local coffee shop that roasts the best thing to do is go talk to them about the coffee. Water is also a very big component of good coffee as most of what you are drinking is water and there are many companies like Third Wave Coffee (https://thirdwavewater.com https://thirdwavewater.com) that help with better tasting coffee. I get my coffee from a local roaster that sources direct from East Africa (https://kahawa-company.com https://kahawa-company.com) and they've been very helpful in answering tons of my questions. So what you need is: 1. Good Coffee 2. Good Water 3. Reasonable Grinder 4. A preferred method/ tool (french press, drip, moka pot, aeropress etc) 5. Patience to experiment
- jokethrowaway 5y agoThat's too much effort for me, but I'd be curious to try the results - maybe if a machine did the pouring for me after being configured. At the same time, I think I'd take a machine that does espresso over drip
- leoedin 5y agoHow do the various pour-over methods compare to espresso machine type coffee? I've got a strong preference for coffee brewed using an espresso machine (ie high pressure extraction pushed through a tiny hole), but I'm not really sure what the cause is - is it different levels of extracted compounds? Is there any pour-over methods (ie not pressurised) that are similar?
- 8ytecoder 5y agoEspresso machines are good at extracting the oils along with the coffee. The crema is basically the froth as a result of this. There are some beans (e.g., Yemeni ones) that have very high oil content and you can get a similar taste with simple brewing.
- ValentineC 5y agoIf you want the coffee oils, you can also try any of the pourover methods with a metal filter. The AeroPress does it quite well.
- willseth 5y agoThey're completely different brewing methods. Pour over is "slow," gravity based, and uses a medium to course grind (depending on brewing method), while espresso is "fast," uses a pump to pressurize the flow of water through the puck, and uses finer grinds. The closest manual brew method to espresso that I'm aware of is a Mocha Pot. There is also the AeroPress, which is kind of a hybrid brew style.
- leoedin 5y agoBut how do they differ along the only metric which matters? Taste? I don't really care about my brewing method, I don't particularly care about the time to brew (as long as its within a few minutes), I couldn't give a hoot about the grind size. What I care about is what the coffee tastes like. How do the different brewing methods differ in taste, and what causes them to differ?
- mbakke 5y agoI have been doing manual pour-overs for about a decade and never figured out how to balance acidity and sweetness. It always seemed somewhat random and arbitrary to me. The technique in the video blew my mind. I just tried it, balancing it on the "acidic" side as mine are typically fairly sweet, and it works as advertised. Thanks 112233 for teaching this old dog how to gain better control over my brew! Now I can impress my coffee-loving guests even further by brewing to their preference.
- sammalloy 5y agoI've tried it all, and the only thing that I'm happy with is the Moka pot method. If that isn't the perfect cup of coffee, I don't know what is.
- davidw 5y agoI don't think I ever saw anyone in Italy with a fancy coffee machine. They all use moka pots at home, and go to the local cafe if they want an espresso made with a machine.
- ip26 5y agoTo be fair, you can throw a rock anywhere in Italy and hit a cafe.
- ArchOversight 5y agoThat was one of the best parts of traveling in Florence. You could pick a different café every morning and by the end of a week long trip you'd still haven't tried all the café's in a two block radius.
- davidw 5y agoYeah - it's legal to open one pretty much anywhere - compared to the US where they're illegal in most areas of most cities. It's nice to be able to walk to stuff!
- ValentineC 5y agoI think it also helps that espresso tends to cost around €1 a shot.
- Eric_WVGG 5y agoEvery time I've tried a Moka I burn it. I've tried it all, and the only thing that I'm happy with is the Aeropress. If that isn't the perfect cup of coffee, I don't know what is.
- 5y ago
- jackdawed 5y agoI've made my coffee using this same method for over 2 years with a plastic V60. It is super simple and requires very little thinking for a consistent cup. The only variables I have to adjust when I get a new bag is the grind size.
- jptech 5y agoI used to use the plastic one too, but the advantage of ceramic is that it absorbs the heat, allowing the coffee to brew better.
- jackdawed 5y agoI agree, I own both (plastic V60, Kasuya ceramic). I switch it up depending on the weather, as well as the amount of coffee I want to make (300ml vs 400ml+), since they use different filter sizes.
- failwhaleshark 5y agoI'm trying to figure out how to do this with an aeropress.
- LoveMortuus 5y agoWithout bad coffee you can't appreciate the good coffee. That being said, for almost a year now if not more, I've switched to making coffee the following way: Take a pot fill it with water, add coffee, boil until the foam disappears, wait a few minutes for the coffee to rest. Pour into a cup, if desired add milk and/or sugar, enjoy! What I like about it, is that due to the size of my pot I can just leave the coffee on the stove and get ready and by the time I'm done, the coffee will also be done. What's important to remember is that everyone lives their life through their eyes, ears and perspective. Or in the other words, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. You may hate the coffee that I love. And that's okay ^^
- kblev 5y agoMy minimalist coffee recipe is this: put 1.5 tsp ground coffee in the mug, pour boiling water, stir, add milk. Done. The coffee needs to be good quality for the grounds to sink down, Lavazza always works for me. This coffee is like the French press, or a white Americano, just unfiltered. I call it Gypsycano.
- samstave 5y agoIsnt that called "cowboy coffee"
- schwartzworld 5y agoYes. It's also the same technique as Greek/Armenian/Turkish/Arabic coffee.