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Not everyone of course, and one should be attentive to and accommodating of teammates that feel that way. But surely “let’s knock off at three today and go dow

Not everyone of course, and one should be attentive to and accommodating of teammates that feel that way. But surely “let’s knock off at three today and go down the pub, thanks for all the hard work” is a positive for most people?

bluefirebrand 5y ago
"Thanks for all the hard work, let's knock off at three today" Is a positive. "Let's go down to the pub" is still capitalizing on my time. It's still work, just the location has changed. And in the past it has often started at 3 and then kept going and going until way later than if I'd just worked out my day. There is always some idealism around it like "oh if you don't drink you don't have to, just come hang out for a bit" or "you don't have to stay late you can leave early" but in practice people aren't actually that understanding. You try to head home and it's all "you're not having a good time?" Or "you're not a team player" No thanks. I'll pass on all of that from now on.
- ecpottinger 5y ago
  Exactly my experience.
- asdff 5y ago
  I can't believe that's real life for some people. I would never drink with someone who has "team player" in their dictionary unironically. That being said, the vast majority of my coworkers, all of them actually, are not robots like that. If they were, I would find a new job fast. If you are in a place like this currently, there are greener pastures my friend. Seek them out. Find people who don't care that you go home to beat traffic instead of hitting up the bar. They exist.
Angostura 5y ago
Try Let’s knock off at three today. I'm going down the pub - anyone care to join me? I'm buying."
- ivarv 5y ago
  An argument could be made that non-pub goers are still excluded from some kind of reward or compensation. If the buyer was spending their own personal money that might be one thing, but more often than not the funds come out of company expenses.
  - Jcampuzano2 5y ago
    In consulting companies I've worked for (and I'm inclined at least in part to agree) it would be argued that it is not necessarily equivalent to compensation since work is usually talked about in some capacity at these events. That's why they don't mind paying for these, because it is seen as additional collaboration/problem solving time. but they 100% would not be okay with handing out additional money to those who do not wish to attend. Edit: To clarify as well, I don't think people should feel forced or inclined to attend these events for whatever reason they wish, this is just the argument I know and quite literally is in onboarding training I've taken.
wott 5y ago
> But surely “let’s knock off at three today and go down the pub, thanks for all the hard work” is a positive for most people? Definitely not. 1. I am not fond of drinking with workmates. An occasional, incidental, one-on-one or not much more: OK. In groups ("teams"): no thanks, this isn't school, we are not students, so no pseudo school party. 2. I abhor having drinks with people who have any kind of hierarchical power upon me.
- the_mar 5y ago
  who hurt you? obviously don't get too drunk with coworkers, but do you know there is a way to have a drink or two and not turn it into a fraternity event
  - ecpottinger 5y ago
    And there is a way not to drink at all, it is called saying "NO!". What makes you think I want to even have one drink of alcohol?
- late2part 5y ago
  There are people in this world who say "Don't trust a guy (or gal) who won't have a beer with you."
  - ecpottinger 5y ago
    And those are the people I do not trust.
- TuringNYC 5y ago
  >> 2. I abhor having drinks with people who have any kind of hierarchical power upon me. Funny thing is the opposite isn't great either. I've seen a startup that likes doing this. Except all the decision-makers are in SF, not at the field office. So HH at the field office means none of the participants have any real power to see your passion, hear your ideas, or conversely for you to learn from their wisdom. It is still bonding for the team, but the team site is all terminal dead-end jobs.
dr-detroit 5y ago
Surely you're joking. Cracking a beer at 3:00PM is a classic sign of alcoholism.
Spooky23 5y ago
Some people will bitch and complain about anything. You could hand out $20 bills to everyone you see and in a big enough group someone will gripe. Imo the key is making sure you don’t create a perception that you punish or bully people for not participating. As evidenced by this thread, it’s easy to do even inadvertently.
- late2part 5y ago
  Correct. But, is it ingrained griping? Or Social Inequity Aversion? I don't like beer, so if you get it and I have to watch stupid sports and drink water, I don't want you to have your reward? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_inequity_aversion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_inequity_aversion
  - Spooky23 5y ago
    In many cases, yes. Others will complain that coworkers are asocial or they don’t feel an atmosphere of camaraderie. It’s all part of the package if you manage people. As I said, you need to be careful to avoid behaving in a way that creates bad situations. (Ie I’m not advocating frat house behavior or alcohol culture at work)
fastasucan 5y ago
Not for me. If I'm not working i'd rather do my hobbies, excercise, be with my friends or gf. And I dont enjoy sitting in a pub. I'll be more than glad to take a walk with a co-worker. Play some sports together etc, but I really really don't want to feel like I am doing a mandatory activity with my job. Either I am working or not.

bluefirebrand 5y ago

"Thanks for all the hard work, let's knock off at three today" Is a positive. "Let's go down to the pub" is still capitalizing on my time. It's still work, just the location has changed. And in the past it has often started at 3 and then kept going and going until way later than if I'd just worked out my day. There is always some idealism around it like "oh if you don't drink you don't have to, just come hang out for a bit" or "you don't have to stay late you can leave early" but in practice people aren't actually that understanding. You try to head home and it's all "you're not having a good time?" Or "you're not a team player" No thanks. I'll pass on all of that from now on.

ecpottinger 5y ago
Exactly my experience.
asdff 5y ago
I can't believe that's real life for some people. I would never drink with someone who has "team player" in their dictionary unironically. That being said, the vast majority of my coworkers, all of them actually, are not robots like that. If they were, I would find a new job fast. If you are in a place like this currently, there are greener pastures my friend. Seek them out. Find people who don't care that you go home to beat traffic instead of hitting up the bar. They exist.

Angostura 5y ago

Try Let’s knock off at three today. I'm going down the pub - anyone care to join me? I'm buying."

ivarv 5y ago
An argument could be made that non-pub goers are still excluded from some kind of reward or compensation. If the buyer was spending their own personal money that might be one thing, but more often than not the funds come out of company expenses.
- Jcampuzano2 5y ago
  In consulting companies I've worked for (and I'm inclined at least in part to agree) it would be argued that it is not necessarily equivalent to compensation since work is usually talked about in some capacity at these events. That's why they don't mind paying for these, because it is seen as additional collaboration/problem solving time. but they 100% would not be okay with handing out additional money to those who do not wish to attend. Edit: To clarify as well, I don't think people should feel forced or inclined to attend these events for whatever reason they wish, this is just the argument I know and quite literally is in onboarding training I've taken.

wott 5y ago

> But surely “let’s knock off at three today and go down the pub, thanks for all the hard work” is a positive for most people? Definitely not. 1. I am not fond of drinking with workmates. An occasional, incidental, one-on-one or not much more: OK. In groups ("teams"): no thanks, this isn't school, we are not students, so no pseudo school party. 2. I abhor having drinks with people who have any kind of hierarchical power upon me.

the_mar 5y ago
who hurt you? obviously don't get too drunk with coworkers, but do you know there is a way to have a drink or two and not turn it into a fraternity event
- ecpottinger 5y ago
  And there is a way not to drink at all, it is called saying "NO!". What makes you think I want to even have one drink of alcohol?
late2part 5y ago
There are people in this world who say "Don't trust a guy (or gal) who won't have a beer with you."
- ecpottinger 5y ago
  And those are the people I do not trust.
TuringNYC 5y ago
>> 2. I abhor having drinks with people who have any kind of hierarchical power upon me. Funny thing is the opposite isn't great either. I've seen a startup that likes doing this. Except all the decision-makers are in SF, not at the field office. So HH at the field office means none of the participants have any real power to see your passion, hear your ideas, or conversely for you to learn from their wisdom. It is still bonding for the team, but the team site is all terminal dead-end jobs.

dr-detroit 5y ago

Surely you're joking. Cracking a beer at 3:00PM is a classic sign of alcoholism.

Spooky23 5y ago

Some people will bitch and complain about anything. You could hand out $20 bills to everyone you see and in a big enough group someone will gripe. Imo the key is making sure you don’t create a perception that you punish or bully people for not participating. As evidenced by this thread, it’s easy to do even inadvertently.

late2part 5y ago
Correct. But, is it ingrained griping? Or Social Inequity Aversion? I don't like beer, so if you get it and I have to watch stupid sports and drink water, I don't want you to have your reward? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_inequity_aversion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_inequity_aversion
- Spooky23 5y ago
  In many cases, yes. Others will complain that coworkers are asocial or they don’t feel an atmosphere of camaraderie. It’s all part of the package if you manage people. As I said, you need to be careful to avoid behaving in a way that creates bad situations. (Ie I’m not advocating frat house behavior or alcohol culture at work)

fastasucan 5y ago

Not for me. If I'm not working i'd rather do my hobbies, excercise, be with my friends or gf. And I dont enjoy sitting in a pub. I'll be more than glad to take a walk with a co-worker. Play some sports together etc, but I really really don't want to feel like I am doing a mandatory activity with my job. Either I am working or not.