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One thing that bugs me is that on macOS access keys[0] are not underlined. This means I can't pick an action with the keyboard and have to use the trackpad. Any

One thing that bugs me is that on macOS access keys[0] are not underlined. This means I can't pick an action with the keyboard and have to use the trackpad. Anyone know how I can enable it / if that's even possible? As a recent Mac user, I don't know if this is a mac thing, but I hate not being able to use the keyboard to navigate around the UI. Although the trackpad is nice, it can't beat the precision of the keyboard. I can't focus the menu bar, trigger a context menu with the keyboard, tab around panels and buttons. It's an accessibility nightmare. [0]: https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/win32/uxguide/images/inter-keyboard-image3.png https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/win32/uxguide/image...

dom111 5y ago
I might be misremembering but isn't there a key combo ([Fn] + [Ctrl] + [F7] or something?) that enabled control selection and shows the underlines. I haven't used Mac OS for a while so I might be wrong! Edit: I'm impressed I even remembered that! https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT204434#fullkeyboard https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT204434#fullkeyboard
- wffurr 5y ago
  I always flip that setting on Macs. The default just seems wrong to me.
- oneeyedpigeon 5y ago
  Whilst that is the keyboard shortcut for that setting, it doesn't appear to underline access keys.
  - dom111 5y ago
    Ahh, I thought it did both, but that must be misremembering. A quick search indeed confirms there doesn't appear to be a way to do it... Apologies!
sitharus 5y ago
There is no Mac equivalent to this Windows feature. You can set up a shortcut to move keyboard focus to the menu bar in Keyboard preferences under Shortcuts (in fact you can remap any application’s keyboard shortcuts there). That’s also where you can enable keyboard navigation between controls.
- knolan 5y ago
  Its control F2 https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT204434 https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT204434
  - sitharus 5y ago
    That focuses the menu bar for keyboard navigation. The question was about the fast navigation keys Windows has on menu items, which has no Mac equivalent.
WhyNotHugo 5y ago
I find using macOS with a keyboard near impossible. One of the issues is how hard it is to discover what the right keybindings are. Second issue is that all the keymappings are different to Windows/Linux/BSD/AnythingElse. Like, in the setup wizard when you open a new mac, hitting "return" won't move you to the next step, you have to hit tab, and then space. However, near the end of the setup process, there's a screen where tab doesn't work, and you actually DO have to use return. I'd had carpal tunnel (and it's kind of a chronic thing), so using a touchpad to point-and-click is literally painful for me. A mouse is okay, but it seems to be impossible to connect bluetooth devices on macOS without using the touchpad.
- acdha 5y ago
  > One of the issues is how hard it is to discover what the right keybindings are. In addition the display in the menus, you can use the keyboard settings' shortcuts section to see the global keybindings and add new ones either globally or within a particular app. There's also a pretty comprehensive version here: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201236 https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201236 > Second issue is that all the keymappings are different to Windows/Linux/BSD/AnythingElse. There's a bit of early GUI history which explains most of this – MacOS was the earliest mainstream GUI and they had guidelines pretty early on which most Mac applications use. A decade or so later IBM decided they needed to create their own standard (Common User Access) which they pushed to get implemented on OS/2, Windows, and other operating systems. Mac users continued to want what they were familiar with, and applications which were business-focused in the late 80s-90s got CUA, and a whole lot of other software got some agglomeration of whatever the developers were familiar with and/or the toolkit they were using provided by default. > I'd had carpal tunnel (and it's kind of a chronic thing), so using a touchpad to point-and-click is literally painful for me. A mouse is okay, but it seems to be impossible to connect bluetooth devices on macOS without using the touchpad. Two ways: 1. If it's an Apple mouse with a lightning port, plug it in once with the cable. 2. It sounds like you might not have activated the accessibility setting which toggles tab navigation from only navigating between text fields to all controls. Use Control-F7 to toggle that and then: 1. Open settings – you can use Spotlight via Command-Space or Option + either the sound or display adjustment keys to open Settings without using a pointing device 2. Either navigate the icons or use search to select Bluetooth 3. Hit tab, the default focus ring will be on the “Turn Bluetooth Off” button if full control navigation mode is enabled. 4. Hit tab, focus will now be on the devices list 5. If your mouse is pairable, it'll show up with a connect button. Use the arrow keys to select that line and hit enter.
saagarjha 5y ago
⌘? is a good way to get to the menu bar on macOS.
CGamesPlay 5y ago
Not exactly what you asked for but a pretty great tip is to use Command-Shift-/ to select the search field in the Help menu, and using it as an ad-hoc command palette for all MacOS apps.
mmphosis 5y ago
One thing that bugs me is that on Windows access keys[0] are underlined. This means I accidentally hit the ALt key all the time and some unintended action happens. Anyone know how I can disable it / if that's even possible? As a recent Windows user, I don't know if this is a Windows thing, but I hate inconsistent keyboard navigation in the various UIs. Although the keyboard is nice, it can't beat the precision of the mouse. The unwanted focus on menu bars, the unwanted triggering of menus with the keyboard, and too many modes: tabs and panels and dialog boxes. It's an accessibility nightmare. [0]: https://developer.apple.com/design/human-interface-guidelines/macos/menus/menu-bar-menus/ https://developer.apple.com/design/human-interface-guideline...
- kristiandupont 5y ago
  I honestly don't know if you are joking or not. MacOS is superior to Windows in many ways but this is clearly not one..
danrodney 5y ago
On Windows I find it hard to remember random letters for accessing menu items. On macOS when a menu is active I can start typing the name of an item to go to it, which is easier for me because I remember names better than random letters. For frequent commands I learn the keystrokes.
gholap 5y ago
1. Disable native context menu (macOS native menus will never support access keys)[1] 2. Go to `about:config` and set `ui.key.menuAccessKey` to a custom value (I have it at 17)[2] [1]: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1711299 https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1711299 [2]: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1711299#c5 https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1711299#c5
- abdusco 5y ago
  You're a lifesaver, thank you! That was exactly what I've been looking for. I've played around with `ui.key.menuAccessKey` before, but I needed to turn off native menu (`widget.macos.native-context-menus`) to display the access keys.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
CyanDeparture 5y ago
I'm not sure if this is what you're looking for, but the first thing I enable on a new install is tabbing between UI elements and pressing enter to use them. If you go into System Preferences -> Keyboard -> Shortcuts (tab) There will be a checkbox at the bottom that says 'use keyboard navigation to move focus between controls'. This will do what it says! Hope this helps.

dom111 5y ago

I might be misremembering but isn't there a key combo ([Fn] + [Ctrl] + [F7] or something?) that enabled control selection and shows the underlines. I haven't used Mac OS for a while so I might be wrong! Edit: I'm impressed I even remembered that! https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT204434#fullkeyboard https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT204434#fullkeyboard

wffurr 5y ago
I always flip that setting on Macs. The default just seems wrong to me.
oneeyedpigeon 5y ago
Whilst that is the keyboard shortcut for that setting, it doesn't appear to underline access keys.
- dom111 5y ago
  Ahh, I thought it did both, but that must be misremembering. A quick search indeed confirms there doesn't appear to be a way to do it... Apologies!

sitharus 5y ago

There is no Mac equivalent to this Windows feature. You can set up a shortcut to move keyboard focus to the menu bar in Keyboard preferences under Shortcuts (in fact you can remap any application’s keyboard shortcuts there). That’s also where you can enable keyboard navigation between controls.

knolan 5y ago
Its control F2 https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT204434 https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT204434
- sitharus 5y ago
  That focuses the menu bar for keyboard navigation. The question was about the fast navigation keys Windows has on menu items, which has no Mac equivalent.

WhyNotHugo 5y ago

I find using macOS with a keyboard near impossible. One of the issues is how hard it is to discover what the right keybindings are. Second issue is that all the keymappings are different to Windows/Linux/BSD/AnythingElse. Like, in the setup wizard when you open a new mac, hitting "return" won't move you to the next step, you have to hit tab, and then space. However, near the end of the setup process, there's a screen where tab doesn't work, and you actually DO have to use return. I'd had carpal tunnel (and it's kind of a chronic thing), so using a touchpad to point-and-click is literally painful for me. A mouse is okay, but it seems to be impossible to connect bluetooth devices on macOS without using the touchpad.

acdha 5y ago
> One of the issues is how hard it is to discover what the right keybindings are. In addition the display in the menus, you can use the keyboard settings' shortcuts section to see the global keybindings and add new ones either globally or within a particular app. There's also a pretty comprehensive version here: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201236 https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201236 > Second issue is that all the keymappings are different to Windows/Linux/BSD/AnythingElse. There's a bit of early GUI history which explains most of this – MacOS was the earliest mainstream GUI and they had guidelines pretty early on which most Mac applications use. A decade or so later IBM decided they needed to create their own standard (Common User Access) which they pushed to get implemented on OS/2, Windows, and other operating systems. Mac users continued to want what they were familiar with, and applications which were business-focused in the late 80s-90s got CUA, and a whole lot of other software got some agglomeration of whatever the developers were familiar with and/or the toolkit they were using provided by default. > I'd had carpal tunnel (and it's kind of a chronic thing), so using a touchpad to point-and-click is literally painful for me. A mouse is okay, but it seems to be impossible to connect bluetooth devices on macOS without using the touchpad. Two ways: 1. If it's an Apple mouse with a lightning port, plug it in once with the cable. 2. It sounds like you might not have activated the accessibility setting which toggles tab navigation from only navigating between text fields to all controls. Use Control-F7 to toggle that and then: 1. Open settings – you can use Spotlight via Command-Space or Option + either the sound or display adjustment keys to open Settings without using a pointing device 2. Either navigate the icons or use search to select Bluetooth 3. Hit tab, the default focus ring will be on the “Turn Bluetooth Off” button if full control navigation mode is enabled. 4. Hit tab, focus will now be on the devices list 5. If your mouse is pairable, it'll show up with a connect button. Use the arrow keys to select that line and hit enter.

saagarjha 5y ago

⌘? is a good way to get to the menu bar on macOS.

CGamesPlay 5y ago

Not exactly what you asked for but a pretty great tip is to use Command-Shift-/ to select the search field in the Help menu, and using it as an ad-hoc command palette for all MacOS apps.

mmphosis 5y ago

One thing that bugs me is that on Windows access keys[0] are underlined. This means I accidentally hit the ALt key all the time and some unintended action happens. Anyone know how I can disable it / if that's even possible? As a recent Windows user, I don't know if this is a Windows thing, but I hate inconsistent keyboard navigation in the various UIs. Although the keyboard is nice, it can't beat the precision of the mouse. The unwanted focus on menu bars, the unwanted triggering of menus with the keyboard, and too many modes: tabs and panels and dialog boxes. It's an accessibility nightmare. [0]: https://developer.apple.com/design/human-interface-guidelines/macos/menus/menu-bar-menus/ https://developer.apple.com/design/human-interface-guideline...

kristiandupont 5y ago
I honestly don't know if you are joking or not. MacOS is superior to Windows in many ways but this is clearly not one..

danrodney 5y ago

On Windows I find it hard to remember random letters for accessing menu items. On macOS when a menu is active I can start typing the name of an item to go to it, which is easier for me because I remember names better than random letters. For frequent commands I learn the keystrokes.

gholap 5y ago

1. Disable native context menu (macOS native menus will never support access keys)[1] 2. Go to `about:config` and set `ui.key.menuAccessKey` to a custom value (I have it at 17)[2] [1]: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1711299 https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1711299 [2]: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1711299#c5 https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1711299#c5

abdusco 5y ago
You're a lifesaver, thank you! That was exactly what I've been looking for. I've played around with `ui.key.menuAccessKey` before, but I needed to turn off native menu (`widget.macos.native-context-menus`) to display the access keys.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

CyanDeparture 5y ago

I'm not sure if this is what you're looking for, but the first thing I enable on a new install is tabbing between UI elements and pressing enter to use them. If you go into System Preferences -> Keyboard -> Shortcuts (tab) There will be a checkbox at the bottom that says 'use keyboard navigation to move focus between controls'. This will do what it says! Hope this helps.