5 ms·

same experience here and I'm also all over Europe. The time when you could just fly without hassle only lasted a few years. Now I have to look into the empty ey

same experience here and I'm also all over Europe. The time when you could just fly without hassle only lasted a few years. Now I have to look into the empty eyes of some dweeb wanting to check my passport like I'm entering Beirut in 1982. I feel obliged to thank them out of artificial politeness but really want to just ask them why they had to get a job that allows them to display power. Not that these checks ever prevented a "terrorist" attack. Airports only catch small drug mules that could have taken a bus anyway. Freedom of movement was one of the major selling points for joining the EU to the unwashed middle classes. That has all gone to the dogs (at least for business travel). The only advantage of free movement that still exists is being able to live and work in other countries. It's typical when they do something in the name of "sEcURitY" they will never roll it back. Classic "salami tactic" and a slow encroachment by the system[1]. Opinions on this obviously vary depending if a person uses a uniform for work in order to compartmentalize their conscience, has to defend family working for the security apparatus, or peddles crappy/racist "AI based" biometric software to the system. Perhaps wanting to become a "person of authority" is like a gender thing which people have no choice over. So I shouldn't make fun or look down at them: ACAB ("Assigned Cop At Birth"). Also the worst of all countries has doubtlessly been the UK. Even you arrived coming from Europe, they shepherded you through the slow-lane like a smelly goat with noises that sound like Dick Van Dyke doing a Bricktop impression. [1] https://archive.org/details/JacquesEllulTheTechnologicalSociety https://archive.org/details/JacquesEllulTheTechnologicalSoci...

jamesrr39 5y ago
Also in Europe, but with a completely different experience; it is (well, was, pre-covid) easy to move between EU states. Within the Schengen Zone it's only the check at the gate to check your ID matches your boarding pass (so no check at "immigration"), and to/from the UK the electronic gates have really sped things up (compared to the old days). YMMV but I find I'm rarely waiting more than a few minutes at the immigration checks (to/from UK) nowadays.
- DyslexicAtheist 5y ago
  interesting. this seems to indicate that Schengen countries decided on a national level if they wanted to do checks on their borders. I have seen hard passport checks within Schengen in Croatia, Sweden, Germany, France and Portugal. Good to hear the UK has improved. I should have mentioned I haven't been there since 2018. I was expecting that brexit made things worse and had no idea
  - iso1631 5y ago
    Brexit didn't really kick in until January this year, and covid impact masks any brexit impact
  - StavrosK 5y ago
    Greece doesn't check ID at the airport either, beyond matching your boarding pass to your name.
  - Kbelicius 5y ago
    Croatia is not part of Schengen so there shouldn't be any surprise about them doing the hard checks. They are hoping to enter this year.
  - ryanlol 5y ago
    This really doesn’t add up. Who was performing these hard passport checks? An airline employee? Where was your flight originating from/going to?
    - DyslexicAtheist 5y ago
      it was done by a customs official. long queue and everyone on the plane had to do it every time that I was there. I've never entered the UK without having to go through this. Dublin -> Heathrow Frankfurt -> Heathrow Stockholm -> Heathrow ... and as I said I have seen similar things arriving in Frankfurt (in 2017 and 2018) and other places (Dublin -> Zagreb etc)
      - ryanlol 5y ago
- Scoundreller 5y ago
  Tell that to France. They still do passport checks on flights coming in from Schengen countries. Especially stupid since I’ll be flying into southern France from neighbouring Brussels or Frankfurt. Like, if I’m up to no good, I could drive into France more quickly. They’re allowed to do it “temporarily”, so they just renew their exemption year after year.
vkou 5y ago
If you think some dweeb checking your ID is a serious impediment to freedom of movement, I invite you to do a few dozen border crossings outside the EU. The ID requirement to fly is not great, but it is nothing like actual border controls.
- DyslexicAtheist 5y ago
  that is only true if you compare EU to Overtheristan but not to how free movement was sold to EU voters. My comparison is based on what people voted for which was much closer to the concept of a US citizen taking a domestic flight.
  - philwelch 5y ago
    US citizens taking domestic flights have to show ID.
    - DyslexicAtheist 5y ago
      I did not know that. Some websites claim US nationals do not need a passport to travel domestically https://www.skyscanner.com/tips-and-inspiration/editorial/passports-required-for-domestic-flights https://www.skyscanner.com/tips-and-inspiration/editorial/pa... and while in 2021 europa.eu website says EU nationals do not need a passport to travel within Schengen this has already been not true before covid. Arrive at FRA or MUC or CDG and you will end up having to show your passport either at a manned booth or a machine (but the concept is no different: there is a queue and your name/geolocation entering the system ... actually even worse with the machine when they capture your biometrics)
      - Kbelicius 5y ago
        I think you are mixing id with passport. I doubt that you need a passport to fly internally in US. I know that as a EU citizen you absolutely do not need a passport to fly within the EU but you do need some form of id.
tinus_hn 5y ago
Someone is checking your passport so they know it’s the person who is on the ticket. It’s not a conspiracy to collect ids because the government already has all the information on the ID and you had to identify yourself to buy the ticket. The difference due to the Schengen Agreement is that on landing you can just pick up your luggage and go, there is no border patrol checking your belongings.
ryanlol 5y ago
> Also the worst of all countries has doubtlessly been the UK UK is pay to play, for a reasonable amount (600GBP at LGW and ~1k at LHR IIRC) of money you can be the first to exit your plane and be taken through the private jet terminal without any queues. You wait in a nice lounge where a Border Force person takes you through the formalities while you sit in a comfy armchair.
chokeartist 5y ago
> I feel obliged to thank them out of artificial politeness but really want to just ask them why they had to get a job that allows them to display power. Maybe it was the only job they could find at the time. Not everyone in the world is insufferably cynical like the HN crowd.
Tsiklon 5y ago
If you take an international railway journey in the EU it’s very civilised indeed, just rock up to the station, scan your ticket through to the platform and away you go. I’ve experienced this taking the Thalys to Brussels from Amsterdam, to catch an onward connection to London.

jamesrr39 5y ago

Also in Europe, but with a completely different experience; it is (well, was, pre-covid) easy to move between EU states. Within the Schengen Zone it's only the check at the gate to check your ID matches your boarding pass (so no check at "immigration"), and to/from the UK the electronic gates have really sped things up (compared to the old days). YMMV but I find I'm rarely waiting more than a few minutes at the immigration checks (to/from UK) nowadays.

DyslexicAtheist 5y ago
interesting. this seems to indicate that Schengen countries decided on a national level if they wanted to do checks on their borders. I have seen hard passport checks within Schengen in Croatia, Sweden, Germany, France and Portugal. Good to hear the UK has improved. I should have mentioned I haven't been there since 2018. I was expecting that brexit made things worse and had no idea
- iso1631 5y ago
  Brexit didn't really kick in until January this year, and covid impact masks any brexit impact
- StavrosK 5y ago
  Greece doesn't check ID at the airport either, beyond matching your boarding pass to your name.
- Kbelicius 5y ago
  Croatia is not part of Schengen so there shouldn't be any surprise about them doing the hard checks. They are hoping to enter this year.
- ryanlol 5y ago
  This really doesn’t add up. Who was performing these hard passport checks? An airline employee? Where was your flight originating from/going to?
  - DyslexicAtheist 5y ago
    it was done by a customs official. long queue and everyone on the plane had to do it every time that I was there. I've never entered the UK without having to go through this. Dublin -> Heathrow Frankfurt -> Heathrow Stockholm -> Heathrow ... and as I said I have seen similar things arriving in Frankfurt (in 2017 and 2018) and other places (Dublin -> Zagreb etc)
    - ryanlol 5y ago
Scoundreller 5y ago
Tell that to France. They still do passport checks on flights coming in from Schengen countries. Especially stupid since I’ll be flying into southern France from neighbouring Brussels or Frankfurt. Like, if I’m up to no good, I could drive into France more quickly. They’re allowed to do it “temporarily”, so they just renew their exemption year after year.

vkou 5y ago

If you think some dweeb checking your ID is a serious impediment to freedom of movement, I invite you to do a few dozen border crossings outside the EU. The ID requirement to fly is not great, but it is nothing like actual border controls.

DyslexicAtheist 5y ago
that is only true if you compare EU to Overtheristan but not to how free movement was sold to EU voters. My comparison is based on what people voted for which was much closer to the concept of a US citizen taking a domestic flight.
- philwelch 5y ago
  US citizens taking domestic flights have to show ID.
  - DyslexicAtheist 5y ago
    I did not know that. Some websites claim US nationals do not need a passport to travel domestically https://www.skyscanner.com/tips-and-inspiration/editorial/passports-required-for-domestic-flights https://www.skyscanner.com/tips-and-inspiration/editorial/pa... and while in 2021 europa.eu website says EU nationals do not need a passport to travel within Schengen this has already been not true before covid. Arrive at FRA or MUC or CDG and you will end up having to show your passport either at a manned booth or a machine (but the concept is no different: there is a queue and your name/geolocation entering the system ... actually even worse with the machine when they capture your biometrics)
    - Kbelicius 5y ago
      I think you are mixing id with passport. I doubt that you need a passport to fly internally in US. I know that as a EU citizen you absolutely do not need a passport to fly within the EU but you do need some form of id.

tinus_hn 5y ago

Someone is checking your passport so they know it’s the person who is on the ticket. It’s not a conspiracy to collect ids because the government already has all the information on the ID and you had to identify yourself to buy the ticket. The difference due to the Schengen Agreement is that on landing you can just pick up your luggage and go, there is no border patrol checking your belongings.

ryanlol 5y ago

> Also the worst of all countries has doubtlessly been the UK UK is pay to play, for a reasonable amount (600GBP at LGW and ~1k at LHR IIRC) of money you can be the first to exit your plane and be taken through the private jet terminal without any queues. You wait in a nice lounge where a Border Force person takes you through the formalities while you sit in a comfy armchair.

chokeartist 5y ago

> I feel obliged to thank them out of artificial politeness but really want to just ask them why they had to get a job that allows them to display power. Maybe it was the only job they could find at the time. Not everyone in the world is insufferably cynical like the HN crowd.

Tsiklon 5y ago

If you take an international railway journey in the EU it’s very civilised indeed, just rock up to the station, scan your ticket through to the platform and away you go. I’ve experienced this taking the Thalys to Brussels from Amsterdam, to catch an onward connection to London.