9 ms·

I'm honestly pretty torn at this point which vaccine I should be going for. It seems like every week there is another article insinuating that there is some poo

I'm honestly pretty torn at this point which vaccine I should be going for. It seems like every week there is another article insinuating that there is some poorly understood, potentially high impact, facet of a given vaccine. Anyone else "holding out?"

Daishiman 5y ago
Not being an expert in the subject, but a lot of the COVID vaccines are based on established and well-tested mechanisms that AFAIK, are fairly predictable.
PlotCitizen 5y ago
I'm also holding out
mythrwy 5y ago
I'm waiting.
alimw 5y ago
Unless you are a researcher in the field, there are certainly more important things for you to be worrying about. Just get a vaccine, any vaccine.
- incrudible 5y ago
  I fail to see any logical reasoning here. This research suggests an unspecific alteration to your immune system. It affects everyone who gets vaccinated, not just researchers. If you are young and healthy, there is a high chance that getting infected with COVID is harmless. Your body will deal with it in the natural way. Furthermore, the risk of getting infected at all is not 100%. I could make the same argument here: There are more important things to be worrying about than COVID.
  - theshadowknows 5y ago
    Sure. But you won’t always be young and you may not always be healthy.
  - op00to 5y ago
    If you get COVID, statistically you’ll pass it on to a few people. Let’s hope you live amongst less selfish people so your own selfish behavior doesn’t affect other.
    - mattr47 5y ago
      Source please? Just by saying "statistically" does not make it true.
      - NullPrefix 5y ago
        Trust the science
        bingbong70 5y ago
        Medical science has feedback latency. Be careful about trusting brand new scientific claims that haven't gone through rigorous testing.
      - invincing 5y ago
        R0 > 1 rings any bells?
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - incrudible 5y ago
      Statistically, I'm most likely to pass it on to 0 people, because the pareto principle applies: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7674790/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7674790/ Furthermore, the people I could pass it on to are either taking the same risk as me (which is fair), or they want to but couldn't get the vaccine yet, in which case they should be vaccinated first, not me.
  - alimw 5y ago
    > affects everyone who gets vaccinated, not just researchers. If you understood my comment to stand in opposition to that obvious statement, then I'm not surprised its logic escaped you. Or are you just indulging in pointless rhetoric? For most of us there are indeed more important things to worry about than Covid. So just do what society asks of you, for good reason, and move on.
    - incrudible 5y ago
      > If you understood my comment to stand in opposition to that obvious statement, then I'm not surprised its logic escaped you. Let me rephrase it: Surely you couldn't mean that there is connection between being a researcher and the risk of vaccination. Therefore, what is the logical connection between the premise and the conclusion? > So just do what society asks of you, for good reason, and move on. I have a response to this, but it would be inappropriate to post it here.
kybernetyk 5y ago
For me I'm waiting $N years till I consider getting a covid shot. According to the oxford calculator[0] my risk of hospitalization is microscopic so I take that chance over trying out new under-tested vaxines. [0] https://qcovid.org/ https://qcovid.org/
- kennywinker 5y ago
  I for one value keeping my sense of smell and taste higher than the risks i’m seeing from vaccines - eliminating the risk of hospitalization is just a bonus
  - squarefoot 5y ago
    I don't agree on waiting years for a vaccine, however the loss/alteration of sense of smell and taste is temporary. It can last more than the other symptoms, but usually after a few weeks it gets back to normal again. I got symptomatic Covid last October and the spike protein test taken at the end of March reports I still have several hundreds u/ml of anti-rbd antibodies, so I'll be reasonably safe for some time, but wouldn't recommend waiting to not immunized people. I had people dying next to my bed, and that is something I can't unsee for the rest of my life.
    - op00to 5y ago
      I think TV programming should be occasionally replaced with deidentified Covid ward footage.
      - rangoon626 5y ago
        You wanna force this on everyone? Cool. Then I get to enforce outlawing fast food consumption… especially things like Krispy Kreme donuts.
        squarefoot 5y ago
        Forcing maybe not, but as educational tool, not unlike trips to WWII concentration camps for schools, I would offer a free visit to Covid wards to denialists and similar idiots. Once they see someone taken into a bed with a simple oxygen mask, then given a respirator helmet, then intubated, then pronounced dead in a few days, they probably change their perspective.
kennywinker 5y ago
As far as I can tell the difference between the pfizer and moderna vaccines are negligible. The results of differences in their testing procedure and conditions - the stuff you’re getting is basically the same. So, unless you’re (in my opinion) wrongly calculating the risk from a vaccine as larger than the risk from the disease, the best shot is the one you can get soonest.
- count67 5y ago
  Given a choice, I would choose Pzifer over Moderna, since it has fewer side effects [1], but otherwise they're both good and protect approximately equally against known variants. I wouldn't choose J&J or AZ if my age is below 60yo because of a very low risk of deadly side effects (clots). Edit: unless my BMI > 30, in which case any vaccine is better than no vaccine, because of the increased risks of covid-19 on high BMI. [1] https://www.europeanreview.org/article/24877 https://www.europeanreview.org/article/24877
StavrosK 5y ago
On the contrary, I was excited to finally get it yesterday, even though I already had immunity.
hef19898 5y ago
Johnson and Johnson. Because you only need one shot and you are good to go. Immediately followed by whatever vaccine is available at the moment. Which leaves, at least for the next couple of weeks, with option three: none of the above. So definitely not holding out.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
Traubenfuchs 5y ago
I am a fit man, under 30 and my Vitamin D, C and Zinc levels are high. I have zero interest in getting any covid vaccine unless forced to.
- invincing 5y ago
  Your strategy is not optimal. If you want to be efficiently freeloading, you should not be announcing your position. Freeloading with vaccination only works if just a small enough minority of people are doing it. In order to minimize your personal risk from both covid and potential side effects of vaccination, you should be advocating for others to get vaccinated but not get the shot yourself. If you publicly announce that you are not going to get the vaccination, that may encourage others to avoid it as well. That's against your own interests, because then it's more likely that you get covid when the vaccination coverage in the population is lower.
  - Traubenfuchs 5y ago
    I already thought about this and I fully agree! But I feel rather anonymous on this global message board. I tell all my friends who asked for my opinion to just do what they please and lied to them that yes, I am registered for my shot. Which I am not and won't be, unless my employment or personal comfort are threatened too much. I am also happy my elderly parents took the vaccine. A covid infection is probably more dangerous to them than the vaccine and now I can visit them without testing with a clear conscience.
doggodaddo78 5y ago
I went with Moderna. Just get it. Analysis paralysis is the enemy of the good.
AnimalMuppet 5y ago
I... kind of was? I wasn't in a rush, anyway. Figured I'm healthy enough that I'd let those who are more at risk than me get their shots. And then I went in to the pharmacy to pick up a prescription, and they said, hey, we've got this extra dose, do you want it? So I took it, just because I was there and it was easy.

Daishiman 5y ago

Not being an expert in the subject, but a lot of the COVID vaccines are based on established and well-tested mechanisms that AFAIK, are fairly predictable.

PlotCitizen 5y ago

I'm also holding out

mythrwy 5y ago

I'm waiting.

alimw 5y ago

Unless you are a researcher in the field, there are certainly more important things for you to be worrying about. Just get a vaccine, any vaccine.

incrudible 5y ago
I fail to see any logical reasoning here. This research suggests an unspecific alteration to your immune system. It affects everyone who gets vaccinated, not just researchers. If you are young and healthy, there is a high chance that getting infected with COVID is harmless. Your body will deal with it in the natural way. Furthermore, the risk of getting infected at all is not 100%. I could make the same argument here: There are more important things to be worrying about than COVID.
- theshadowknows 5y ago
  Sure. But you won’t always be young and you may not always be healthy.
- op00to 5y ago
  If you get COVID, statistically you’ll pass it on to a few people. Let’s hope you live amongst less selfish people so your own selfish behavior doesn’t affect other.
  - mattr47 5y ago
    Source please? Just by saying "statistically" does not make it true.
    - NullPrefix 5y ago
      Trust the science
      - bingbong70 5y ago
        Medical science has feedback latency. Be careful about trusting brand new scientific claims that haven't gone through rigorous testing.
    - invincing 5y ago
      R0 > 1 rings any bells?
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - incrudible 5y ago
    Statistically, I'm most likely to pass it on to 0 people, because the pareto principle applies: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7674790/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7674790/ Furthermore, the people I could pass it on to are either taking the same risk as me (which is fair), or they want to but couldn't get the vaccine yet, in which case they should be vaccinated first, not me.
- alimw 5y ago
  > affects everyone who gets vaccinated, not just researchers. If you understood my comment to stand in opposition to that obvious statement, then I'm not surprised its logic escaped you. Or are you just indulging in pointless rhetoric? For most of us there are indeed more important things to worry about than Covid. So just do what society asks of you, for good reason, and move on.
  - incrudible 5y ago
    > If you understood my comment to stand in opposition to that obvious statement, then I'm not surprised its logic escaped you. Let me rephrase it: Surely you couldn't mean that there is connection between being a researcher and the risk of vaccination. Therefore, what is the logical connection between the premise and the conclusion? > So just do what society asks of you, for good reason, and move on. I have a response to this, but it would be inappropriate to post it here.

kybernetyk 5y ago

For me I'm waiting $N years till I consider getting a covid shot. According to the oxford calculator[0] my risk of hospitalization is microscopic so I take that chance over trying out new under-tested vaxines. [0] https://qcovid.org/ https://qcovid.org/

kennywinker 5y ago
I for one value keeping my sense of smell and taste higher than the risks i’m seeing from vaccines - eliminating the risk of hospitalization is just a bonus
- squarefoot 5y ago
  I don't agree on waiting years for a vaccine, however the loss/alteration of sense of smell and taste is temporary. It can last more than the other symptoms, but usually after a few weeks it gets back to normal again. I got symptomatic Covid last October and the spike protein test taken at the end of March reports I still have several hundreds u/ml of anti-rbd antibodies, so I'll be reasonably safe for some time, but wouldn't recommend waiting to not immunized people. I had people dying next to my bed, and that is something I can't unsee for the rest of my life.
  - op00to 5y ago
    I think TV programming should be occasionally replaced with deidentified Covid ward footage.
    - rangoon626 5y ago
      You wanna force this on everyone? Cool. Then I get to enforce outlawing fast food consumption… especially things like Krispy Kreme donuts.
      - squarefoot 5y ago
        Forcing maybe not, but as educational tool, not unlike trips to WWII concentration camps for schools, I would offer a free visit to Covid wards to denialists and similar idiots. Once they see someone taken into a bed with a simple oxygen mask, then given a respirator helmet, then intubated, then pronounced dead in a few days, they probably change their perspective.

kennywinker 5y ago

As far as I can tell the difference between the pfizer and moderna vaccines are negligible. The results of differences in their testing procedure and conditions - the stuff you’re getting is basically the same. So, unless you’re (in my opinion) wrongly calculating the risk from a vaccine as larger than the risk from the disease, the best shot is the one you can get soonest.

count67 5y ago
Given a choice, I would choose Pzifer over Moderna, since it has fewer side effects [1], but otherwise they're both good and protect approximately equally against known variants. I wouldn't choose J&J or AZ if my age is below 60yo because of a very low risk of deadly side effects (clots). Edit: unless my BMI > 30, in which case any vaccine is better than no vaccine, because of the increased risks of covid-19 on high BMI. [1] https://www.europeanreview.org/article/24877 https://www.europeanreview.org/article/24877

StavrosK 5y ago

On the contrary, I was excited to finally get it yesterday, even though I already had immunity.

hef19898 5y ago

Johnson and Johnson. Because you only need one shot and you are good to go. Immediately followed by whatever vaccine is available at the moment. Which leaves, at least for the next couple of weeks, with option three: none of the above. So definitely not holding out.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

Traubenfuchs 5y ago

I am a fit man, under 30 and my Vitamin D, C and Zinc levels are high. I have zero interest in getting any covid vaccine unless forced to.

invincing 5y ago
Your strategy is not optimal. If you want to be efficiently freeloading, you should not be announcing your position. Freeloading with vaccination only works if just a small enough minority of people are doing it. In order to minimize your personal risk from both covid and potential side effects of vaccination, you should be advocating for others to get vaccinated but not get the shot yourself. If you publicly announce that you are not going to get the vaccination, that may encourage others to avoid it as well. That's against your own interests, because then it's more likely that you get covid when the vaccination coverage in the population is lower.
- Traubenfuchs 5y ago
  I already thought about this and I fully agree! But I feel rather anonymous on this global message board. I tell all my friends who asked for my opinion to just do what they please and lied to them that yes, I am registered for my shot. Which I am not and won't be, unless my employment or personal comfort are threatened too much. I am also happy my elderly parents took the vaccine. A covid infection is probably more dangerous to them than the vaccine and now I can visit them without testing with a clear conscience.

doggodaddo78 5y ago

I went with Moderna. Just get it. Analysis paralysis is the enemy of the good.

AnimalMuppet 5y ago

I... kind of was? I wasn't in a rush, anyway. Figured I'm healthy enough that I'd let those who are more at risk than me get their shots. And then I went in to the pharmacy to pick up a prescription, and they said, hey, we've got this extra dose, do you want it? So I took it, just because I was there and it was easy.