9 ms·

EU citizens arriving in UK being locked up and expelled

69 points by BerislavLopac 5y ago

pjc50 5y ago
The brutal policy that was applied to non-Europeans is now also applying to Europeans. This is government policy and it is popular - locking up and expelling Europeans looking for work was one of the huge policy demands of Brexit that people voted for. This nastiness is what the public demands. Well, not all the public. Immigration enforcement got a rather different reception in Glasgow: https://twitter.com/david_millar/status/1392969258989150208 https://twitter.com/david_millar/status/1392969258989150208
- stereo 5y ago
  It will be a lot less popular once British people arriving in the EU receive the same treatment and get told that this is what they voted for.
  - throwaway8689 5y ago
    British people wanting to live and work in Europe will have to apply under Europe's rules. Seems fair. British people who have been evading existing rules and now have no basis to stay in Europe are being told to leave. Also fair.
    - akudha 5y ago
      Are they politely asked to leave? Or are they thrown into detention centers and humiliated, despite willing to pay for the ticket to leave?
      - gambiting 5y ago
        The first one. The second Spanish police throws a British immigrant into a detention centre for staying illegally you will see every tabloid in the UK crying about it. But yes, British visitors to the EU who cannot enter for whatever reason are just sent back on the same flight or wait at the airport for the next one.
  - oldnews193 5y ago
    Even if that happens, the people with whom anti-immigration policies are popular and job solicitors in the EU are likely two non-overlapping groups.
    - pjc50 5y ago
      There was a genre of Daily Mail comment where Brits who'd immigrated to Spain complained about the number of immigrants in the UK.
  - one2three4 5y ago
    Why don't they already? Seems 100% unfair. It's almost impossible for non EU citizens to enter Europe and look for a job if they come from Africa for instance. Why should it be easier for UK citizens?
    - Symbiote 5y ago
      Because we/they decided it, probably based on the relative economies of different countries, chance of illegal overstaying etc. I think EU and UK people can visit the USA for a job interview under the visa waiver programme. A Nigerian can't. It's the same difference.
      - BerislavLopac 5y ago
        Not all EU people. Some still need visas for the US.
- nob0dyasked 5y ago
  Exactly, citizens demand a government that enforces laws. Unlike the EU, where about 30% of illegal immigrants are expelled, while no one no one is interested in changing that legal status.
  - knorker 5y ago
    Did you actually read the article? People are offering to buy their own ticket, but no they're sent to detention for no reason, at taxpayer expense. People are offering to stay private, but no they're sent to detention at taxpayer expense. A Czech woman is being sent to Mexico instead of allowing her to pay herself to fly home to Prague. All this spending of UK taxpayer funds for what? Out of spite?
    - OJFord 5y ago
      > A Czech woman is being sent to Mexico instead of allowing her to pay herself to fly home to Prague. It's annoying and slightly weird, but isn't that just how it works? You go 'back where you came from', not wherever you want or claim to live? Say the woman in your example was refused by Czech customs, and sent back to the UK, then what? Dig through records (would they have them?) to find she came to the UK from Mexico, and then send her there? Correct me if I'm wrong, I just don't think that would be different in any other country. (That particular aspect I mean, assuming they've decided you're not allowed in, and will be deported to somewhere.)
      - joshuaissac 5y ago
        > Say the woman in your example was refused by Czech customs, and sent back to the UK, then what? Considering she is Czech, she is far more likely to be rejected by Mexican customs rather than Czech customs.
      - knorker 5y ago
        Sure, there's always the tyrrany of the need to follow rules even when they make no sense, and if it were this in isolation then it would not raise eyebrows.
- viseztrance 5y ago
  Bare in mind that eu citizens still don't need a visa to travel to the uk.
  - knorker 5y ago
    "Bear in mind". "Bare in mind" sounds like you're thinking about the people naked. :-)
  - pjc50 5y ago
    Depends on the purpose. https://www.gov.uk/guidance/visiting-the-uk-as-an-eu-eea-or-swiss-citizen https://www.gov.uk/guidance/visiting-the-uk-as-an-eu-eea-or-...
    - viseztrance 5y ago
      I know that, and it's of course a good point. I was trying to convey the fact that citizens from eu countries are not at the level of other third countries yet. For example you can still travel using just a national id card until October. I wholeheartedly agree with the rest of your comment though.
- TheManInThePub 5y ago
  > This is government policy and it is popular Be very careful with such a statement. Regardless of where you sit on the issue, the Brexit referendum was roughly 50:50. The UK is fiercely split [1] and such issues are not going to be resolved anytime soon. It is incorrect to state such a policy is popular..... roughly half the population voted against it. [1] And dare I say it... looks in danger of splitting up.
  - tebbers 5y ago
    OK then, it's fair to state that the policy is not unpopular. It commands a good deal of support from the electorate.
    - TheOtherHobbes 5y ago
      Populations usually split one third reactionary, one third progressive, and one third will-vote-how-they're told. If the policy is "popular" - which it isn't, except among the reactionaries - it's in no small measure because the UK media have normalised this kind of abuse. This kind of thing is almost a predictable syndrome associated with post-colonialism. Other countries have been through it, now it's the UK's turn. When countries lose their empires/influence, racism and fascism provide a compensation that can temporarily restore childish fantasies of omnipotence. It's associated with a death wish, so things generally get worse - sometimes much worse - before they get better.
  - throwaway8689 5y ago
    The referendum vote is not the best point of reference. The Conservatives won comfortably in 2019, and recently won a by election, again comfortably, all on a platform of implementing brexit.
    - usr1106 5y ago
      Won comfortably in the UK does not mean too much in the UK. Easily 30-40% of the votes get just disregarded in the UK system. (I did not check the actual figures for the recent elections.)
- bogle 5y ago
  The dawn raid in Glasgow looks a lot like a deliberate provocation from the Westminster government and the Home Office. It was in the First Minister's constituency; it was as the new MSPs (Members of the Scottish Parliament) were being sworn in; it's in the constituency that the leader of Scottish Labour, Anas Sarwar, contested in the May election; and it was the first day of Eid Al-Fitr. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-57100259 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-57100259
  - nob0dyasked 5y ago
    You don't sound paranoid at all.
- Glawen 5y ago
  Europeans and the EU are the ideal scapegoat in the UK. I always felt that Europeans were blamed for immigration policies as it is politically correct to shame them. Shaming non european immigration is a social minefield, very few people would dare to say it aloud as they would categorised as racists.
  - Veen 5y ago
    You will find that non-European immigrants, especially from Commonwealth and ex-Commonwealth countries, also have a negative opinion of the previous preferential EU immigration rules. I have met many South African and Nigerian immigrants who found the disparity between their right to immigrate and that of EU citizens deeply unfair, and many who were eligible to vote in the Brexit referrendum chose to leave the EU for precicely that reason. They can hardly be accused of racism. Besides which, the conflation of a desire for immigration control with racism is a lazy canard.
    - kristjankalm 5y ago
      i find such logic hard to understand: UK was part of the EU, hence the open labour market. That's the whole point of EU. What did they find unfair exactly -- that Nigeria was not part of the EU? Or that countries can agree to have an open labour market?
      - Veen 5y ago
        Long before the UK joined the EU it was a member of the Commonwealth of Nations and had close relationships to countries that once were part of the Empire. Before the EU, most UK immigration came from Commonwealth countries. Freedom of movement allowed easy immigration from Europe and greater restrictions on Commonwealth immigration. People from those countries believe that the UK has prior obligations to members of the Commonwealth, and that it should prioritize those obligations (and often that privileging EU immigration is racist.) You can see the post-Brexit shift to previous obligations with the easing of immigration rules for Hong Kong citizens.
- throwaway8689 5y ago
  Brutal and nasty are emotive terms. If someone has no lawful basis to be in a country, what is wrong with expecting them to leave?
  - bogle 5y ago
    In the press articles the Home Office is quoted as saying, "suspected offences". A dawn raid is completely abhorrent for anything other than serious crimes. Note that Immigration Enforcement isn't even the police, this is a Home Office unit.
    - throwaway8689 5y ago
      A dawn raid is designed to catch someone who is expected to try to evade arrest. Would you prefer a chase through the streets? Immigration Enforcement have power of arrest for this circumstance. The Information Commissioner has uniformed officers with limited police-type powers for their area of work too.
      - TheOtherHobbes 5y ago
        "Power of arrest" for which circumstance, exactly? Someone visiting perfectly legally for an interview which may lead to a job offer? And I'd prefer no speculative high-drama arrests of people who are following the rules and not breaking the law.
        mytailorisrich 5y ago
        Visiting for an interview means having a letter of invitation for an interview from a company, not this (from article): > María, 25, from Valencia, said that like many of those detained, she thought she was free to explore the job market at least until October This sounds like coming to the UK for work without a visa, in which case it is correct in law to be detained. I think the practice of detention for up to 7 days before being deported is a way to inflict a punishment to deter people trying. Indeed, if the only thing you risk if caught is being turned away at the airport then people would just try and try, why not? There are articles from sources a bit more balanced than The Guardian: https://www.politico.eu/article/eu-citizens-detained-uk-work-visas-brexit/ https://www.politico.eu/article/eu-citizens-detained-uk-work...
- exporectomy 5y ago
  People who want unrestricted immigration for "looking for work" are completely clueless. They only think they want it because they don't know how many people will come if it's open borders with the 3rd world and what the economic and social consequences of that will be. Those unemployed people can't be allowed to starve so they must be supported by social welfare. It's easy to feel sorry for a handful of rejected migrants but only by ignoring the millions who never even tried to enter, knowing they couldn't.
  - viraptor 5y ago
    > People who want unrestricted immigration for "looking for work" sounds like a weird strawman. Do you know of any larger group seriously fighting for that at the moment? (People coming for a scheduled interview are not "unrestricted immigration for looking for work")
    - fakedang 5y ago
      The article mentions a person coming "looking for work" being detained. The article also mentions a French woman who was detained for attending an interview for an internship, so I think there's that too. Imo, it's obviously very unclear as to why they're being detained, but in the case of Eugenia (Spanish woman arriving to "look for work"), it was clearly illegal per the new law.
  - Stevvo 5y ago
    Very very few people want unrestricted immigration, however ~50% of people want unrestricted immigration from the EU on a reciprocal basis. We had that for years, with the economic and social consequences being largely positive. That said, I don't take it as a given that unrestricted immigration would cause problems; it has never been tried, there is no data to go on.
    - thu2111 5y ago
      Support for unlimited EU immigration is not 50%, it's much lower. You're thinking of people who voted to Remain, but a significant fraction of those people were motivated by the fear of "punishment" either from Cameron/Osborne's huge tax rises or the supposed EU allies, not actual firm support of EU policies. A breakdown is available here: https://dominiccummings.files.wordpress.com/2016/11/screenshot-2016-11-27-13-58-441.png?w=498&h=458 https://dominiccummings.files.wordpress.com/2016/11/screensh...
- ur-whale 5y ago
  > This nastiness is what the public demands. So you're saying democracy is bad?
- callamdelaney 5y ago
  Brutal? It's not brutal - it's positively tame. Take a look at the Australian system under Abott if you want 'brutal'. This is simply a Sovereign State softly removing those with zero right to remain.
  - bogle 5y ago
    The Home Office said, "suspected offences". Funny that the "Sovreign State" tried this in Scotland, isn't it?
    - callamdelaney 5y ago
      What's the fact that it was in Scotland got to do with it? It's baseless to believe that the home office would target something in Sturgeons constituency on some particular day, especially when there's no political advantage to be drawn by said act. Immigration law applies to Scotland too; until there's a nice border there (but that's another topic).
      - bogle 5y ago
        I see your jingoistic sensibilities are clouding your thinking. Your political nous is also somewhat lacking, perhaps, if you can't see the power play here.
        callamdelaney 5y ago
        So instead of making your point, my thinking is too clouded to come to the same unexplained conclusion as you?
        DyslexicAtheist 5y ago
        this is a bad-faith argument: > It's baseless to believe that the home office would target something in Sturgeons constituency on some particular day, especially when there's no political advantage to be drawn by said act. Judging by #10's behavior as a predictor for future behavior there is every reason to believe it was very much on purpose (and far from "baseless"). And even it wasn't on purpose it would now be on them to apologize and try to straighten things out - which ofc they don't.
j-pb 5y ago
The UK is the Dunning-Kruger-Effekt applied to a whole country.
- TheOtherHobbes 5y ago
  The UK as a whole isn't. The UK is a very interesting country trying to get out of its cocoon at the moment. This is going to be more of a struggle than most people expect, but the results could be surprising. The UK's government and media certainly are.
  - j-pb 5y ago
    Of course this doesn't apply to individuals. It's an effect of the cultural feeling of supremacy originating from it's former colonial might, combined with a fairytale like ethos originating from the monarchy. In a sense it is only natural to become a bit megalomanic if you're called "the united kingdom", a name so full of grandeur and dreamlike romance that even tolkien would be a bit envious. Combine that with 40 years of anti E.U. media and you get a situation where people vote against their own self interest because they think they are better off alone. I for one can't wait for our scrottish brethren and sisters to rejoin us. They may take your passport but they will never take our article 49.
- dang 5y ago
  Nationalistic flamewar is not welcome here. Please don't post like this, regardless of which country you have an issue with. It only leads threads into hell. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&query=by%3Adang%20nationalistic%20flame&sort=byDate&type=comment https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...
  - j-pb 5y ago
    With all due respect, I think you're blowing that comment on the skewed power dynamic of the U.K. with the E.U., public miss-information campaigns, and inappropriate policies of political leadership, vastly out of proportion. This has nothing to do with nationalism, but with a sombre sadness about the unnecessary damage caused by brexit.
PartiallyTyped 5y ago
I am generally against vindictiveness, but I am looking forward to English officials getting a horrific treatment for how their government treated or treats people. Sorry for all the Scots that are caught in the middle, we hope you find a way through and away from the torries. Finally, to the English, your politicians and your law enforcement deserve nothing less than cruelty for how they act. No apologies.
- TheManInThePub 5y ago
  > I am looking forward to the English getting the same treatment What a truly vile statement, unworthy of HN. Roughly half the English population (including myself) voted to remain. We are not gloating, but working hard to ensure cooperation with the EU continues..... ..... and no doubt, preparing for the next referendum to return to the EU in 10 years time (after all, a second independence referendum is now on the cards for Scotland, the precedent has been set).
  - Veen 5y ago
    You can't expect anything better from Scottish nationalists. A very nasty bunch all round.
    - bogle 5y ago
      Pejorative comments about the Scottish do not cast you in a very good light.
      - Veen 5y ago
        First, it was a response to perjoritive comments about the English. Second, I made no perjoritive comments about the Scottish, just Scottish Nationalists. I know many excellent Scots.
    - PartiallyTyped 5y ago
      Not a Scottish, let alone a nationalist, I am just a person that thinks the English haven't suffered the consequences of their imperialism and need to get down of their high horse.
azalemeth 5y ago
I just can't understand why anti-immigration policies are so very popular. I'm absolutely certain that this is what a proportion of brexshit-voters want -- the cruel and degrading treatment of those who frankly better the country they come to work in. I just don't understand the reasons behind it and why governments, which privately acknowledge that immigration is good for the economy, remain so keen to be seen as tough on it in the eyes of the tabloid media.
- extropy 5y ago
  It's basic tribe psychology. At times of stress we seek out the enemy. And external imaginary enemy is always easier to accept than internal or god forbid a bad habit that we are all guilty of.
- Veen 5y ago
  Because what's good for the country's balance sheet and for businesses may not be good for certain segments of the population.
- knorker 5y ago
  Don't say "I can't understand". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=chALQCm9VgE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=chALQCm9VgE > the cruel and degrading treatment I don't think this part has as wide support as the part where people see entire towns lose their jobs, while from their point of view foreigners are being let in left and right. Those foreigners didn't literally take their jobs, but someone's gaining jobs and someone's losing jobs. It may be good for the economy, but you know that saying "taxation without representation"? Yeah, the government is supposed to represent the voters. And from these local's point of view they are not being represented. It's taxation without representation. And some people get upset about that. These people didn't get elected to represent the economy as a whole or even humanity as a whole, but to represent the voting population and their interests. Don't say "I can't understand".
  - Stevvo 5y ago
    "someone's gaining jobs and someone's losing jobs" More jobs = more jobs for everyone. If I immigrate to your country nobody looses a job; I get given a job that a native was unwilling or unable to take. My economic contribution to the society will also increase the total number of available jobs, meaning more jobs for everyone.
tompccs 5y ago
Why the hell is anyone travelling for a job interview in the middle of a pandemic? I thought we all knew how to use Zoom now? Can't work it out with the Guardian, last month they were calling for travel bans, now they are supporting frivolous travel.
- AfterShave 5y ago
  I don't see how they are supporting frivolous travel by reporting: "This is happening to travelers at the border."
  - tompccs 5y ago
    They are supporting it in that they consider this newsworthy.
    - viraptor 5y ago
      It's newsworthy when the LE or related organisations abuse the rules. It doesn't matter if the abused person does something you don't like.
  - knorker 5y ago
    I would encourage you to use more critical thinking when reading news in the future. Another newspaper would phrase the same events as "EU jobseekers try to sneak into the UK, are we doing enough?". The Guardian is not secret about its views. And that's fine. You as the reader have a responsibility.
- periheli0n 5y ago
  Yes, the article is a bit misleading. One is allowed to travel to the UK for a job interview if the interview has already been lined up before landing. It is illegal to enter on a tourist visa and look for work. Always has been.
tupac_speedrap 5y ago
I don't see the problem here. These people don't seem to have valid visas or right to work in the UK and therefore are breaking the law. The UK has a big issue with people coming on the wrong visa and then working in the informal economy illegally, they just need to sort their visas and everything is fine.
- mnd999 5y ago
  Read the article, in a lot of cases they are not doing anything illegal. But we deport them anyway.
- ur-whale 5y ago
  >I don't see the problem here. These people don't seem to have valid visas Yup, but the whole notion of sovereignty has become so remote an bizarre to folks living in Europe that this is shocking news to most.
- rvieira 5y ago
  > EU citizens arriving in UK being _locked up_ and expelled I think you missed the point. The problem is not only controlling entry depending on their migration status (fair enough), but the process itself, which is meant to humiliate and scare people (hostile environment). The conditions in these detention places are degrading and people have to stay there for several days even when they say they will voluntarily go back in the first flight. If you found some mistake with your paperwork when landing in another country I think you would appreciate being given the choice of going back immediately instead of being locked up for a few days.
Havoc 5y ago
Notably this is happening before the 30 June deadline when strict enforcement of EU settled scheme is supposed to kick in.
the_mitsuhiko 5y ago
I have been helping people with immigration questions the last few years online. It’s crazy how many British people currently ask how to immigrate and that their options are severely limited now. No American, Russian or Indian person would even ask if they can immigrate without a degree whereas for most Brits who asked they have absolutely no qualifications. I wonder if we will see some more public realizations that freedom of movement is something British citizens will miss.
- akvadrako 5y ago
  What are you implying, that people can't immigrate without a degree? Of course they can; I'm an American without a degree that came to work in the EU.
  - the_mitsuhiko 5y ago
    Every EU country is different. Immigration to Austria requires a degree or a profession on a shortlist.
thanatos519 5y ago
That the sign in the photo says "Welcome to the UK Border" and not "Welcome to the UK" sums it up for me.
- OJFord 5y ago
  Ha, I noticed that too. More than a whiff of a lawyer's touch! Reminds me of that Parks & Recreation scene where Andy's in the hospital having (for the second time) fallen in the pit, and Leslie visits chased by 'the city's lawyer' who has a long increasingly ridiculous list of interjections for things she 'can't say because it implies X'. i.e. 'you can't say Welcome to the UK, because it implies you have been allowed in to the UK'. Personally I think, fine, but maybe a subtler and nicer way to do it would be to position the sign on the other side of customs, visibly perhaps, and just have nothing or simply 'UK customs & border control' or whatever on the other.
periheli0n 5y ago
One is allowed to attend a job interview, but this needs to be arranged before landing in the UK. Better carry an invitation letter when the friendly border agent asks for it. What’s worrying though is the apparent bias towards detaining young women from southern/eastern Europe. Racial/national profiling?
- viraptor 5y ago
  Unless you have information to the contrary, some of the described people did arrive for scheduled interviews. I would assume that they either had a letter, or that a single call to the company would save everyone a lot of problems.
  - periheli0n 5y ago
    If the border agent sends someone for detention who has an invitation for a job interview (and notably, for a job that will qualify for a work visa) then they break UK law.
    - pjc50 5y ago
      And we all know what happens when the police break the law, right? Nearly always nothing.
      - periheli0n 5y ago
        Unfortunately the article doesn’t say anything about the qualifications of those detained. If these were “unskilled workers” looking to work in the UK then they have no right of entry. If they were “skilled workers” with a job interview lined up and confirmed in writing, then the border force violated the law and the ones detained can sue for compensation.
    - viraptor 5y ago
      Second paragraph: "Europeans with job interviews are among those being denied entry and locked up." For the interview visit, there's no restrictions based on the job qualifications as far as I can tell. (unless you can find something specific?) So yes, that's pretty much why this article exists - they should not have been detained.
tompccs 5y ago
I think the commenters here have forgotten that we are in the middle of a pandemic, that the government has implemented a strict travel ban which also applies to British citizens, and that this policy was vigorously supported by the Guardian just a few weeks ago. Visa-free travel between the EU and UK is allowed for up to 30 days (for holidays, etc). This is pandemic policy, nothing to do with immigration or Brexit, no need to air all your pro-immigration views here.
- periheli0n 5y ago
  Yes, it has always been illegal to travel to the UK on a tourist visa and then look for work. However, when the UK was an EU member this was perfectly legal for EU citizens to do. Now it is not. So it does have to do with Brexit.
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admissionsguy 5y ago
The UK government has been quite repressive against its own citizens lately, so I would not expect them to treat foreigners any better. I had been planning to move to the UK before last December's deadline for getting the pre-settled status, but the "snitch on your neighbour" campaign during lockdowns convinced me otherwise.
- DoomHotel 5y ago
  You should be very glad you did not move to the UK. The Home Office has a backlog of 320,000 unprocessed applications for residency status, according to a recent Guardian article. [1] These people will be in legal limbo with no right to remain in the UK after June 30th if the backlog is not cleared. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/may/10/eu-citizens-applying-for-settled-status-face-legal-limbo-due-to-backlog https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/may/10/eu-citizens...
DoomHotel 5y ago
This week's Brexit & Beyond [1] mentioned this and I forgot to follow up on the link, so thank you. Performative cruelty for the masses while the Government talks up the great and wonderful success that is Brexit is only to be expected, I guess. [1] https://chrisgreybrexitblog.blogspot.com/2021/05/parallel-universes.html https://chrisgreybrexitblog.blogspot.com/2021/05/parallel-un...
bb101 5y ago
With worldwide population growth curves flattening and population pyramids inverting, countries of tomorrow will be positively clamouring for immigrants. A good book to read on the topic is Empty Planet by Bricker & Ibbitson[1]. One of their observations is that the country best placed to weather the coming demographic storm is the US, as they have a ready supply of immigrants south of their border. Every other country will have to compete, and some such as China will be in dire straits due to past misguided policies. [1] https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/37585564-empty-planet https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/37585564-empty-planet
- nob0dyasked 5y ago
  Sorry, but no. The solution to inverting population pyramids is not immigration. It's having more children where they are lacking, while having less where there's an excess. After millions and millions of new europeans, the public finances issues haven't got a tad better.
  - periheli0n 5y ago
    Is this the fault of the "new europeans" which mostly came to the UK for a job, earn money and pay taxes, or the fault of those in charge of the public finances?
    - nob0dyasked 5y ago
      Not speaking about UK, but about Europe and the waves of "pension-paying" immigration. And yeah I won't bite the bait about supposed mismanagement in tory governments which I have no interest at all in debating in this website.
Tade0 5y ago
I appreciate that the people whose stories are shown are mostly western Europeans, so that any notion of brushing this off as "oh, it's just something that happens to new EU member citizens - or in other words - poor people" is dead on arrival.
elmo2you 5y ago
No matter what one may think/feel of this policy, if immigration detained these people and denied them contact with their embassy, than that is a very serious violation. Not that I'm really surprised though. This kind of lawless (and borderline fascist) "might makes right" behavior appears increasingly popular/prolific within the UK government. I'd suggest UK tourists spend their holidays within country borders from now on, for any of the involved countries (assuming there is indeed a pattern here, as suggested in the article) may decide to reciprocally harass or shake down UK tourist on their next visit to a warm beach. What comes around goes around.
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ralfn 5y ago
Well as a European from the Netherlands this means I won't even risk a city trip or holiday to the UK. Can you imagine being imprisoned rather than just being refused? Have they gone mental? This is war. Living in Amsterdam in tempted to report any british tourist now. Enough with the tolerance.
- periheli0n 5y ago
  Perfectly fine to travel to the UK as a tourist. Just don’t tell the border agent you’re coming to look for work without having an interview lined up for a job that would actually entitle you for a work visa.

69 points by BerislavLopac 5y ago

The brutal policy that was applied to non-Europeans is now also applying to Europeans. This is government policy and it is popular - locking up and expelling Europeans looking for work was one of the huge policy demands of Brexit that people voted for. This nastiness is what the public demands. Well, not all the public. Immigration enforcement got a rather different reception in Glasgow: https://twitter.com/david_millar/status/1392969258989150208 https://twitter.com/david_millar/status/1392969258989150208

stereo 5y ago
It will be a lot less popular once British people arriving in the EU receive the same treatment and get told that this is what they voted for.
- throwaway8689 5y ago
  British people wanting to live and work in Europe will have to apply under Europe's rules. Seems fair. British people who have been evading existing rules and now have no basis to stay in Europe are being told to leave. Also fair.
  - akudha 5y ago
    Are they politely asked to leave? Or are they thrown into detention centers and humiliated, despite willing to pay for the ticket to leave?
    - gambiting 5y ago
      The first one. The second Spanish police throws a British immigrant into a detention centre for staying illegally you will see every tabloid in the UK crying about it. But yes, British visitors to the EU who cannot enter for whatever reason are just sent back on the same flight or wait at the airport for the next one.
- oldnews193 5y ago
  Even if that happens, the people with whom anti-immigration policies are popular and job solicitors in the EU are likely two non-overlapping groups.
  - pjc50 5y ago
    There was a genre of Daily Mail comment where Brits who'd immigrated to Spain complained about the number of immigrants in the UK.
- one2three4 5y ago
  Why don't they already? Seems 100% unfair. It's almost impossible for non EU citizens to enter Europe and look for a job if they come from Africa for instance. Why should it be easier for UK citizens?
  - Symbiote 5y ago
    Because we/they decided it, probably based on the relative economies of different countries, chance of illegal overstaying etc. I think EU and UK people can visit the USA for a job interview under the visa waiver programme. A Nigerian can't. It's the same difference.
    - BerislavLopac 5y ago
      Not all EU people. Some still need visas for the US.
nob0dyasked 5y ago
Exactly, citizens demand a government that enforces laws. Unlike the EU, where about 30% of illegal immigrants are expelled, while no one no one is interested in changing that legal status.
- knorker 5y ago
  Did you actually read the article? People are offering to buy their own ticket, but no they're sent to detention for no reason, at taxpayer expense. People are offering to stay private, but no they're sent to detention at taxpayer expense. A Czech woman is being sent to Mexico instead of allowing her to pay herself to fly home to Prague. All this spending of UK taxpayer funds for what? Out of spite?
  - OJFord 5y ago
    > A Czech woman is being sent to Mexico instead of allowing her to pay herself to fly home to Prague. It's annoying and slightly weird, but isn't that just how it works? You go 'back where you came from', not wherever you want or claim to live? Say the woman in your example was refused by Czech customs, and sent back to the UK, then what? Dig through records (would they have them?) to find she came to the UK from Mexico, and then send her there? Correct me if I'm wrong, I just don't think that would be different in any other country. (That particular aspect I mean, assuming they've decided you're not allowed in, and will be deported to somewhere.)
    - joshuaissac 5y ago
      > Say the woman in your example was refused by Czech customs, and sent back to the UK, then what? Considering she is Czech, she is far more likely to be rejected by Mexican customs rather than Czech customs.
    - knorker 5y ago
      Sure, there's always the tyrrany of the need to follow rules even when they make no sense, and if it were this in isolation then it would not raise eyebrows.
viseztrance 5y ago
Bare in mind that eu citizens still don't need a visa to travel to the uk.
- knorker 5y ago
  "Bear in mind". "Bare in mind" sounds like you're thinking about the people naked. :-)
- pjc50 5y ago
  Depends on the purpose. https://www.gov.uk/guidance/visiting-the-uk-as-an-eu-eea-or-swiss-citizen https://www.gov.uk/guidance/visiting-the-uk-as-an-eu-eea-or-...
  - viseztrance 5y ago
    I know that, and it's of course a good point. I was trying to convey the fact that citizens from eu countries are not at the level of other third countries yet. For example you can still travel using just a national id card until October. I wholeheartedly agree with the rest of your comment though.
TheManInThePub 5y ago
> This is government policy and it is popular Be very careful with such a statement. Regardless of where you sit on the issue, the Brexit referendum was roughly 50:50. The UK is fiercely split [1] and such issues are not going to be resolved anytime soon. It is incorrect to state such a policy is popular..... roughly half the population voted against it. [1] And dare I say it... looks in danger of splitting up.
- tebbers 5y ago
  OK then, it's fair to state that the policy is not unpopular. It commands a good deal of support from the electorate.
  - TheOtherHobbes 5y ago
    Populations usually split one third reactionary, one third progressive, and one third will-vote-how-they're told. If the policy is "popular" - which it isn't, except among the reactionaries - it's in no small measure because the UK media have normalised this kind of abuse. This kind of thing is almost a predictable syndrome associated with post-colonialism. Other countries have been through it, now it's the UK's turn. When countries lose their empires/influence, racism and fascism provide a compensation that can temporarily restore childish fantasies of omnipotence. It's associated with a death wish, so things generally get worse - sometimes much worse - before they get better.
- throwaway8689 5y ago
  The referendum vote is not the best point of reference. The Conservatives won comfortably in 2019, and recently won a by election, again comfortably, all on a platform of implementing brexit.
  - usr1106 5y ago
    Won comfortably in the UK does not mean too much in the UK. Easily 30-40% of the votes get just disregarded in the UK system. (I did not check the actual figures for the recent elections.)
bogle 5y ago
The dawn raid in Glasgow looks a lot like a deliberate provocation from the Westminster government and the Home Office. It was in the First Minister's constituency; it was as the new MSPs (Members of the Scottish Parliament) were being sworn in; it's in the constituency that the leader of Scottish Labour, Anas Sarwar, contested in the May election; and it was the first day of Eid Al-Fitr. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-57100259 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-57100259
- nob0dyasked 5y ago
  You don't sound paranoid at all.
Glawen 5y ago
Europeans and the EU are the ideal scapegoat in the UK. I always felt that Europeans were blamed for immigration policies as it is politically correct to shame them. Shaming non european immigration is a social minefield, very few people would dare to say it aloud as they would categorised as racists.
- Veen 5y ago
  You will find that non-European immigrants, especially from Commonwealth and ex-Commonwealth countries, also have a negative opinion of the previous preferential EU immigration rules. I have met many South African and Nigerian immigrants who found the disparity between their right to immigrate and that of EU citizens deeply unfair, and many who were eligible to vote in the Brexit referrendum chose to leave the EU for precicely that reason. They can hardly be accused of racism. Besides which, the conflation of a desire for immigration control with racism is a lazy canard.
  - kristjankalm 5y ago
    i find such logic hard to understand: UK was part of the EU, hence the open labour market. That's the whole point of EU. What did they find unfair exactly -- that Nigeria was not part of the EU? Or that countries can agree to have an open labour market?
    - Veen 5y ago
      Long before the UK joined the EU it was a member of the Commonwealth of Nations and had close relationships to countries that once were part of the Empire. Before the EU, most UK immigration came from Commonwealth countries. Freedom of movement allowed easy immigration from Europe and greater restrictions on Commonwealth immigration. People from those countries believe that the UK has prior obligations to members of the Commonwealth, and that it should prioritize those obligations (and often that privileging EU immigration is racist.) You can see the post-Brexit shift to previous obligations with the easing of immigration rules for Hong Kong citizens.
throwaway8689 5y ago
Brutal and nasty are emotive terms. If someone has no lawful basis to be in a country, what is wrong with expecting them to leave?
- bogle 5y ago
  In the press articles the Home Office is quoted as saying, "suspected offences". A dawn raid is completely abhorrent for anything other than serious crimes. Note that Immigration Enforcement isn't even the police, this is a Home Office unit.
  - throwaway8689 5y ago
    A dawn raid is designed to catch someone who is expected to try to evade arrest. Would you prefer a chase through the streets? Immigration Enforcement have power of arrest for this circumstance. The Information Commissioner has uniformed officers with limited police-type powers for their area of work too.
    - TheOtherHobbes 5y ago
      "Power of arrest" for which circumstance, exactly? Someone visiting perfectly legally for an interview which may lead to a job offer? And I'd prefer no speculative high-drama arrests of people who are following the rules and not breaking the law.
      - mytailorisrich 5y ago
        Visiting for an interview means having a letter of invitation for an interview from a company, not this (from article): > María, 25, from Valencia, said that like many of those detained, she thought she was free to explore the job market at least until October This sounds like coming to the UK for work without a visa, in which case it is correct in law to be detained. I think the practice of detention for up to 7 days before being deported is a way to inflict a punishment to deter people trying. Indeed, if the only thing you risk if caught is being turned away at the airport then people would just try and try, why not? There are articles from sources a bit more balanced than The Guardian: https://www.politico.eu/article/eu-citizens-detained-uk-work-visas-brexit/ https://www.politico.eu/article/eu-citizens-detained-uk-work...
exporectomy 5y ago
People who want unrestricted immigration for "looking for work" are completely clueless. They only think they want it because they don't know how many people will come if it's open borders with the 3rd world and what the economic and social consequences of that will be. Those unemployed people can't be allowed to starve so they must be supported by social welfare. It's easy to feel sorry for a handful of rejected migrants but only by ignoring the millions who never even tried to enter, knowing they couldn't.
- viraptor 5y ago
  > People who want unrestricted immigration for "looking for work" sounds like a weird strawman. Do you know of any larger group seriously fighting for that at the moment? (People coming for a scheduled interview are not "unrestricted immigration for looking for work")
  - fakedang 5y ago
    The article mentions a person coming "looking for work" being detained. The article also mentions a French woman who was detained for attending an interview for an internship, so I think there's that too. Imo, it's obviously very unclear as to why they're being detained, but in the case of Eugenia (Spanish woman arriving to "look for work"), it was clearly illegal per the new law.
- Stevvo 5y ago
  Very very few people want unrestricted immigration, however ~50% of people want unrestricted immigration from the EU on a reciprocal basis. We had that for years, with the economic and social consequences being largely positive. That said, I don't take it as a given that unrestricted immigration would cause problems; it has never been tried, there is no data to go on.
  - thu2111 5y ago
    Support for unlimited EU immigration is not 50%, it's much lower. You're thinking of people who voted to Remain, but a significant fraction of those people were motivated by the fear of "punishment" either from Cameron/Osborne's huge tax rises or the supposed EU allies, not actual firm support of EU policies. A breakdown is available here: https://dominiccummings.files.wordpress.com/2016/11/screenshot-2016-11-27-13-58-441.png?w=498&h=458 https://dominiccummings.files.wordpress.com/2016/11/screensh...
ur-whale 5y ago
> This nastiness is what the public demands. So you're saying democracy is bad?
callamdelaney 5y ago
Brutal? It's not brutal - it's positively tame. Take a look at the Australian system under Abott if you want 'brutal'. This is simply a Sovereign State softly removing those with zero right to remain.
- bogle 5y ago
  The Home Office said, "suspected offences". Funny that the "Sovreign State" tried this in Scotland, isn't it?
  - callamdelaney 5y ago
    What's the fact that it was in Scotland got to do with it? It's baseless to believe that the home office would target something in Sturgeons constituency on some particular day, especially when there's no political advantage to be drawn by said act. Immigration law applies to Scotland too; until there's a nice border there (but that's another topic).
    - bogle 5y ago
      I see your jingoistic sensibilities are clouding your thinking. Your political nous is also somewhat lacking, perhaps, if you can't see the power play here.
      - callamdelaney 5y ago
        So instead of making your point, my thinking is too clouded to come to the same unexplained conclusion as you?
        DyslexicAtheist 5y ago
        this is a bad-faith argument: > It's baseless to believe that the home office would target something in Sturgeons constituency on some particular day, especially when there's no political advantage to be drawn by said act. Judging by #10's behavior as a predictor for future behavior there is every reason to believe it was very much on purpose (and far from "baseless"). And even it wasn't on purpose it would now be on them to apologize and try to straighten things out - which ofc they don't.

j-pb 5y ago

The UK is the Dunning-Kruger-Effekt applied to a whole country.

TheOtherHobbes 5y ago
The UK as a whole isn't. The UK is a very interesting country trying to get out of its cocoon at the moment. This is going to be more of a struggle than most people expect, but the results could be surprising. The UK's government and media certainly are.
- j-pb 5y ago
  Of course this doesn't apply to individuals. It's an effect of the cultural feeling of supremacy originating from it's former colonial might, combined with a fairytale like ethos originating from the monarchy. In a sense it is only natural to become a bit megalomanic if you're called "the united kingdom", a name so full of grandeur and dreamlike romance that even tolkien would be a bit envious. Combine that with 40 years of anti E.U. media and you get a situation where people vote against their own self interest because they think they are better off alone. I for one can't wait for our scrottish brethren and sisters to rejoin us. They may take your passport but they will never take our article 49.
dang 5y ago
Nationalistic flamewar is not welcome here. Please don't post like this, regardless of which country you have an issue with. It only leads threads into hell. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&query=by%3Adang%20nationalistic%20flame&sort=byDate&type=comment https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...
- j-pb 5y ago
  With all due respect, I think you're blowing that comment on the skewed power dynamic of the U.K. with the E.U., public miss-information campaigns, and inappropriate policies of political leadership, vastly out of proportion. This has nothing to do with nationalism, but with a sombre sadness about the unnecessary damage caused by brexit.

PartiallyTyped 5y ago

I am generally against vindictiveness, but I am looking forward to English officials getting a horrific treatment for how their government treated or treats people. Sorry for all the Scots that are caught in the middle, we hope you find a way through and away from the torries. Finally, to the English, your politicians and your law enforcement deserve nothing less than cruelty for how they act. No apologies.

TheManInThePub 5y ago
> I am looking forward to the English getting the same treatment What a truly vile statement, unworthy of HN. Roughly half the English population (including myself) voted to remain. We are not gloating, but working hard to ensure cooperation with the EU continues..... ..... and no doubt, preparing for the next referendum to return to the EU in 10 years time (after all, a second independence referendum is now on the cards for Scotland, the precedent has been set).
- Veen 5y ago
  You can't expect anything better from Scottish nationalists. A very nasty bunch all round.
  - bogle 5y ago
    Pejorative comments about the Scottish do not cast you in a very good light.
    - Veen 5y ago
      First, it was a response to perjoritive comments about the English. Second, I made no perjoritive comments about the Scottish, just Scottish Nationalists. I know many excellent Scots.
  - PartiallyTyped 5y ago
    Not a Scottish, let alone a nationalist, I am just a person that thinks the English haven't suffered the consequences of their imperialism and need to get down of their high horse.

azalemeth 5y ago

I just can't understand why anti-immigration policies are so very popular. I'm absolutely certain that this is what a proportion of brexshit-voters want -- the cruel and degrading treatment of those who frankly better the country they come to work in. I just don't understand the reasons behind it and why governments, which privately acknowledge that immigration is good for the economy, remain so keen to be seen as tough on it in the eyes of the tabloid media.

extropy 5y ago
It's basic tribe psychology. At times of stress we seek out the enemy. And external imaginary enemy is always easier to accept than internal or god forbid a bad habit that we are all guilty of.
Veen 5y ago
Because what's good for the country's balance sheet and for businesses may not be good for certain segments of the population.
knorker 5y ago
Don't say "I can't understand". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=chALQCm9VgE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=chALQCm9VgE > the cruel and degrading treatment I don't think this part has as wide support as the part where people see entire towns lose their jobs, while from their point of view foreigners are being let in left and right. Those foreigners didn't literally take their jobs, but someone's gaining jobs and someone's losing jobs. It may be good for the economy, but you know that saying "taxation without representation"? Yeah, the government is supposed to represent the voters. And from these local's point of view they are not being represented. It's taxation without representation. And some people get upset about that. These people didn't get elected to represent the economy as a whole or even humanity as a whole, but to represent the voting population and their interests. Don't say "I can't understand".
- Stevvo 5y ago
  "someone's gaining jobs and someone's losing jobs" More jobs = more jobs for everyone. If I immigrate to your country nobody looses a job; I get given a job that a native was unwilling or unable to take. My economic contribution to the society will also increase the total number of available jobs, meaning more jobs for everyone.

tompccs 5y ago

Why the hell is anyone travelling for a job interview in the middle of a pandemic? I thought we all knew how to use Zoom now? Can't work it out with the Guardian, last month they were calling for travel bans, now they are supporting frivolous travel.

AfterShave 5y ago
I don't see how they are supporting frivolous travel by reporting: "This is happening to travelers at the border."
- tompccs 5y ago
  They are supporting it in that they consider this newsworthy.
  - viraptor 5y ago
    It's newsworthy when the LE or related organisations abuse the rules. It doesn't matter if the abused person does something you don't like.
- knorker 5y ago
  I would encourage you to use more critical thinking when reading news in the future. Another newspaper would phrase the same events as "EU jobseekers try to sneak into the UK, are we doing enough?". The Guardian is not secret about its views. And that's fine. You as the reader have a responsibility.
periheli0n 5y ago
Yes, the article is a bit misleading. One is allowed to travel to the UK for a job interview if the interview has already been lined up before landing. It is illegal to enter on a tourist visa and look for work. Always has been.

tupac_speedrap 5y ago

I don't see the problem here. These people don't seem to have valid visas or right to work in the UK and therefore are breaking the law. The UK has a big issue with people coming on the wrong visa and then working in the informal economy illegally, they just need to sort their visas and everything is fine.

mnd999 5y ago
Read the article, in a lot of cases they are not doing anything illegal. But we deport them anyway.
ur-whale 5y ago
>I don't see the problem here. These people don't seem to have valid visas Yup, but the whole notion of sovereignty has become so remote an bizarre to folks living in Europe that this is shocking news to most.
rvieira 5y ago
> EU citizens arriving in UK being _locked up_ and expelled I think you missed the point. The problem is not only controlling entry depending on their migration status (fair enough), but the process itself, which is meant to humiliate and scare people (hostile environment). The conditions in these detention places are degrading and people have to stay there for several days even when they say they will voluntarily go back in the first flight. If you found some mistake with your paperwork when landing in another country I think you would appreciate being given the choice of going back immediately instead of being locked up for a few days.

Havoc 5y ago

Notably this is happening before the 30 June deadline when strict enforcement of EU settled scheme is supposed to kick in.

the_mitsuhiko 5y ago

I have been helping people with immigration questions the last few years online. It’s crazy how many British people currently ask how to immigrate and that their options are severely limited now. No American, Russian or Indian person would even ask if they can immigrate without a degree whereas for most Brits who asked they have absolutely no qualifications. I wonder if we will see some more public realizations that freedom of movement is something British citizens will miss.

akvadrako 5y ago
What are you implying, that people can't immigrate without a degree? Of course they can; I'm an American without a degree that came to work in the EU.
- the_mitsuhiko 5y ago
  Every EU country is different. Immigration to Austria requires a degree or a profession on a shortlist.

thanatos519 5y ago

That the sign in the photo says "Welcome to the UK Border" and not "Welcome to the UK" sums it up for me.

OJFord 5y ago
Ha, I noticed that too. More than a whiff of a lawyer's touch! Reminds me of that Parks & Recreation scene where Andy's in the hospital having (for the second time) fallen in the pit, and Leslie visits chased by 'the city's lawyer' who has a long increasingly ridiculous list of interjections for things she 'can't say because it implies X'. i.e. 'you can't say Welcome to the UK, because it implies you have been allowed in to the UK'. Personally I think, fine, but maybe a subtler and nicer way to do it would be to position the sign on the other side of customs, visibly perhaps, and just have nothing or simply 'UK customs & border control' or whatever on the other.

periheli0n 5y ago

One is allowed to attend a job interview, but this needs to be arranged before landing in the UK. Better carry an invitation letter when the friendly border agent asks for it. What’s worrying though is the apparent bias towards detaining young women from southern/eastern Europe. Racial/national profiling?

viraptor 5y ago
Unless you have information to the contrary, some of the described people did arrive for scheduled interviews. I would assume that they either had a letter, or that a single call to the company would save everyone a lot of problems.
- periheli0n 5y ago
  If the border agent sends someone for detention who has an invitation for a job interview (and notably, for a job that will qualify for a work visa) then they break UK law.
  - pjc50 5y ago
    And we all know what happens when the police break the law, right? Nearly always nothing.
    - periheli0n 5y ago
      Unfortunately the article doesn’t say anything about the qualifications of those detained. If these were “unskilled workers” looking to work in the UK then they have no right of entry. If they were “skilled workers” with a job interview lined up and confirmed in writing, then the border force violated the law and the ones detained can sue for compensation.
  - viraptor 5y ago
    Second paragraph: "Europeans with job interviews are among those being denied entry and locked up." For the interview visit, there's no restrictions based on the job qualifications as far as I can tell. (unless you can find something specific?) So yes, that's pretty much why this article exists - they should not have been detained.

tompccs 5y ago

I think the commenters here have forgotten that we are in the middle of a pandemic, that the government has implemented a strict travel ban which also applies to British citizens, and that this policy was vigorously supported by the Guardian just a few weeks ago. Visa-free travel between the EU and UK is allowed for up to 30 days (for holidays, etc). This is pandemic policy, nothing to do with immigration or Brexit, no need to air all your pro-immigration views here.

periheli0n 5y ago
Yes, it has always been illegal to travel to the UK on a tourist visa and then look for work. However, when the UK was an EU member this was perfectly legal for EU citizens to do. Now it is not. So it does have to do with Brexit.

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admissionsguy 5y ago

The UK government has been quite repressive against its own citizens lately, so I would not expect them to treat foreigners any better. I had been planning to move to the UK before last December's deadline for getting the pre-settled status, but the "snitch on your neighbour" campaign during lockdowns convinced me otherwise.

DoomHotel 5y ago
You should be very glad you did not move to the UK. The Home Office has a backlog of 320,000 unprocessed applications for residency status, according to a recent Guardian article. [1] These people will be in legal limbo with no right to remain in the UK after June 30th if the backlog is not cleared. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/may/10/eu-citizens-applying-for-settled-status-face-legal-limbo-due-to-backlog https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/may/10/eu-citizens...

DoomHotel 5y ago

This week's Brexit & Beyond [1] mentioned this and I forgot to follow up on the link, so thank you. Performative cruelty for the masses while the Government talks up the great and wonderful success that is Brexit is only to be expected, I guess. [1] https://chrisgreybrexitblog.blogspot.com/2021/05/parallel-universes.html https://chrisgreybrexitblog.blogspot.com/2021/05/parallel-un...

bb101 5y ago

With worldwide population growth curves flattening and population pyramids inverting, countries of tomorrow will be positively clamouring for immigrants. A good book to read on the topic is Empty Planet by Bricker & Ibbitson[1]. One of their observations is that the country best placed to weather the coming demographic storm is the US, as they have a ready supply of immigrants south of their border. Every other country will have to compete, and some such as China will be in dire straits due to past misguided policies. [1] https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/37585564-empty-planet https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/37585564-empty-planet

nob0dyasked 5y ago
Sorry, but no. The solution to inverting population pyramids is not immigration. It's having more children where they are lacking, while having less where there's an excess. After millions and millions of new europeans, the public finances issues haven't got a tad better.
- periheli0n 5y ago
  Is this the fault of the "new europeans" which mostly came to the UK for a job, earn money and pay taxes, or the fault of those in charge of the public finances?
  - nob0dyasked 5y ago
    Not speaking about UK, but about Europe and the waves of "pension-paying" immigration. And yeah I won't bite the bait about supposed mismanagement in tory governments which I have no interest at all in debating in this website.

Tade0 5y ago

I appreciate that the people whose stories are shown are mostly western Europeans, so that any notion of brushing this off as "oh, it's just something that happens to new EU member citizens - or in other words - poor people" is dead on arrival.

elmo2you 5y ago

No matter what one may think/feel of this policy, if immigration detained these people and denied them contact with their embassy, than that is a very serious violation. Not that I'm really surprised though. This kind of lawless (and borderline fascist) "might makes right" behavior appears increasingly popular/prolific within the UK government. I'd suggest UK tourists spend their holidays within country borders from now on, for any of the involved countries (assuming there is indeed a pattern here, as suggested in the article) may decide to reciprocally harass or shake down UK tourist on their next visit to a warm beach. What comes around goes around.

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ralfn 5y ago

Well as a European from the Netherlands this means I won't even risk a city trip or holiday to the UK. Can you imagine being imprisoned rather than just being refused? Have they gone mental? This is war. Living in Amsterdam in tempted to report any british tourist now. Enough with the tolerance.

periheli0n 5y ago
Perfectly fine to travel to the UK as a tourist. Just don’t tell the border agent you’re coming to look for work without having an interview lined up for a job that would actually entitle you for a work visa.