9 ms·

Show HN: Hupreter – Create apps by describing them in English

57 points by fersarr 5y ago

Hi HN! Fernando here. A few months ago [1], I shared Hupreter (https://hupreter.com https://hupreter.com) with you all and now I am finally opening it up so that everyone can try it for free. The goal is to let users create apps and process data effortlessly, by just describing what the computer should do, in spoken English. We have made a lot of progress since the first post, and even though it is far from perfect, I really want to see how people use it and get feedback. In terms of creating apps, it supports persisting data (you can store/retrieve values), if statements, while loops, etc. For data processing, we currently support uploading tables, calculating the median/variance/etc., plotting, and more. And we will be improving all of those in the coming days. For example, you can tell Hupreter: Given the table nba_players, calculate the average value in the column "points". More examples are available here: https://hupreter.blog/ https://hupreter.blog/ Thanks for your time! Let me know what you think, either in the comments below or via fersarr AT gmail Fernando [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25945567 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25945567

deleted 5y ago
gus_massa 5y ago
How does this compare with Wolfram Alpha? It looks like this project understand more sentences in English, but I guess the data that is preloaded is smaller.
- fersarr 5y ago
  In terms of creating apps, the difference is that you can use typical programming blocks like if statements, while loops, DBs (persist a value), etc. For example: if three is prime, print "yes"
ddlsmurf 5y ago
As a developer this technology scares me not - for I have seen client specs and heard what they think they want.
- fersarr 5y ago
  haha yea that is always tricky. To know what you want is something else :)
- guenthert 5y ago
  But isn't that where the profession ultimately heads towards? Less manual, more or less inspired coding, instead more dialogue with clients and translating their wishes into a specification which can be turned into code with ever more sophisticated tools?
  - windmark 5y ago
    Definitely. Understanding the problem space and formulating the requirements is often overlooked when people claim "AI will take over programming". Although off the shelf products will be able to do more and more tasks, I believe the demand for complicated solutions constantly will stay ahead of these. This is exactly what we're seeing with Automation threatening the easy jobs, but as a whole, more specialized people are needed for the cases when that isn't enough.
- amelius 5y ago
  So, client iterates.
  - ddlsmurf 5y ago
    found the agile monkey
- CommieBobDole 5y ago
  I think eventually the role of 'developer' will be replaced by someone who takes business requirements and filters them for what's actually possible and desirable, then uses some sort of no-code software platform to turn them into instructions that a computer can use, then tunes those instructions based on testing and feedback until they effectively match the business requirements. Oh wait...
andiareso 5y ago
I don't really know if I understand this. How is this not a programming language with a longer and more complex syntax structure? It would seem to be just as confusing to non-technical people as teaching them a language like Python.
- offtop5 5y ago
  I can imagine this will end up creating more problems than it solves, for example depending on where you're from you might use various colloquialisms in speech which no AI will ever really get. For example if I said something like hey I want all the NBA players but they got to be like a little bit taller than 6 ft 2. What's a little bit, once you get into any edge cases, or even have to clarify what you mean, you might as well just program it out.
  - fersarr 5y ago
    yeah, if you are a programmer and it doesn't work quickly, you would just code it yourself. But if you are not...
    - offtop5 5y ago
      If you're not, you're going to endlessly frustrate yourself when this doesn't do exactly what you need it to. I guess I'd be more interested if the tool generated python code or something, and then I can manually edit it, or one of my friends could send it to me so I can edit it. Don't get me wrong if this idea worked in practice I'd be all over it, but I don't think it will.
      - fersarr 5y ago
        Hupreter generates python code, which you can see. Right now you cannot edit it, but we plan to allow that in the future.
  - foxes 5y ago
    I mean what does a little bit taller than 6ft mean? A human would ask to clarify or supply a sane default. Using the Star Trek example characters would often ask the computer to refine something, eg “no not that tall”, so a system like this should allow for refinement from feedback.
valgaze 5y ago
This is really interesting! The upload-a-table functionality is really neat > On the more UI side, there's a guy named Sharif Shameem who released a somewhat-similar tool (during the early "holy cow!" days of GPT3's release) to build functioning UI's from natural language input: https://twitter.com/sharifshameem/status/1284095222939451393 https://twitter.com/sharifshameem/status/1284095222939451393 > Jordan Singer made a Figma plugin too: https://twitter.com/jsngr/status/1284511080715362304 https://twitter.com/jsngr/status/1284511080715362304 Slides 23/24 shows some basic examples of how this could work: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1m2pZfclAziqWrEJdebufyr4dtCydawMR_2ybg6TqO_U/edit#slide=id.g90b9ac06ba_0_146 https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1m2pZfclAziqWrEJdebuf... I don't know if people want it or how well this all would work in a non-toy scenario, but the notion of "conversationally" building an application-- even if just the scaffolding-- is really compelling for some reason
- fersarr 5y ago
  Really cool examples and thanks for sharing those slides, super interesting. Both the react app and the figma demo are super impressive. Like you said, I think that we will see a lot more of conversational tasks with machines in general in the future.
twobitshifter 5y ago
Cool project, will I get syntax errors if I use “show me” or “display” instead of “print”. What if I actually want the computer to print on a piece of paper? “Print on the printer”? It reminds me of HyperTalk some, but this seems to be designed to deal with the gray areas of language is that right?
- fersarr 5y ago
  Yea, exactly. It can handle different ways of saying something, like your example. Additionally it understands coreferences like he/she/it/the/etc (not perfectly though). But it gets better with time :)
dennisy 5y ago
Is this built off the OpenAI API?
- fersarr 5y ago
  Hey Dennis. No it is not. We use offline open source models to create dependency trees and tags and our semantic engine takes off from there. After that the semantic structure gets transformed into code.
johnisgood 5y ago
You would have more success with Lojban instead of a natural language, IMO, I think natural languages are limited by nature.
Detrus 5y ago
Maybe works in 10% of cases. I remember seeing a natural language to SQL engine which worked in 50% of cases so the expectation was higher. https://blog.einstein.ai/talk-to-your-data-one-model-any-database/ https://blog.einstein.ai/talk-to-your-data-one-model-any-dat...
- fersarr 5y ago
  One of the hardest parts is guiding the user through what is currently possible, given that it's just a text input field. We'll continue to make it better.
grawprog 5y ago
I don't really understand this. I tried going at this as described with treating it as a natural language processor. I tried every iteration of 'calculate every prime number between 1 and 1000' i could think of. It was an error every time. I looked through the examples after and it seems to be a mix of natural language and formal programming constructs. I don't really understand how to use this properly. It reminds me a bit of inform7 except less clear as to what's actually acceptable syntax.
- fersarr 5y ago
  Sorry to hear that! We will keep working to make it better, there are certainly many things that need to improve

57 points by fersarr 5y ago

deleted 5y ago

gus_massa 5y ago

How does this compare with Wolfram Alpha? It looks like this project understand more sentences in English, but I guess the data that is preloaded is smaller.

fersarr 5y ago
In terms of creating apps, the difference is that you can use typical programming blocks like if statements, while loops, DBs (persist a value), etc. For example: if three is prime, print "yes"

ddlsmurf 5y ago

As a developer this technology scares me not - for I have seen client specs and heard what they think they want.

fersarr 5y ago
haha yea that is always tricky. To know what you want is something else :)
guenthert 5y ago
But isn't that where the profession ultimately heads towards? Less manual, more or less inspired coding, instead more dialogue with clients and translating their wishes into a specification which can be turned into code with ever more sophisticated tools?
- windmark 5y ago
  Definitely. Understanding the problem space and formulating the requirements is often overlooked when people claim "AI will take over programming". Although off the shelf products will be able to do more and more tasks, I believe the demand for complicated solutions constantly will stay ahead of these. This is exactly what we're seeing with Automation threatening the easy jobs, but as a whole, more specialized people are needed for the cases when that isn't enough.
amelius 5y ago
So, client iterates.
- ddlsmurf 5y ago
  found the agile monkey
CommieBobDole 5y ago
I think eventually the role of 'developer' will be replaced by someone who takes business requirements and filters them for what's actually possible and desirable, then uses some sort of no-code software platform to turn them into instructions that a computer can use, then tunes those instructions based on testing and feedback until they effectively match the business requirements. Oh wait...

andiareso 5y ago

I don't really know if I understand this. How is this not a programming language with a longer and more complex syntax structure? It would seem to be just as confusing to non-technical people as teaching them a language like Python.

offtop5 5y ago
I can imagine this will end up creating more problems than it solves, for example depending on where you're from you might use various colloquialisms in speech which no AI will ever really get. For example if I said something like hey I want all the NBA players but they got to be like a little bit taller than 6 ft 2. What's a little bit, once you get into any edge cases, or even have to clarify what you mean, you might as well just program it out.
- fersarr 5y ago
  yeah, if you are a programmer and it doesn't work quickly, you would just code it yourself. But if you are not...
  - offtop5 5y ago
    If you're not, you're going to endlessly frustrate yourself when this doesn't do exactly what you need it to. I guess I'd be more interested if the tool generated python code or something, and then I can manually edit it, or one of my friends could send it to me so I can edit it. Don't get me wrong if this idea worked in practice I'd be all over it, but I don't think it will.
    - fersarr 5y ago
      Hupreter generates python code, which you can see. Right now you cannot edit it, but we plan to allow that in the future.
- foxes 5y ago
  I mean what does a little bit taller than 6ft mean? A human would ask to clarify or supply a sane default. Using the Star Trek example characters would often ask the computer to refine something, eg “no not that tall”, so a system like this should allow for refinement from feedback.

valgaze 5y ago

This is really interesting! The upload-a-table functionality is really neat > On the more UI side, there's a guy named Sharif Shameem who released a somewhat-similar tool (during the early "holy cow!" days of GPT3's release) to build functioning UI's from natural language input: https://twitter.com/sharifshameem/status/1284095222939451393 https://twitter.com/sharifshameem/status/1284095222939451393 > Jordan Singer made a Figma plugin too: https://twitter.com/jsngr/status/1284511080715362304 https://twitter.com/jsngr/status/1284511080715362304 Slides 23/24 shows some basic examples of how this could work: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1m2pZfclAziqWrEJdebufyr4dtCydawMR_2ybg6TqO_U/edit#slide=id.g90b9ac06ba_0_146 https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1m2pZfclAziqWrEJdebuf... I don't know if people want it or how well this all would work in a non-toy scenario, but the notion of "conversationally" building an application-- even if just the scaffolding-- is really compelling for some reason

fersarr 5y ago
Really cool examples and thanks for sharing those slides, super interesting. Both the react app and the figma demo are super impressive. Like you said, I think that we will see a lot more of conversational tasks with machines in general in the future.

twobitshifter 5y ago

Cool project, will I get syntax errors if I use “show me” or “display” instead of “print”. What if I actually want the computer to print on a piece of paper? “Print on the printer”? It reminds me of HyperTalk some, but this seems to be designed to deal with the gray areas of language is that right?

fersarr 5y ago
Yea, exactly. It can handle different ways of saying something, like your example. Additionally it understands coreferences like he/she/it/the/etc (not perfectly though). But it gets better with time :)

dennisy 5y ago

Is this built off the OpenAI API?

fersarr 5y ago
Hey Dennis. No it is not. We use offline open source models to create dependency trees and tags and our semantic engine takes off from there. After that the semantic structure gets transformed into code.

johnisgood 5y ago

You would have more success with Lojban instead of a natural language, IMO, I think natural languages are limited by nature.

Detrus 5y ago

Maybe works in 10% of cases. I remember seeing a natural language to SQL engine which worked in 50% of cases so the expectation was higher. https://blog.einstein.ai/talk-to-your-data-one-model-any-database/ https://blog.einstein.ai/talk-to-your-data-one-model-any-dat...

fersarr 5y ago
One of the hardest parts is guiding the user through what is currently possible, given that it's just a text input field. We'll continue to make it better.

grawprog 5y ago

I don't really understand this. I tried going at this as described with treating it as a natural language processor. I tried every iteration of 'calculate every prime number between 1 and 1000' i could think of. It was an error every time. I looked through the examples after and it seems to be a mix of natural language and formal programming constructs. I don't really understand how to use this properly. It reminds me a bit of inform7 except less clear as to what's actually acceptable syntax.

fersarr 5y ago
Sorry to hear that! We will keep working to make it better, there are certainly many things that need to improve