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This is certainly a take. My children, one of the greatest sources of pure, unadulterated, innocent joy, are the only reason I believe there is still good in t

This is certainly a take. My children, one of the greatest sources of pure, unadulterated, innocent joy, are the only reason I believe there is still good in the world and thankful that this floating rock continues to revolve around the sun so I get to enjoy them. The stress of the children and the hard work is so minuscule in comparison.

Swizec 5y ago
Got a better explanation? I think it’s possible for both to be true. That kids give you unadulterated joy and also make you objectively worse off.
- bitexploder 5y ago
  Generally, what I have seen, people report greater overall satisfaction with their lives if they have kids. Cant be bothered to dig up the data, but I have read about it a number of times over the years. However, deep in your 20s and 30s is when careers are taking off, kids are at their most demanding ages, etc. it’s rare to be fully established in your career when your kids are young. That means lower earnings. So, yeah, it’s stressful. It’s also rewarding. My kids are older now. They bring my joy and all that. My mid 20s were also really hard when my kids were born. I think its all pretty obvious. Kids are like type 2 fun more than type 1 for most people. I appreciate them and watching them develop was quite an amazing process, and it brought me a lot of satisfaction, but it was also hard. I think a lot of parents take umbrage at saying their kids made them worse off, it really depends on what criteria you are using? Financial? Life satisfaction? Other? Most parents probably don’t /feel/ worse off in a general way.
  - Swizec 5y ago
    Yeah it depends how you ask the question. Do you feel more fulfilled? Yes probably Do you feel more stressed and struggling? D’oh Typically we don’t equate “stressed, struggling, tired, and constantly drowning” as more happy. At least not in life satisfaction surveys I imagine
- thatcat 5y ago
  Sure, your mortgage is paid off and you're probably in a management or other upper level position with less job insecurity.
- snikeris 5y ago
  All of your ancestors raised children. We are machines, designed by nature to procreate. The notion that one would be objectively better off by avoiding the very process that brought themself into being...seems unlikely to me. Unless, we’re narrowly using the term “objectively better off” to mean what society seems to value: money, power, pleasure, etc. These things aren’t necessarily good for the organism in the way that having children is.
  - Aeolun 5y ago
    Hah, this is true. I’m going to keep this. By virtue of having children, I’m objectively better off than anyone that didn’t.
    - 411111111111111 5y ago
      its not exactly true though. happiness is related to the society you live in and your biology ... and other variables. its entirely possible that you can be both "objectively worse off/more stressed", which is generally considered to be a cause for unhappiness and still feel that the children were the best decision of your life. its a complex topic and i dont think anyone can realistically generalize it. there will be people that are actually unhappy because of them while still claiming happiness, as well as people that were unhappy until they finally had them.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- Aeolun 5y ago
  I think constant exhaustion might have some effect on your satisfaction levels ;) In my case, I’m also moving around a lot more, so I guess the added exercise compensates for the exhaustion in terms of effect on overall happiness.

Swizec 5y ago

Got a better explanation? I think it’s possible for both to be true. That kids give you unadulterated joy and also make you objectively worse off.

bitexploder 5y ago
Generally, what I have seen, people report greater overall satisfaction with their lives if they have kids. Cant be bothered to dig up the data, but I have read about it a number of times over the years. However, deep in your 20s and 30s is when careers are taking off, kids are at their most demanding ages, etc. it’s rare to be fully established in your career when your kids are young. That means lower earnings. So, yeah, it’s stressful. It’s also rewarding. My kids are older now. They bring my joy and all that. My mid 20s were also really hard when my kids were born. I think its all pretty obvious. Kids are like type 2 fun more than type 1 for most people. I appreciate them and watching them develop was quite an amazing process, and it brought me a lot of satisfaction, but it was also hard. I think a lot of parents take umbrage at saying their kids made them worse off, it really depends on what criteria you are using? Financial? Life satisfaction? Other? Most parents probably don’t /feel/ worse off in a general way.
- Swizec 5y ago
  Yeah it depends how you ask the question. Do you feel more fulfilled? Yes probably Do you feel more stressed and struggling? D’oh Typically we don’t equate “stressed, struggling, tired, and constantly drowning” as more happy. At least not in life satisfaction surveys I imagine
thatcat 5y ago
Sure, your mortgage is paid off and you're probably in a management or other upper level position with less job insecurity.
snikeris 5y ago
All of your ancestors raised children. We are machines, designed by nature to procreate. The notion that one would be objectively better off by avoiding the very process that brought themself into being...seems unlikely to me. Unless, we’re narrowly using the term “objectively better off” to mean what society seems to value: money, power, pleasure, etc. These things aren’t necessarily good for the organism in the way that having children is.
- Aeolun 5y ago
  Hah, this is true. I’m going to keep this. By virtue of having children, I’m objectively better off than anyone that didn’t.
  - 411111111111111 5y ago
    its not exactly true though. happiness is related to the society you live in and your biology ... and other variables. its entirely possible that you can be both "objectively worse off/more stressed", which is generally considered to be a cause for unhappiness and still feel that the children were the best decision of your life. its a complex topic and i dont think anyone can realistically generalize it. there will be people that are actually unhappy because of them while still claiming happiness, as well as people that were unhappy until they finally had them.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
Aeolun 5y ago
I think constant exhaustion might have some effect on your satisfaction levels ;) In my case, I’m also moving around a lot more, so I guess the added exercise compensates for the exhaustion in terms of effect on overall happiness.