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Complete side-tangent: as a British-English speaker living in the US I have just about grown able to tolerate the American pronunciation of ‘herb’ with a silent
by jameshart 6y ago
Complete side-tangent: as a British-English speaker living in the US I have just about grown able to tolerate the American pronunciation of ‘herb’ with a silent H, so it doesn’t jar me too much when I read a text that says “an herb”.
But I haven’t encountered enough scientific spoken American to have developed an instinct for whether or not Americans actually pronounce the ‘h’ in ‘herb-‘ words like ‘herbivore’ or ‘herbaceous’; so in this text I was a bit thrown by encountering both “a herbaceous plant”, and “an herbaceous plant”. Wondering whether this is situational pronunciation? A variation on the hyper correct ‘an precedes words that start with H if the first syllable is unstressed’ rule that gives you “an hotel” and “an historic event”? Just error?
Can anyone enlighten me?
- Izkata 6y ago> as a British-English speaker living in the US I have just about grown able to tolerate the American pronunciation of ‘herb’ with a silent H, so it doesn’t jar me too much when I read a text that says “an herb”. As someone who grew up in the US and has never left the country, "an herb" really bothers me because I've always pronounced the "h".
- stephenhuey 6y agoIf I personally say “herbivores and omnivores” I find myself wanting to pronounce the h sound. But my Merriam Webster dictionary implies with parentheses that some Americans do not pronounce it: ˈ(h)ər-bə-ˌvȯr
- kazinator 6y agoThe difference is more pronounced (pun intended) when an indefinite article is attached: "an herb" versus "a herb".
- stephenhuey 6y agoTrue, but I tend to think of choosing the indefinite article appropriate to how I pronounce the word. So if I pronounce the h then I’d choose a, but since I don’t I always go with an. But for herbivore, it would be a for me. :)
- tingletech 6y agoI thought you just softly swallow the `h` when there is an `an` so it starts with a vowel sound. I can't think of any time I've ever heard or said "an hotel" and it sounds very awkward to me, but herbaceous and historic can warble.
- analog31 6y agoBut they say "an historian."
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- jameshart 6y agowho is 'they'?
- analog31 6y agoWell... historians, mostly.
- IshKebab 6y agoPeople who erroneously say "an historic" and pronounce the h.
- jameshart 6y agoThat’s not an error. It can be an affectation, but in my native southern English middle class somewhat Radio 4 accent it’s perfectly reasonable to pronounce ‘an historic’ basically the same as ‘unhistoric’ - or equally to pronounce ‘a historic’ with a stressed a, basically the same as ‘ahistoric’. Pronouncing it with an unstressed schwa for ‘a’ then an unstressed ‘his’ sounds awkward to my ear. And I would never drop the ‘h’. That would sound common :)
- IshKebab 6y ago
- nerdponx 6y agoAmerican here (Northeast USA). It varies by person and possibly by local accent. But people are generally consistent in whether they pronounce the leading "h" or not. Most people do not pronounce the "h". As for "an" and "a", I was taught to follow the rule you stated in school. To my eye, using "a" is informal and mimicking speech, whereas "an" is "correct".
- smhost 6y agohttps://www.ahdictionary.com/word/search.html?id=A5000200 https://www.ahdictionary.com/word/search.html?id=A5000200 > Usage Note: In writing, the form a is used before a word beginning with a consonant sound, regardless of its spelling (a frog, a university, a euphemism). The form an is used before a word beginning with a vowel sound (an orange, an hour). · An was once a common variant before words beginning with h in which the first syllable was unstressed; thus 18th-century authors wrote either a historical or an historical but a history, not an history. This usage made sense in that people often did not pronounce the initial h in words such as historical and heroic, but by the late 19th century educated speakers usually gave their initial h's a huff, and the practice of writing an before such words began to die out. Nowadays it survives primarily before the word historical. One may also come across it in the phrases an hysterectomy or an hereditary trait. These usages are acceptable in formal writing.
- jameshart 6y agoI don’t think that answers my question. The article contains both ‘an herbaceous’ and ‘a herbaceous’. And does not appear to be 18th century in origin.
- bostonpete 6y agoI think it would depend on pronunciation. Since "herbaceous" isn't a term you hear often, most people likely don't have a good instinct for how they "should" pronounce it. Seems plausible that the author concluded one pronunciation made more sense at one point during writing and the other pronunciation at a different point. Or maybe one was just a typo. ;-)
- smhost 6y agoIn the entry for "herbaceous": (hûr-bāshəs, ûr-) According to the Usage Notes, both "an" and "a" are correct in written form (since both pronunciations are correct). If you're reading it out loud, "an herbacious" should be pronounced with a silent "h", and "a herbaceous" should be pronounced with an aspirated "h".
- Gibbon1 6y agoThere is formal writing, informal writing. Words that are not commonly used in spoken English may often be mispronounced. Common words are subject to drift. Then there are regional variations in the US. But then also people move from one region to another. And of course different dialects may coexist.
- gweinberg 6y agoAmericans for the most part don't pronounce the aitch in herbivore or herbaceous. I've never heard an American say "an hotel", and the only Americans who say "an historic" are pretentious twits.
- HanShotFirst 6y agoI don't think anyone has really answered your question about why you encountered both in this article. "A herbacious," was only present inside a quote in the article. The author of the article seems to prefer using, "an," in their own writing. I don't know of any situational difference in pronunciation in play here, just regional or formal preferences as mentioned by other commenters.
- canadianfella 6y agoHistoric is much worse. Going to ‘istory class later.