4 ms·

The user most definitively has to know these things. Your argument is a race to the bottom I think. We will end up with devices where the user has to know noth

by SCHiM 5y ago

The user most definitively has to know these things. Your argument is a race to the bottom I think. We will end up with devices where the user has to know nothing, cannot do anything and is lazy and easily led. Just as moving yourself around on a bike is healthier than planting your ass in your car, so is thinking for yourself and _once_ in your life taking the time to figure out what that whole location sharing thing actually means.

gregoriol 5y ago
I get your point as a tech person, but really, have you ever had this issue with your parents and iOS devices these days? I mean even most 30-something people don't know what those choices are about, that Whatsapp is worse than Signal... Maybe there should be something like a "root" or "developer" setting that can be enabled for advanced users, but for the average person the default for all this must be the best possible option already and they don't need to worry about it.
- SCHiM 5y ago
  I mean sure IOS is hassle free and all that, but on IOS you're also a computational serf, computing at the whims of your apple overlords. I've thought one member of my family to setup their own wireless access point. And they can reliably solve most 'the internet does not work' problems on their own now. This member used to confuse the explorer.exe window with a picture of an explorer.exe window in internet explorer, with predictable results (at the time)... I'd rather live in the latter world than the former, time will tell if more people agree with me.
vbezhenar 5y ago
> We will end up with devices where the user has to know nothing, cannot do anything and is lazy and easily led. Sounds like a good summary for iPhone.
- lotsofpulp 5y ago
  I do quite a lot with my iPhone. So do others I know. One of the most important things I do is Facetime with grandparents and aunts and uncles.
RGamma 5y ago
Virtually every major consumer-targeted appliance or online service these days is like you describe. It's a side effect of eliminating friction when interacting with the product. Having to stop and read manuals or reflect or such is a big no-no and interferes with "engagement". And it's wildly successful and common to cater to and foster intellectual laziness instead of, say, furthering education or individual mündigkeit. Also, what rock do you live under? I want to join you.
- pembrook 5y ago
  Or, maybe all these “lazy normies” are just busy with things like friends, family, work and their community...so they don’t really care if X company is able to do better ad targeting. But sure, you guys have fun living under your rock and being super educated on the nuances of mobile ad targeting technology. The rest of us idiots will waste our time doing intellectually lazy things like spending time with our kids and living in the real world.
  - SCHiM 5y ago
    Not to be too offensive, but it _is_ lazy no? This stuff is important! I feel like it's (and has been for a while) going wrong. I know user education it mostly a pipe dream. But it's all I can think of. The iPhone is probably relatively free compared to the streamlined hassle-free applications and devices of the future. And all the while polarization in all our societies grows, until my government too has no option but to lock it down and forge social cohesion through state-sponsored psy-ops and information-ops. We'll be well on our way to a 1984 dystopia then. --- And please, it's not like there's not time for a normal life. See my comment about my family member below. Maybe if tech people would just refuse to fix the internet, more people would understand how it works.
    - RGamma 5y ago
      You've picked the wrong site/time to invoke civic ideals wrt (digital) technology; that was a thing of the 90s. Too many conflicting interests have built up..

by SCHiM 5y ago

gregoriol 5y ago

I get your point as a tech person, but really, have you ever had this issue with your parents and iOS devices these days? I mean even most 30-something people don't know what those choices are about, that Whatsapp is worse than Signal... Maybe there should be something like a "root" or "developer" setting that can be enabled for advanced users, but for the average person the default for all this must be the best possible option already and they don't need to worry about it.

SCHiM 5y ago
I mean sure IOS is hassle free and all that, but on IOS you're also a computational serf, computing at the whims of your apple overlords. I've thought one member of my family to setup their own wireless access point. And they can reliably solve most 'the internet does not work' problems on their own now. This member used to confuse the explorer.exe window with a picture of an explorer.exe window in internet explorer, with predictable results (at the time)... I'd rather live in the latter world than the former, time will tell if more people agree with me.

vbezhenar 5y ago

> We will end up with devices where the user has to know nothing, cannot do anything and is lazy and easily led. Sounds like a good summary for iPhone.

lotsofpulp 5y ago
I do quite a lot with my iPhone. So do others I know. One of the most important things I do is Facetime with grandparents and aunts and uncles.

RGamma 5y ago

Virtually every major consumer-targeted appliance or online service these days is like you describe. It's a side effect of eliminating friction when interacting with the product. Having to stop and read manuals or reflect or such is a big no-no and interferes with "engagement". And it's wildly successful and common to cater to and foster intellectual laziness instead of, say, furthering education or individual mündigkeit. Also, what rock do you live under? I want to join you.

pembrook 5y ago
Or, maybe all these “lazy normies” are just busy with things like friends, family, work and their community...so they don’t really care if X company is able to do better ad targeting. But sure, you guys have fun living under your rock and being super educated on the nuances of mobile ad targeting technology. The rest of us idiots will waste our time doing intellectually lazy things like spending time with our kids and living in the real world.
- SCHiM 5y ago
  Not to be too offensive, but it _is_ lazy no? This stuff is important! I feel like it's (and has been for a while) going wrong. I know user education it mostly a pipe dream. But it's all I can think of. The iPhone is probably relatively free compared to the streamlined hassle-free applications and devices of the future. And all the while polarization in all our societies grows, until my government too has no option but to lock it down and forge social cohesion through state-sponsored psy-ops and information-ops. We'll be well on our way to a 1984 dystopia then. --- And please, it's not like there's not time for a normal life. See my comment about my family member below. Maybe if tech people would just refuse to fix the internet, more people would understand how it works.
  - RGamma 5y ago
    You've picked the wrong site/time to invoke civic ideals wrt (digital) technology; that was a thing of the 90s. Too many conflicting interests have built up..