4 ms·

It also has much less ability to screw over people unless they live in China. China cannot project power the way US can.

djhn 5y ago
Cannot for now.
Teever 5y ago
This isn't totally accurate. You are correct that China cannot project power in the sense that they can't easily invade a country or level shattering economic sanctions but they have proven themselves quite capable of targetting individuals in other nations both online and in the real world. Either way, there is a moral imperative to prevent China from gaining the ability to project power the way the US can. The US being able to project that kind of power is shitty, and the two entities being able to do that is even shittier.
- jrochkind1 5y ago
  I appreciate that you recognize the US being able to do it is shitty. I wonder how many non-Americans think two entities being able to do it is better than one, because at least they can counter-balance each other. Not just with force; I was recently thinking about how the US during the cold war tried to be "nice" to the "third world" to keep them out of the "sphere of influence" of the Soviet Union. Currently China is trying to project it's "soft power" that way too to get less developed countries into it's patronage, but the US isn't really doing that at the moment (see for instance approaches to distributing covid vaccine...). I (who is a usa citizen) personally am not really sure which is preferable, only one super-power, or two. Either way the world is in for a rough ride.
  - k12sosse 5y ago
    When it's just the US, AXIS powers lose. When it's China too, the world loses.
  - artificialLimbs 5y ago
    Let me assure you, Chinese power is BAD. And I personally hate using that word, but here it is warranted. At least in the U.S., we have the intent of moral fiber permeating through our founding document, and probably at least half the population still fervently believes in these principles or tries to behave as though they matter. China doesn't give a fuck. Their government is a communist dictatorship, and their sole concern is the expansion of their power through force.
    - belatw 5y ago
      That “intent of moral fiber permeating through our founding document” failed to do achieve much good for the the peoples of Yemen, Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, Cuba, Vietnam, African slaves, or Native Americans. Those who live in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones.
    - krageon 5y ago
      > in the U.S., we have [...] moral fiber It's so hard to take you seriously when you make claims like this. Nobody cares about your founding documents, folks look at what the US does. And what it does is send drone strikes to hit schools, it bullies countries into doing what it wants without offering anything in return, etc. I genuinely cannot currently see a worse superpower.
      - artificialLimbs 5y ago
        We also invented air conditioning and cars and airplanes and refridgerators and the internet. Global poverty is at a historic low right now. Violent crime, at least here in the U.S., is at an all time low. With gratitude as a dominant force in ones's life, one is able to step back and see pictures other than what one wishes to see. One is able to stop buying into hysteria. It is sad that some politicians use military as their play tool for nefarious purposes. Biden sent troops into Syria almost immediately upon assuming his current position. Reprehensible.
        a0-prw 5y ago
        The main reason global poverty is at a historic low is that China has lifted a record number of people out of extreme poverty. On the other hand, the Middle East has become more impoverished, especially in Yemen and Syria, where the US has been instrumental in destabilization: "These numbers confirm a downward trend in poverty rates in East Asia and the Pacific, reducing the poverty headcount ratio at the international poverty line from 2.1% in 2015 to 1.0 % in 2019, driven by decreases in poverty in China and the Philippines. In contrast, spurred by the conflicts in Yemen and Syria, the Middle East and North Africa region has seen a sharp reversal, with the poverty rate increasing from around 2.1% in 2013 to 4.3% in 2015 and 7% in 2018." Source: https://blogs.worldbank.org/opendata/march-2021-global-poverty-update-world-bank https://blogs.worldbank.org/opendata/march-2021-global-pover...

djhn 5y ago

Cannot for now.

Teever 5y ago

This isn't totally accurate. You are correct that China cannot project power in the sense that they can't easily invade a country or level shattering economic sanctions but they have proven themselves quite capable of targetting individuals in other nations both online and in the real world. Either way, there is a moral imperative to prevent China from gaining the ability to project power the way the US can. The US being able to project that kind of power is shitty, and the two entities being able to do that is even shittier.

jrochkind1 5y ago
I appreciate that you recognize the US being able to do it is shitty. I wonder how many non-Americans think two entities being able to do it is better than one, because at least they can counter-balance each other. Not just with force; I was recently thinking about how the US during the cold war tried to be "nice" to the "third world" to keep them out of the "sphere of influence" of the Soviet Union. Currently China is trying to project it's "soft power" that way too to get less developed countries into it's patronage, but the US isn't really doing that at the moment (see for instance approaches to distributing covid vaccine...). I (who is a usa citizen) personally am not really sure which is preferable, only one super-power, or two. Either way the world is in for a rough ride.
- k12sosse 5y ago
  When it's just the US, AXIS powers lose. When it's China too, the world loses.
- artificialLimbs 5y ago
  Let me assure you, Chinese power is BAD. And I personally hate using that word, but here it is warranted. At least in the U.S., we have the intent of moral fiber permeating through our founding document, and probably at least half the population still fervently believes in these principles or tries to behave as though they matter. China doesn't give a fuck. Their government is a communist dictatorship, and their sole concern is the expansion of their power through force.
  - belatw 5y ago
    That “intent of moral fiber permeating through our founding document” failed to do achieve much good for the the peoples of Yemen, Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, Cuba, Vietnam, African slaves, or Native Americans. Those who live in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones.
  - krageon 5y ago
    > in the U.S., we have [...] moral fiber It's so hard to take you seriously when you make claims like this. Nobody cares about your founding documents, folks look at what the US does. And what it does is send drone strikes to hit schools, it bullies countries into doing what it wants without offering anything in return, etc. I genuinely cannot currently see a worse superpower.
    - artificialLimbs 5y ago
      We also invented air conditioning and cars and airplanes and refridgerators and the internet. Global poverty is at a historic low right now. Violent crime, at least here in the U.S., is at an all time low. With gratitude as a dominant force in ones's life, one is able to step back and see pictures other than what one wishes to see. One is able to stop buying into hysteria. It is sad that some politicians use military as their play tool for nefarious purposes. Biden sent troops into Syria almost immediately upon assuming his current position. Reprehensible.
      - a0-prw 5y ago
        The main reason global poverty is at a historic low is that China has lifted a record number of people out of extreme poverty. On the other hand, the Middle East has become more impoverished, especially in Yemen and Syria, where the US has been instrumental in destabilization: "These numbers confirm a downward trend in poverty rates in East Asia and the Pacific, reducing the poverty headcount ratio at the international poverty line from 2.1% in 2015 to 1.0 % in 2019, driven by decreases in poverty in China and the Philippines. In contrast, spurred by the conflicts in Yemen and Syria, the Middle East and North Africa region has seen a sharp reversal, with the poverty rate increasing from around 2.1% in 2013 to 4.3% in 2015 and 7% in 2018." Source: https://blogs.worldbank.org/opendata/march-2021-global-poverty-update-world-bank https://blogs.worldbank.org/opendata/march-2021-global-pover...