5 ms·

A friend of mine bought new BMW and the whole thing just shut down half way into the journey, he said he was happy he could get out of it. The more complexity t

A friend of mine bought new BMW and the whole thing just shut down half way into the journey, he said he was happy he could get out of it. The more complexity the higher the chance of failure. If you're like me you just want a car that get's you from point A to point B reliably and safely. You're probably thinking they will always be an option for a straightforward mechanical machine. But that may not be the case. Regulators are increasing demands for more and more electronics and a lot of that is driven (I assume) by car industry lobby. Essentially, the best thing a car industry can achieve is to turn your car into a computer or iphone. This way they can release new models every year and increase the the pressure to buy more. Right now a 20yo car is still good to drive around and not that much has improved, but what are you going to do it the new software update is no longer compatible with your car? :) And obviously, more higher complexity.higher failure means more profits on component sales.

excuses_ 5y ago
The only thing that constantly improves and is really worth considering is safety. I am not even saying about active safety features but the passive ones. They are also in constant development.
- kqr 5y ago
  But these are sometimes making it safer for the occupants at the expense of the rest of the environment (think smaller windows and fatter A pillars making children harder to see, or strengthened soundproofing making children harder to hear.)
  - Broken_Hippo 5y ago
    But are children harder to see than from older cars? It isn't like the windows were huge nor the beams small. Are children really harder to hear? Old cars were louder. How much sound did they cover up just with noise? How much more could you hear in an old car compared to a modern electric car?
  - Karsteski 5y ago
    I don't think this is a very good argument... I want my car to be as quiet as possible, on terms of the noise it makes and it's soundproofness. That making people harder to hear outside is irrelevant, as I mainly use my eyes to scan the environment for people, not my ears. Also I think we've done enough damage to the world with the (British accent) "what about the children" arguments...
    - kqr 5y ago
      I think this one in particular ticks me off personally because people I meet are all moralistic about me listening to podcasts while bicycling in traffic, telling me I "shouldn't block the sounds of the environment." And I'm left wondering: have these people ever been in a modern car? Just sitting in it blocks out more of the environment than my open-backed earbuds. If I can drive one of those without causing an accident, surely I can listen to podcasts on my (much slower) bicycle without causing an accident too!
      - maxerickson 5y ago
        Isn't that advice about your own safety? I see it now where people bellyache about headphones and runners and don't really get it. I don't have the volume jacked up and I know where to look for traffic. On a bike I don't want headphones just because I'm mixing with so much more traffic and want that awareness.
ChuckNorris89 5y ago
>A friend of mine bought new BMW and the whole thing just shut down half way into the journey, he said he was happy he could get out of it. That's more o an issue of the big German car manufacturers having outsourced their HW and SW development to suppliers who compete on cost so UX was never in the budget. Still, I do prefer having physical switches for the critical functions of a car regardless of how polished the touch UX is.
benhurmarcel 5y ago
Cars have a lot more components and electronics than they had 30 years ago, and yet they are very significantly more reliable.
AdrianB1 5y ago
It is not the complexity at fault, it's BMW cutting corners hitting quality. Even assuming the higher complexity part, there is no reason a software nice-to-have like navigation to make your entire car unusable, if you keep the ECU separate from the rest of the car it will still drive.

excuses_ 5y ago

The only thing that constantly improves and is really worth considering is safety. I am not even saying about active safety features but the passive ones. They are also in constant development.

kqr 5y ago
But these are sometimes making it safer for the occupants at the expense of the rest of the environment (think smaller windows and fatter A pillars making children harder to see, or strengthened soundproofing making children harder to hear.)
- Broken_Hippo 5y ago
  But are children harder to see than from older cars? It isn't like the windows were huge nor the beams small. Are children really harder to hear? Old cars were louder. How much sound did they cover up just with noise? How much more could you hear in an old car compared to a modern electric car?
- Karsteski 5y ago
  I don't think this is a very good argument... I want my car to be as quiet as possible, on terms of the noise it makes and it's soundproofness. That making people harder to hear outside is irrelevant, as I mainly use my eyes to scan the environment for people, not my ears. Also I think we've done enough damage to the world with the (British accent) "what about the children" arguments...
  - kqr 5y ago
    I think this one in particular ticks me off personally because people I meet are all moralistic about me listening to podcasts while bicycling in traffic, telling me I "shouldn't block the sounds of the environment." And I'm left wondering: have these people ever been in a modern car? Just sitting in it blocks out more of the environment than my open-backed earbuds. If I can drive one of those without causing an accident, surely I can listen to podcasts on my (much slower) bicycle without causing an accident too!
    - maxerickson 5y ago
      Isn't that advice about your own safety? I see it now where people bellyache about headphones and runners and don't really get it. I don't have the volume jacked up and I know where to look for traffic. On a bike I don't want headphones just because I'm mixing with so much more traffic and want that awareness.

ChuckNorris89 5y ago

>A friend of mine bought new BMW and the whole thing just shut down half way into the journey, he said he was happy he could get out of it. That's more o an issue of the big German car manufacturers having outsourced their HW and SW development to suppliers who compete on cost so UX was never in the budget. Still, I do prefer having physical switches for the critical functions of a car regardless of how polished the touch UX is.

benhurmarcel 5y ago

Cars have a lot more components and electronics than they had 30 years ago, and yet they are very significantly more reliable.

AdrianB1 5y ago

It is not the complexity at fault, it's BMW cutting corners hitting quality. Even assuming the higher complexity part, there is no reason a software nice-to-have like navigation to make your entire car unusable, if you keep the ECU separate from the rest of the car it will still drive.