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I don't disagree that 8GiB for $1700 machine is absurd, however, I feel compelled to point out that MacOS is significantly more aggressive with memory compressi
by PartiallyTyped 6y ago
I don't disagree that 8GiB for $1700 machine is absurd, however, I feel compelled to point out that MacOS is significantly more aggressive with memory compression than other operating systems and they come with blazingly fast SSDs, allowing devices to get away with less available memory.
- runeks 6y agoA blazingly fast SSD is excruciatingly slow RAM.
- PartiallyTyped 6y agoI am trying to figure out where I said anything on the contrary.
- matkoniecz 6y agoYou mentioned "they come with blazingly fast SSDs" as part of what is "allowing devices to get away with less available memory"
- PartiallyTyped 6y agoI did indeed, I never said that SSDs are a replacement for RAM, I just said that having access to 2.5GiB/s RW operations allows you to offload many things into the SSD, yes, thrashing is an issue, but it is much more insignificant at those speeds than disks. I am not defending apple in any way whatsoever, I even mentioned in the first sentence of the comment. I stated that they are able to do that because they compensate with compression and SSDs, applications in the background can be thrown in the swap and the user will rarely notice.
- kamranjon 6y agoI think they are saying that you will start swapping to disk with that little ram.
- znpy 6y agoI don't even bother reasoning with apple fans anymore. It's a losing game.
- PartiallyTyped 6y agoIt's not even an argument, their comment is a fact that does not change nor contribute anything.
- kaba0 6y agoIn-memory memory compression is the most meaningful part of what parent comment said. And it helps tremendously on other systems as well, for example zram is quite underhyped on linux.
- rogers18445 6y agozram is a game changer. I believed I needed to upgrade 16gb to 32gb, with zram and a decent cpu no I don't. 97% full memory + 20GB zram swap and no noticeable problems.
- r00fus 6y agoThe M1 SoC interconnects are what makes their SSD seem like swapping to disk doesn't even feel slow.
- emptyfile 6y ago> blazingly fast SSDs So like, 2 times as fast as any other SSD? No? The comment reads like marketing spiel.
- PartiallyTyped 6y ago2.5GiB random RW per sec [1]. [1] https://www.macrumors.com/2020/11/16/apple-silicon-macbook-air-ssd-benchmarks/ https://www.macrumors.com/2020/11/16/apple-silicon-macbook-a...
- danieldk 6y agoBlackMagic tests video workloads using sequential reads/swrites. 2.2/2.7 GiB/s is pretty average for a modern NVMe SSD. Even consumer-level Samsung NVMe SSDs are faster.
- necovek 6y agoWhat makes you think it's random RW? Fastest SSDs barely reach 200MiB/s on 4k block random writes (reads are usually slower, likely because they can't be cached if they are truly random): - 124MB/s for Samsung 980 Pro (https://www.servethehome.com/samsung-980-pro-500gb-pcie-gen4-nvme-ssd-benchmarks-review/2/ https://www.servethehome.com/samsung-980-pro-500gb-pcie-gen4...) - 211MB/s for Sabrent Rocket 4 Plus (https://www.servethehome.com/sabrent-rocket-4-plus-2tb-review/2/ https://www.servethehome.com/sabrent-rocket-4-plus-2tb-revie...) - 171MB/s for Intel 670p (https://www.servethehome.com/intel-670p-2tb-m-2-nvme-ssd-review/2/ https://www.servethehome.com/intel-670p-2tb-m-2-nvme-ssd-rev...) 32/64 queue depths generally do not apply to desktop computing since you are unlikely to read that many file streams simultaneously (or rather, your one program that you care about right now might be loading only a few files at once, which is what you'd perceive as the SSD speed: the fact that OS services might be accessing other stuff in the background does not help much there).
- jeswin 6y ago> and they come with blazingly fast SSDs... Actually, they're somewhat slow compared to the competition. A 500GB M1 SSD gives you about 3.1GB/s of write and 2.75GB/s of read performance [1]. In comparison - a $219 Samsung 980 Pro benchmarks at 4.2GB/s of write and 5.2GB/s of read performance [2]. Both on Disk Test from Black Magic. [1]: https://www.reddit.com/r/mac/comments/k2lhi8/ssd_speedtest_of_a_macbook_pro_m1_with_1tb_what/ https://www.reddit.com/r/mac/comments/k2lhi8/ssd_speedtest_o... [2]: https://www.servethehome.com/samsung-980-pro-500gb-pcie-gen4-nvme-ssd-benchmarks-review/2/#:~:text=For%20sequential%20transfer%20speed%2C%20the,easily%20topping%20our%20overall%20chart https://www.servethehome.com/samsung-980-pro-500gb-pcie-gen4....
- PartiallyTyped 6y agoOh wow, Gen4 NVMes are really fast. Thanks for the link!