4 ms·

~6 hours or just above it in general seems to be the sweetspot. Most negative effects (especially broad ones like all-cause mortality) only really start showing

by Tenoke 6y ago

~6 hours or just above it in general seems to be the sweetspot. Most negative effects (especially broad ones like all-cause mortality) only really start showing up under 6 (or over 7 hours)[0]. Too bad the majority of reporting exaggerates and starts scaring people for going under 8 (and sometimes 9!) when yet again it seems like 6-7 is likely best, with very little 'loss' between 7 and 6. Just don't go much lower than that for long unless you need exceptionally less. 0. https://cdnsciencepub.com/doi/full/10.1139/apnm-2020-0034 https://cdnsciencepub.com/doi/full/10.1139/apnm-2020-0034

matwood 6y ago
Yeah, I naturally sleep around 7 hours. If I get < 6 I really notice it the next day. 6+ is a normal day. But it is weird just how much I notice going less than 6 though. Another thing that my wife hates (ie, is jealous of), is my head hits the pillow and I'm out. Also, during that 6 hour sweet spot, I can sleep through almost anything.
- serpix 6y ago
  My dad is like this. Please tell me as I am curious, do you tend to self-reflect or have a vivid inner world? I'm trying to understand how my dad does this and my current theory is that he simply does not dwell on things and runs mostly on instinct.
  - IneffablePigeon 6y ago
    Fwiw, I can also usually do this and I would consider myself a world class dweller. For me, it's about - consistent bedtime - doing as little as possible involving a screen in bed - consistent bedtime routine - consistent bedtime Screwing any of these up can quite easily cause me to start worrying about things instead of falling asleep. But I also think in part I'm just lucky and I can't really explain what causes it. I was always able to fall asleep in the car when I was younger, almost instantly. I can't fall asleep on public transport or planes at all though unless I'm really shattered.
  - matwood 6y ago
    I self reflect a lot, but don't dwell on things outside of my control. How an interaction with a co-worker went I might think about for days and even journal about, but I can't tell you what I read on HN yesterday unless it fit into something I'm working on. I exercise almost every day and have for over 20 years. It definitely helps. I do have a basic bedtime routine. I go to bed at a consistent time, but I don't avoid screens or anything. I do avoid games and any news type things when I'm winding down for bed, but will read and watch part (it's always a part b/c I'm asleep before it's over heh) of a show on my phone. Also, DnD kicks on about an hour before bed so a random work email doesn't derail me. Finally, if there is something I'm worried about I take care of it. This goes back to not dwelling on things outside of my control, and dealing with the things that are.
cinntaile 6y ago
That's not what your source says though. The consensus is less than 7 hours has adverse health outcomes and more than 9 hours has an unknown effect for most people and is beneficial for certain groups of people.
- Tenoke 6y ago
  My bad, I copied the wrong link (edited now). I meant to link to the largest systematic review I could find[0]. Instead I had linked to the US recommendation which I was initially thinking of linking for the part where most over-recommend 8-9. Relevant part: >that compared with 7 h of sleep per day, a 1-h decrease in sleep duration was associated with 6% increased risk of all-cause mortality and a 1-h increase in sleep duration was associated with a 13% increased risk of all-cause mortality (N = 241 107 adults in 43 articles). With again, the bigger effects being under 6 but even with an per-hour average the risk from 7 to 8 is higher than 7 to 6. 0. https://cdnsciencepub.com/doi/full/10.1139/apnm-2020-0034 https://cdnsciencepub.com/doi/full/10.1139/apnm-2020-0034
fulafel 6y ago
Your linked consensus statement recommends against under 7 or over 9 hours, and says 7-8 is "most favourable".
- Tenoke 6y ago
  I already edited and answered in another comment. The actual studies (especially large meta-analyses) show very good results between 6 and 7, I was just thinking of linking this for the overrecomendation of 8-9 and copied it by mistake. Though even here they try to reccomend more in the abstract than what their results suggest, so look at the actual results e.g. all-cause mortality.
balfirevic 6y ago
> Most negative effects (especially broad ones like all-cause mortality) only really start showing up under 6 Most - maybe. But one very important negative effect is that waking up without enough sleep is, quite literally, torturous.

by Tenoke 6y ago

matwood 6y ago

Yeah, I naturally sleep around 7 hours. If I get < 6 I really notice it the next day. 6+ is a normal day. But it is weird just how much I notice going less than 6 though. Another thing that my wife hates (ie, is jealous of), is my head hits the pillow and I'm out. Also, during that 6 hour sweet spot, I can sleep through almost anything.

serpix 6y ago
My dad is like this. Please tell me as I am curious, do you tend to self-reflect or have a vivid inner world? I'm trying to understand how my dad does this and my current theory is that he simply does not dwell on things and runs mostly on instinct.
- IneffablePigeon 6y ago
  Fwiw, I can also usually do this and I would consider myself a world class dweller. For me, it's about - consistent bedtime - doing as little as possible involving a screen in bed - consistent bedtime routine - consistent bedtime Screwing any of these up can quite easily cause me to start worrying about things instead of falling asleep. But I also think in part I'm just lucky and I can't really explain what causes it. I was always able to fall asleep in the car when I was younger, almost instantly. I can't fall asleep on public transport or planes at all though unless I'm really shattered.
- matwood 6y ago
  I self reflect a lot, but don't dwell on things outside of my control. How an interaction with a co-worker went I might think about for days and even journal about, but I can't tell you what I read on HN yesterday unless it fit into something I'm working on. I exercise almost every day and have for over 20 years. It definitely helps. I do have a basic bedtime routine. I go to bed at a consistent time, but I don't avoid screens or anything. I do avoid games and any news type things when I'm winding down for bed, but will read and watch part (it's always a part b/c I'm asleep before it's over heh) of a show on my phone. Also, DnD kicks on about an hour before bed so a random work email doesn't derail me. Finally, if there is something I'm worried about I take care of it. This goes back to not dwelling on things outside of my control, and dealing with the things that are.

cinntaile 6y ago

That's not what your source says though. The consensus is less than 7 hours has adverse health outcomes and more than 9 hours has an unknown effect for most people and is beneficial for certain groups of people.

Tenoke 6y ago
My bad, I copied the wrong link (edited now). I meant to link to the largest systematic review I could find[0]. Instead I had linked to the US recommendation which I was initially thinking of linking for the part where most over-recommend 8-9. Relevant part: >that compared with 7 h of sleep per day, a 1-h decrease in sleep duration was associated with 6% increased risk of all-cause mortality and a 1-h increase in sleep duration was associated with a 13% increased risk of all-cause mortality (N = 241 107 adults in 43 articles). With again, the bigger effects being under 6 but even with an per-hour average the risk from 7 to 8 is higher than 7 to 6. 0. https://cdnsciencepub.com/doi/full/10.1139/apnm-2020-0034 https://cdnsciencepub.com/doi/full/10.1139/apnm-2020-0034

fulafel 6y ago

Your linked consensus statement recommends against under 7 or over 9 hours, and says 7-8 is "most favourable".

Tenoke 6y ago
I already edited and answered in another comment. The actual studies (especially large meta-analyses) show very good results between 6 and 7, I was just thinking of linking this for the overrecomendation of 8-9 and copied it by mistake. Though even here they try to reccomend more in the abstract than what their results suggest, so look at the actual results e.g. all-cause mortality.

balfirevic 6y ago

> Most negative effects (especially broad ones like all-cause mortality) only really start showing up under 6 Most - maybe. But one very important negative effect is that waking up without enough sleep is, quite literally, torturous.