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Not to be argumentative. But yes, I did attend college. Send me a email, and I'll send you an email from my college email address (Hasn't been deactivited yet).

• klodolph 5y ago
  Not trying to argue either. Contributing to an open-source project is a very different kind of activity from being a member of a team at a company. Programming is only half the job.
• chillfox 5y ago
  The problem now is that you likely can't use either of those managers that you went over the heads of as references for future jobs (they may not say nice things).
• maroonblazer 5y ago
  When responding to a comment that asserts your writing is not strong you'd want to read, re-read, and re-re-read your reply to ensure it is well written. You seem to have not done that, which lends credence to the parent's comment. My take is you seem to have an inflated sense of your abilities. I've interviewed people who share this trait and it's a turn off unless they have a portfolio of work to back it up. Perhaps try taking a more humble approach. Ask lots of questions as to what/where they need help. If they align with your experience then share concrete examples of how you've helped others in those same situations. If you haven't, make note of the challenges and see if you can identify patterns across interviews. This would provide hints as to what skill-building you could focus on in the interim. Good luck!
  • lkm93 5y ago
    Snakedoctor's writing is fine and you sound like a pompous idiot.
  • wildermuthn 5y ago
    Good point, but snakedoctor did set this in motion by asking for candid feedback. Ostensibly, he wants to receive and integrate feedback. Seems like the sort of thing a smart kid would aim for. Part of me feels like in a decade people will reference this thread in the same way we reference the shellacking of Dropbox back in the day. It takes a cosmic-sized ego to ask HN to give you advice about why no company will accept that your cosmic-sized ego is justified. But what if the kid is right in his self-evaluation, but has enough self-awareness to critically question his self-evaluation and ask others to do the same? That’s kind of a powerful combination.
    • deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    • bad44 5y ago
      Or maybe he just kills himself because he's close to being homeless already and a few hundred assholes just told him that he's a hopeless, narcissistic, uneducated "creep"? Snakedoctor, I think this whole thread says a lot more about Hacker News and its penchant for armchair psychology and condescension than it does about you and your future prospects. There's a few helpful posts here... take what you can and go out and seize the day! I am routing for you.
      • Ecstatify 5y ago
        It's crazy how many people are unable to give constructive feedback on Hackernews.
        • p0sixlang 5y ago
          It's also crazy how many HN users think calling this guy a sociopath is constructive feedback.
• nl 5y ago
  It's interesting how focused you are on proving yourself right (I'll send you a college email etc). And that seems to be the case with going over your bosses head ("I went above my bosses head because they did not remedy the issue, and weren't going to.") Being right is great! But having a job is also great. Perhaps focus less on proving yourself right, and more on getting along with people? Edit: reading further in the thread it sounds like you went over your bosses head 2 weeks into a job? That's really not a great idea.
  • sanderjd 5y ago
    It's a really tough lesson to learn but this is absolutely true: It is not enough to be right, you must also have credibility. You usually have to accept other people being wrong about things you're right about in order to build credibility.
    • freetime2 5y ago
      > You usually have to accept other people being wrong about things you're right about in order to build credibility. I don’t think this is the correct way to look at it. Rather than accepting other people being wrong, you should be very open to the possibility that it’s you who is wrong. Always doubt your own assumptions, and be willing to change your stance when new information comes to light.
      • nl 5y ago
        I think you absolutely need to be open to being wrong about things. But that's independent to building enough credibility to be able to speak truth to power.
      • sanderjd 5y ago
        I think my quote would be better if it said "often" or "sometimes" instead of "usually". But no, I disagree with your point here, I mean, that's true too, but it's not what I was talking about. I'm saying that in order to build up a lot of credibility, you have to be right, tell people the right thing, but actually not fight them when they disagree and go a different way. If you were actually right and they were actually wrong, they will know and remember and trust you more in the future. Doing variations of this for a long time in view of a lot of people is one of the places credibility comes from. But you actually do need to pick fewer battles and let more wrong decisions go, even when you are actually right. That's part of the lesson that has to be learned when you don't have the power. It isn't enough to be right, you have to be trusted by the people who make decisions, and for that you have to build credibility.
• Animats 5y ago
  Having some code on Github is helpful when looking for a job. I see the problem. Most entry level programming jobs today either require a college degree, or they're for very low level web programming. Now, if you're competent at making basic web sites and the front end or back end of a business application, that's a saleable skill. Although one that several million other people already have. Also realize that about half the job is figuring out what the customer (your boss, probably) really wants. If you hung around a research environment, and you know a little programming, did some soldering, and know which end of a capacitor is positive, but didn't go to college, that's not really a saleable skill set any more. In 1980 it sometimes was. Useful reading: https://daedtech.com/programming-job-without-degree/ https://daedtech.com/programming-job-without-degree/
• honkycat 5y ago
  You seem driven and interested which is good. Keep contributing to open source and you'll probably land something. I still think you need to rethink your strategy though. Re: going over your bosses head: Where is your sense of self preservation? Also, why do you think nobody else will do their job? Is the fraud system YOUR problem? Then do your due diligence, mark it as someone elses problem, and let it ride. You gotta suck up to your boss a bit. Going over their head is provoking them!
• jcims 5y ago
  I can only speak to infosec roles. If that's the route you want to go I think you'll be fine once your experience and skills catch up with your demeanor and confidence. It sounds like you can be a bit of an asshole and create messes for your management, which is morally ambivalent but can interfere with your ability to collect income. I'd recommend aiming a little lower and a little smaller in the jobs you're applying for. Maybe try entry level spot at a regional bank/hospital/edu and in the interim working on skilling up in more tangible ways (e.g. bug bounties, GitHub projects and it never hurts to pick up a specialty). You have no degree so think of this as a 2-3 year plan to substitute it with experience before going for what you're after. Good luck dude. You've got some very valuable raw materials, they just need refined a bit and you'll be a beast!
• WalterBright 5y ago
  Gentle tip: writing "shouldn't of" instead "shouldn't have" is one of those critical writing misteaks one should never make when communicating with educated people. Some others worth special effort to do correctly: 1. their there they're 2. its it's 3. your you're A couple other writing tips: 1. don't terminate sentences with .. or ... 2. "bosses" is plural, I think you meant "boss's" for the possessive I know it sounds elitist, and it is, but with these kinds of mistakes their going to relegate you to the "not one of us" bin when looking for a well paying job. It's well worth the effort to purge them from you're writing.
  • ZephyrBlu 5y ago
    > misteaks Har har.
  • jcranmer 5y ago
    > writing "shouldn't of" instead "shouldn't have" For me personally, this is the #1 bugbear of writing mistakes. I'm willing to tolerate most of the other failures (especially when they're exceptionally rare), especially because several of them can crop up when you decide to change the sentence between initial mental conception and committing to paper or keyboard. > I know it sounds elitist, and it is, but with these kinds of mistakes their going to relegate you to the "not one of us" bin when looking for a well paying job. It's not so much the "not one of us" bin as it is a sense of "you clearly can't put in the effort, so why should we?" It's for similar reasons that you are advised to dress up for interviews.
    • suck-it-dang 5y ago
      > It's for similar reasons that you are advised to dress up for interviews. So, classist nonsense? Got it.
  • frman 5y ago
    their going
    • WalterBright 5y ago
• HWR_14 5y ago
  > Not to be argumentative. But yes, I did attend college. Your claim may be technically correct. I am willing to believe you did attend a college for some period of time. However, it is nonresponsive. GP was claiming that your writing does not reflect the skills in writing that you are expected to develop as a college attendee. This is understandable; dropping out during/after freshmen year does not give your writing time to progress. I care about your education because of what you learned, not because your acceptance is an excellent proxy for your SAT scores. (This is the same reason that your short stint as an IBM developer means less than you seem to believe it does.) It's not the argumentative nature of your post that would be a red flag to me, it is the complete misunderstanding of the issue being raised.
• valdiorn 5y ago
  Hi Snakedoctor. I've been quite fascinated by this thread. I have a small piece of feedback for you, as someone who's interviewed about 200-300 engineers over my career I've talked to a lot of people and feel like I have at least something of value to add. I hope you're not offering these sorts of hyperbolic "proofs" of your competency to your interviewers, like you've done here. I've seen a few comments from you like this. Anyone who feels the need to go that far out of their way to prove how smart they are... probably aren't as smart as they think they are. It also does come off as narcissistic. I get that you have accomplished some cool things in your career so far, but you have to let people evaluate those accomplishments for themselves. They may be very impressive to you, but might not make the slightest difference in the context of the role you're applying for. If people ask about them, be ready to tell. If they don't ask, don't go out of your way to point them out, they're not pertinent to the role. They're on your CV, that's enough. You do a lot of pointing these accomplishments out (I worked for IBM / I contribute to GNU / I went to college / I got this and that job), but... here you are. Unemployed. Which only leaves two possible explanations; You're either not being forthcoming about your accomplishments (exaggerating them or simply lying), or there's something else, something very negative that means that despite your achievements, you still can't hold a job. So, you have to be brutally honest with yourself and ask yourself; What is that thing? Only you can answer that question. Finally, I want to give you a reality check on those accomplishments. They might not be as large as you think. Big, noteworthy accomplishments take years to complete. Completing a masters degree, getting a PhD, working up to a senior position in a company, learning a language, raising a child, building a house. It sounds like most of your achievements did not require the investment of time, but rather are trophies to commemorate your greatness. Companies want people who persevere, and get stuff done, and stick with it. The type of accomplishments you've mentioned show none of that, and your career progression shows the complete opposite. I hope you make something constructive out of my comments, and use them to improve your approach to interview. In short, I'd recommend a more humble approach, apply for a role suitable to your level, don't try to outsmart the interviewer, or your co-workers when you get hired, and fulfill the job you've been assigned, not the one you wish you had. So no level-jumping over your bosses to make smart comments; that won't help you... I speak from experience, and it took me a long time to understand that a good employee is just someone who makes their managers life easier, by completing their tasks and making sure stuff gets done.
• ryandrake 5y ago
  There's a pretty good behavioral / soft skills interview question hanging out in your post: "Think of a scenario where you find a security vulnerability [or crasher bug, or whatever], and you don't think it is being taken as seriously as it should be. How would you handle this situaton?" There are a lot of good ways to approach this, but "escalate it to the SVP" is rarely one of them.