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The challenge with automotive parts is reliability and performance over extended temperature and humidity range. This is not necessarily something you are just
by mmmBacon 6y ago
The challenge with automotive parts is reliability and performance over extended temperature and humidity range.
This is not necessarily something you are just good at because you already produce semis.
- mc32 6y agoSo if those who make semis for the military have capacity, then they can make them for the automotive industry.
- moftz 6y agoIt goes consumer grade, automotive, military, and then you have levels above that meant for things like space and down-hole oil drilling. Automotive is certainly a step up above consumer grade but it's not like Intel is throwing an i7 into a car. They are going to just offer fab capacity to anyone that can build on the various technologies that can be built at Intel's fabs.
- mmmBacon 6y agoThis is not really true. Firstly, the volume for automotive is much higher. 2nd the cost structure is entirely different and a business set up for high cost low volume military parts may not be competitive in automotive with low cost.
- mc32 6y agoI think ramp up is more the issue. The cost of idling plants and ceding market share outweighs any added component cost (within reason).
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- kevin_thibedeau 6y agoIt's something Intel used to be good at until they dismantled all of their other chip lines in the 90's and 00's.
- olyjohn 6y agoMy 1989 Honda has an Intel chip that powers the ECU. They have been in millions of cars, so I would say they probably have some knowledge buried somewhere in the company.
- chasil 6y agoAs I understand the problem: Auto manufacturers need 380nm production lines. They unwisely canceled all their orders for >6 months. Their suppliers mothballed all these antiquated facilities. Maybe Intel can make money with this. It will be interesting to see.
- wyldfire 6y ago> They unwisely canceled all their orders for >6 months. These guys hate inventory with a raging passion.
- Guest42 6y agoThat’s one thing I noticed in aerospace. The executives would far sooner run out of parts and have very expensive delays in order to hit turnover targets than to have a 2 month buffer to handle demand surges or scheduling variability. Then they’d leave for similar roles at bigger companies.
- throwaway2048 6y agoThat's a plague amongst modern management and corporate operations, you return amazing numbers by cutting all your inventory and production slack and it works fantastically, until a slight hiccup occurs and it fucks your production for years to come. But that is the next guy's problem, not yours. Efficiency and Robustness are very often a tradeoff, the more efficient you are, the more prone your entire operation is to minor disruptions. Something akin to overfitting in machine learning. Also something to consider is what happens when the entire economy is forced in that direction, where you either cut everything to the bone for the sake of efficiency, or go out of business due to competition.
- GlennS 6y agoThere's also the issue that it's much easier to do quality control when you're receiving your supplies Just In Time. The longer the lag between producing a faulty part and trying to use it, the harder to diagnose the problem. The analogous software problem is probably having database backups sitting around without regularly testing if you can successfully restore from them.
- chubs 6y agoAutomotive ECUs solve the humidity problem by putting the boards in a pot of epoxy (talk about overkill!), and as for reliability, all my ancient computers still work just fine, the only things that ever die seems to be the capacitors or leaky CMOS batteries, i'd be happy to buy a car with an intel xeon (ECC PLEASE!) as the ECU.
- aledalgrande 6y agoSo what you're saying is that the die doesn't die? Sorry, bad pun, Monday night...
- tempestn 6y agoDesktop computers, or even servers, don't need to handle anything like the heat, cold, or vibration that cars are subjected to though.
- amluto 6y ago> intel xeon (ECC PLEASE!) as the ECU. LOL. Any code that relies on fast interrupts is a lost cause on x86. A 32 MHz ECU may dramatically faster at interrupts that a top of the line Xeon :) The power consumption of a pile of Xeons will add up fast, too.
- chubs 6y agoNo kidding! I was not aware :)
- SavantIdiot 6y agoIntel made military versions of their semiconductors for three decades (inclluding the 386). Rad hardening anyone? (In fact, alpha strikes are part of their low-voltage memory QR statistics). Military is far more robust than automotive. There is probably still enough tribal knowledge there to call back on. Maybe. They might have all retired or died.
- vzidex 6y agoMilitary is still a major customer, at least for their FPGA division (Altera). Probably still enough smart people kicking around to make it work.
- mmmBacon 6y agoAutomotive is actually quite reliable and military spec parts are often automotive rated parts that have additional testing and/or slightly different packaging. The military has been using automotive grade parts to reduce costs where possible. https://www.dla.mil/Portals/104/Documents/LandAndMaritime/V/VA/PSMC/Spring%2017/LM_Automotive%20Electronic%20Parts%20for%20Military%20Applications_Spring%202017%20PSMC170526.pdf https://www.dla.mil/Portals/104/Documents/LandAndMaritime/V/...
- CivBase 6y agoNo worries! With how long it has taken them to move past 10nm, Intel has become quite adept at making CPUs run in extremely high temps. I couldn't resist. The joke was just too easy.
- qznc 6y agoIntel is already producing for automotive with the Denverton chip.