8 ms·
Would like to know if non Facebook users are included because Facebook has non Facebook user's phone numbers due to the fact that Whatsapp uploads the entire ph
by I_am_tiberius 6y ago
Would like to know if non Facebook users are included because Facebook has non Facebook user's phone numbers due to the fact that Whatsapp uploads the entire phonebook to Whatsapp. That means Facebook is likely to know your phone number although you don't use Facebook or Whatsapp.
- hourislate 6y agoIt's sick that they are allowed to get away with this. It's basically a botnet stealing information.
- macintux 6y agoEvery time someone argues that people can avoid the privacy problems of Facebook by simply not using it, I point out this issue (plus the shadow accounts).
- Guest42 6y agoI recently purchased a phone that had the Facebook app preinstalled. If I had to guess, the mere act of connecting to WiFi caused a whole slew of info to get sent.
- reddotX 6y agoFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU
- macintux 6y agoI would think not, but my cluefulness regarding Android security/privacy is effectively nil.
- Guest42 6y agoI didn’t check what permissions it was given by default but hopefully not too many and with those not much spying. It would be nice to have a clear map of what data can be obtained with what permissions.
- timhigins 6y agoActually Android devices (especially older ones) are known for in many cases sending extensive data to the manufacturer on network connect. See for example: https://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/16/us/politics/china-phones-software-security.html https://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/16/us/politics/china-phones-..., https://balagetech.com/android-app-phones-home-china/ https://balagetech.com/android-app-phones-home-china/
- drewmol 6y agoObligatory mention: mbasic.facebook.com it's like a clean needle exchange for Facebook.
- Guest42 6y agoThat's nice. I deleted my fb but sometimes groups will require it for events and discussion boards.
- lostlogin 6y agoThere was a dark phase when it looked as if the only way to sign up for various services was going to be Facebook. If memory serves, there was a time when Spotify sign up required Facebook.
- matheusmoreira 6y agoThe difference between malware and "legitimate" software is whether there's a "legitimate" company behind it and whether that company has a "legitimate" interest in the information. Sad but that's how it is. Just like how governments give themselves the right to crack computer security and surveil everyone but throw citizens in jail if they do the same thing.
- tpush 6y agoWhatsapp doesn't share phone book data with Facebook.
- solarkraft 6y agoYet. And since it's a Facebook controlled company a leak like this happening again isn't that improbable.
- darig 6y agoFacebook doesn't share phone book data with hackers either.
- spinny 6y agoJust like Kelly Loeffler didn't share any info with her portfolio manager
- Nextgrid 6y agoIt claims not to, which isn't a guarantee. After all, they also claimed not to use phone numbers given to them for 2FA for anything else, and yet ended up using them for ad targeting.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- superjan 6y agoHi, how do you know? It is of personal interest to me as I don’t use FB but do use WhatsApp. It may also reduce the piling of downvoters.
- tpush 6y agoHere's the source: https://www.spiegel.de/international/business/whatsapp-ceo-on-the-controversy-surrounding-proposed-german-communications-laws-a-2e6f4c52-4a39-4117-8199-1606e1f3ac87 https://www.spiegel.de/international/business/whatsapp-ceo-o... Quote: "Cathcart: It’s true that we do have some information about how people use WhatsApp and that we do know, for example, the device ID. We collect this only to secure our services and protect from attacks. When you use WhatsApp and allow access to your phone book, we only see the phone numbers, not the name. DER SPIEGEL: Do you share these numbers with your parent company Facebook? Cathcart: No, we don’t. The updated privacy policies will actually not change anything globally in our ability to share data with Facebook."
- zerof1l 6y agoI have WhatsApp and you can deny access to your phonebook. Everything works just fine
- luckylion 6y agoOthers can still allow access to their phone book and the information stored in them about you will be transmitted and saved at Facebook, won't it? Is there a way to disable that?
- rvz 6y ago> Is there a way to disable that? No.
- godelski 6y agoExactly this. I recently started a twitter for my academic career. Didn't share my contacts or anything (I only follow academic twitter too). I get tons of suggestions of people I know and several have followed me. The information is from their contact list because twitter knows my number and connected us. There's a clear benefit to this, but there's also privacy concerns too. The lack of control over this is what is concerning.
- croes 6y agoYou need an account to ask FB to delete your data.
- IG_Semmelweiss 6y agoHow are you able to send whatsapps to people you don't have a prior conversation with ? I am doing the same boat...and was working fine until i lost & replaced my old phone. All conversations were lost, and this makes it challenging to use whatsapp for any non-group conversations (since I can't start any).
- TrianguloY 6y agoYou can start a conversation with any WhatsApp number by opening the url wa.me/number. The number must include the country prefix. There are also some apps and webpages that helps with this process (Disclaimer: I'm the author of one of them for Android [0]) [0] https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.trianguloy.openInWhatsapp https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.trianguloy...
- 153791098c 6y agoIt goes so much further than this and it is absolutely frighting. The following sketched situations applies if you don't use Facebook at ALL. 99+% of every single person you meet has either FB, IG or WA installed on their phones and shares their phonebooks with them (assuming you live in [insert western country here]). There is also a very big chance at least some have your full name and address in their phonebook. Facebook not only knows who you are, but also who you are in contact with, when you meet new people and who they are. They also collect phone and text records with their apps so they also know the frequency that you have contact with them and they can even read the content of text messages (most people these permissions to the apps because it will automatically verify the associated phone number). Add all the location data, ssid/mac address collection and countless of other datapoints to it and they can draw out your entire life even when you don't use anything from facebook. There is no escape.
- djhn 6y agoAs a counterpoint I can think of dozens of personal acquaintances who are happily non-users and never interact with Facebook properties (retirees not into tech, busy executives, to cool for Facebook hipsters). If your country or social circle doesn't use WhatsApp, Facebook itself is already dying and Instagram is getting their lunch eaten by Tiktok.
- ZephyrBlu 6y agoFBs revenue growth doesn't agree with this perspective: https://twitter.com/JonErlichman/status/1354536238104064005 https://twitter.com/JonErlichman/status/1354536238104064005
- djhn 6y agoThat is a very good point. But usually changes in revenue trail changes in adoption and/or engagement. Both when growing, and when slowing down.
- Clewza313 6y ago> If your country or social circle doesn't use WhatsApp Aside from China, Japan and Korea, do such countries exist?
- dheera 6y agoThis is why I don't use my real phone number with apps and HATE apps using phone numbers as a proxy for a user id. Get a virtual phone number if any service requires a phone number from you. Don't submit to this nonsense.
- afinlayson 6y agoIt's not about the information you give, it's all those friends and family who signed up for it and uploaded their address book... They now have your phone number and email probably your date of birth, and even some photos of you. They are like the credit companies, they have information on you whether you allow them to or not.
- techmagus 6y agoExactly. People who save your details in their Address Book and click the "Sync your Contacts" when an app suggests it, are the loophole in privacy and security. The only way is to have a separate set of email, phone numbers, for those family and friends who doesn't care about privacy and security, that way it is easy to dispose those information later. Beyond that … if we truly want to avoid it … the only course of action is to not give them anything at all. Not a single email, not a single phone number, not even our home addresses.
- wyclif 6y agoThat is exactly how I deal with it. I use a throwaway webmail address and a Google Voice number. No way they're getting my real email or phone number that I use for work and clients.
- InternetUser 6y agoYou're not avoiding having a shadow account created about you though, once I've upload my contact list and you're right there, Jim Wyclif, with your real phone number, and I've also tagged you in a photo we took together last year. And then there are all the other people who have your real phone number and who have been on Facebook, Messgenger, Instagram, or WhatsApp since they saved the number. And then there's even relatives and former classmates and co-workers who've looked up your name and typed in your town, school, and/or former company to find you. When I use Facebook, it still recommends former classmates and acquaintances who I literally looked up once ever. (As a side-note, Snapchat does the same type of things; people I've worked for in the past, as a tutor, are recommended to me on the "Add Friends" page.)
- lostlogin 6y agoI don’t use Facebook or their other apps (eg WhatsApp). Facebook has my email address as I used to get regular invites to sign up. Facebook also knows what I look like from friends tagging me in pictures, and seems knows my date of birth as people tell me that they were notified by Facebook. So even if you have avoided all their stuff, you aren’t immune.
- wrycoder 6y agohttps://kieranhealy.org/blog/archives/2013/06/09/using-metadata-to-find-paul-revere/ https://kieranhealy.org/blog/archives/2013/06/09/using-metad...
- gwid0n 6y agoAnecdata: I've never provided my phone number to FB, I provided it to Messenger App and Whatsapp, it's not on in the file for my country.
- coatmatter 6y agoYeah, I feel Messenger or WhatsApp doesn't really come into play here. Facebook has at least two different privacy settings when it comes to phone numbers and how it's shown to people: 1. At https://www.facebook.com/USERNAME/about_contact_and_basic_info https://www.facebook.com/USERNAME/about_contact_and_basic_in... - there's a contact info section where one can fill in a phone number (among other details) and set the visibility to Public/Friends/Friends except <group>/Only me/Custom/custom lists. 2. And https://www.facebook.com/settings?tab=privacy https://www.facebook.com/settings?tab=privacy - there's a "How people can find and contact you" section that covers "Who can look you up using the phone number you provided?" with options of Everyone/Friends of Friends/Friends/Only me. I imagine it'd be very easy to select the wrong thing during setup due to the overwhelming number of things to read and click. I suspect those who have set the latter, or both options to "Everyone" will most likely be in the "free" data dump (except perhaps for most Australian Facebook users, for now). I feel the second setting is riskier, especially if you don't want employers or colleagues to be able to simply look you up on Facebook by phone number. For example, I could hypothetically display my phone number to "Everyone" on an incognito profile and no one should be able to just wander by and spot my profile and immediately figure out who I am (assuming this profile doesn't somehow get suggested to "Friends you might know" - big assumption, yes; but this would depend on how I complete my profile). Regardless, either one or both set to "Everyone" is a recipe for disaster. I believe more people would have allowed number searching compared to those who just have their phones displayed to everyone on their contact info sections. In effect, it's a bit of a reverse phone book, plus extra.
- MichaelMoser123 6y agoit just occured to me that the data from the leak could be used to test if they are in compliance with the Gdpr, Now in the event that it turns out that they don't follow the rules, could this leak be used as evidence in court?