4 ms·

After a year working remotely, I don't think I'd be willing to go back to working fully (or even primarily) in the office. I could do a day here or there for t

After a year working remotely, I don't think I'd be willing to go back to working fully (or even primarily) in the office. I could do a day here or there for team-building activities or major meetings, but that's pretty much the extent I'd be willing to do. Granted, this is based on having a 40-minutes train commute (each way, so 80 minutes/day), but unless I could have a 10 minute walk or bike commute I don't think my opinion would materially change, and that's pretty unlikely where I live due to downtown property/rent prices (Tokyo).

izacus 6y ago
I wonder how many people's opinions will change after a longer time. I wrote the exact same type of posts five years ago when I started my first fully remote job. After two years or so I had to look for an office because the isolation is just murderous and it takes a long amount of time to actually start showing its teeth.
- mewse 6y ago
  I can highly recommend renting a co-working space once that's a viable option wherever you are in the world. These can be surprisingly inexpensive and often come with internet, electricity, etc. included. Gives both the "short commute" benefit of work-from-home, as well as the "maintaining a clear separation between home and work" benefit of on-location-work. And for me personally (as an introvert), it was fantastic to have people around that I could talk to socially, but who weren't directly involved in my work and who weren't going to make demands of me. Totally removed the feelings of isolation, and formed a bunch of new friendships that didn't rest on obligations to my employer.
  - izacus 6y ago
    Yep, this was my solution as well, it worked great (especially since I shared the space with people I mostly knew). Although now that I'm working for a company with 15min commute, that became less of an issue.
  - nullsense 6y ago
    So in the end the solution is to go to a fake office.
  - gfxgirl 6y ago
    Didn't work for me. The fact that we work on the same thing gives me more reasons to talk. I can't ask random people at a co-working space to help me debug an issue or to brainstorm a solution. They aren't familiar with my project the way co-workers would be. They also are not NDAed to look at what I'm working on
    - ficklepickle 6y ago
      I don't understand. I work remotely and regularly debug issues and brainstorm solutions with my teammates. Their physical proximity is not relevant. Clearly I am missing something.
      - gfxgirl 6y ago
        You're missing that the point of being around people for some of us is to "interact" with them. I can easily interact with co-workers. I can not easily interact with strangers at a co-working space. Also I work on console games. I can't hand the person on the chat the controller and say "how does this feel?"
      - dimmke 6y ago
        It's nice to work on a problem with someone and then go to lunch and shoot the shit afterwards. Or just hanging out drinking some coffee. The key is you have to have some coworkers you like though, which I'll allow that not everybody has. For me, I've worked in full remote and full in office jobs. I favor a mix personally. Maybe 2-3 days in office and the rest remote.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
- chii 6y ago
  > isolation is just murderous and it takes a long amount of time to actually start showing its teeth. i wonder if people who feel this way aren't getting socializing done outside of work, and is using work as a form of socialization?
  - codeyperson 6y ago
    Nothing wrong with socialising at work. If you’re spending a third of your day working, it may as well be enjoyable.
- Valkhyr 6y ago
  I recognize that situations and preferences can change, yes. But it would have to be a pretty significant change for me to outweigh 80 minutes on a crowded Tokyo subway, particularly in summer. FWIW, before the pandemic started, I was not enthusiastic at all about WFH, for various reasons but mostly because I live in a small one room apartment (quite usual here in the inner city in Tokyo). Now, after addressing basic issues to improve the ergonomics of my home office, most of the downsides are gone, and those that remain are outweighed by the prospect of commuting again. Of course, this could easily change if I moved closer to the office (or switched jobs to be physically closer), but considering rent close to the typical business hubs here, that's unattractive financially. As for isolation: personally, I do a lot of pair programming (whether in the office or remotely), so I don't actually feel isolated at all. If would describe myself as mildly introvert, so YMMV, but I feel like I need to disconnect from people after a day of remote work no more or less than after a regular day at the office.
delfaras 6y ago
I have a ~ 10 minutes walk commute to work and event I share your opinion, I wouldn't want to go back to the office either I used to work remotely for a different continent + 9 hours diff timezone and that was as painful as it can get: different hours for meetings, not knowing anything about my coworkers was really exhausting But with the ability to go back to the office only when I need to and focus on my work much better at home, I don't think I'd ever want to go back anytime soon
- Valkhyr 6y ago
  Yeah, even if I could walk to the office I'd probably still split my time. But it would be a best of both worlds scenario for me :-)
globular-toast 6y ago
Yep. When I look for my next job, remote working will be at the top of my list of priorities. I am not willing to work primarily at an office. Covid has been great in forcing companies to figure out working for home infrastructure, though, so I don't foresee this being a problem.
arwhatever 6y ago
I've worked directly across the street from where I live on a couple of occasions, and even that prevents you from being able to travel to another location to work (remotely), just for the sake of enjoying some other location. Makes me realize that butts-in-seats vs. commute distance are equally valid, but somewhat separate considerations.

izacus 6y ago

I wonder how many people's opinions will change after a longer time. I wrote the exact same type of posts five years ago when I started my first fully remote job. After two years or so I had to look for an office because the isolation is just murderous and it takes a long amount of time to actually start showing its teeth.

mewse 6y ago
I can highly recommend renting a co-working space once that's a viable option wherever you are in the world. These can be surprisingly inexpensive and often come with internet, electricity, etc. included. Gives both the "short commute" benefit of work-from-home, as well as the "maintaining a clear separation between home and work" benefit of on-location-work. And for me personally (as an introvert), it was fantastic to have people around that I could talk to socially, but who weren't directly involved in my work and who weren't going to make demands of me. Totally removed the feelings of isolation, and formed a bunch of new friendships that didn't rest on obligations to my employer.
- izacus 6y ago
  Yep, this was my solution as well, it worked great (especially since I shared the space with people I mostly knew). Although now that I'm working for a company with 15min commute, that became less of an issue.
- nullsense 6y ago
  So in the end the solution is to go to a fake office.
- gfxgirl 6y ago
  Didn't work for me. The fact that we work on the same thing gives me more reasons to talk. I can't ask random people at a co-working space to help me debug an issue or to brainstorm a solution. They aren't familiar with my project the way co-workers would be. They also are not NDAed to look at what I'm working on
  - ficklepickle 6y ago
    I don't understand. I work remotely and regularly debug issues and brainstorm solutions with my teammates. Their physical proximity is not relevant. Clearly I am missing something.
    - gfxgirl 6y ago
      You're missing that the point of being around people for some of us is to "interact" with them. I can easily interact with co-workers. I can not easily interact with strangers at a co-working space. Also I work on console games. I can't hand the person on the chat the controller and say "how does this feel?"
    - dimmke 6y ago
      It's nice to work on a problem with someone and then go to lunch and shoot the shit afterwards. Or just hanging out drinking some coffee. The key is you have to have some coworkers you like though, which I'll allow that not everybody has. For me, I've worked in full remote and full in office jobs. I favor a mix personally. Maybe 2-3 days in office and the rest remote.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
chii 6y ago
> isolation is just murderous and it takes a long amount of time to actually start showing its teeth. i wonder if people who feel this way aren't getting socializing done outside of work, and is using work as a form of socialization?
- codeyperson 6y ago
  Nothing wrong with socialising at work. If you’re spending a third of your day working, it may as well be enjoyable.
Valkhyr 6y ago
I recognize that situations and preferences can change, yes. But it would have to be a pretty significant change for me to outweigh 80 minutes on a crowded Tokyo subway, particularly in summer. FWIW, before the pandemic started, I was not enthusiastic at all about WFH, for various reasons but mostly because I live in a small one room apartment (quite usual here in the inner city in Tokyo). Now, after addressing basic issues to improve the ergonomics of my home office, most of the downsides are gone, and those that remain are outweighed by the prospect of commuting again. Of course, this could easily change if I moved closer to the office (or switched jobs to be physically closer), but considering rent close to the typical business hubs here, that's unattractive financially. As for isolation: personally, I do a lot of pair programming (whether in the office or remotely), so I don't actually feel isolated at all. If would describe myself as mildly introvert, so YMMV, but I feel like I need to disconnect from people after a day of remote work no more or less than after a regular day at the office.

delfaras 6y ago

I have a ~ 10 minutes walk commute to work and event I share your opinion, I wouldn't want to go back to the office either I used to work remotely for a different continent + 9 hours diff timezone and that was as painful as it can get: different hours for meetings, not knowing anything about my coworkers was really exhausting But with the ability to go back to the office only when I need to and focus on my work much better at home, I don't think I'd ever want to go back anytime soon

Valkhyr 6y ago
Yeah, even if I could walk to the office I'd probably still split my time. But it would be a best of both worlds scenario for me :-)

globular-toast 6y ago

Yep. When I look for my next job, remote working will be at the top of my list of priorities. I am not willing to work primarily at an office. Covid has been great in forcing companies to figure out working for home infrastructure, though, so I don't foresee this being a problem.

arwhatever 6y ago

I've worked directly across the street from where I live on a couple of occasions, and even that prevents you from being able to travel to another location to work (remotely), just for the sake of enjoying some other location. Makes me realize that butts-in-seats vs. commute distance are equally valid, but somewhat separate considerations.