8 ms·

What I learned living in a trailer in the Utah desert for two decades

126 points by ProAm 6y ago

bbarnett 6y ago
Not a bad read.
rhn_mk1 6y ago
Off-topic, but I dig the blocky style of pictures served when JS is disabled: https://www.outsideonline.com/sites/default/files/styles/img_1400x800-low-quality/public/2021/03/22/mark-sundeen-shinglewide-1_h.jpg https://www.outsideonline.com/sites/default/files/styles/img... I'm curious what compression settings they come from.
- zimpenfish 6y ago
  I can get pretty close using JPEG quality 5. djpeg mark-sundeen-shinglewide-1_h.jpg | cjpeg -q 5 > test.jpg
midasuni 6y ago
> One guy mounted his handgun on the gas tank of his motorcycle, where it could be seen by a cop. “They treat you with respect when they see you’re packing,” he said. No prizes for guessing he’s not black.
- gambiting 6y ago
  Also it's absurd, it's like reading something from the Mad Max universe.
  - senectus1 6y ago
    honestly, I see pretty much all of America like that. Its not a country I'd feel safe visiting.
    - adrianN 6y ago
      It's a pretty big country, it's probably wrong to generalize like that.
      - senectus1 6y ago
        probably, but from the outside looking in its what i see. I don't get that feeling from most other 1st world countries. hell, I've been through a few south American countries like Argentina and Ecuador without any real concerns. America as a whole seems to have values that just dont sit comfortably with me. Understand the issue about generalizing. Doesn't change my gut feels though.
        stoolpigeon 6y ago
        When I moved from the US to Hungary it took a year maybe for me to really relax and realize for the first time how much stress I'd been carrying - all around guns. If you had tried to talk to me about it before I had lived here I would have told you that you were crazy and that the US is really safe. And in a lot of ways it is safe, but the emotional reaction is legitimate and completely understandable. The first time we took our kids back, one night we were out front of the house we were staying in. A truck drove by on the street and the girls kind of huddled together. I said, "What's wrong?" They said, "We don't want to get shot." When you live in an environment where the idea of just any random person having and using a gun is close to unthinkable, shifting to an environment where anyone could have and use a gun at any time is stressful.
        refurb 6y ago
        https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/3/24/coronavirus-triggers-panic-buying-of-guns-in-hungary https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/3/24/coronavirus-trigger... “ “We are selling five times as much as in a normal March,” said Gabor Vass, who runs three gun shops in the Hungarian capital, including the one where Rostas bought his gas pistol.”
        6y ago
  - Cthulhu_ 6y ago
    "a trailer in the desert in Utah" probably amplifies that feeling.
  - throwaway0a5e 6y ago
    Trying to pack heat and be on the right side of the law on a motorcycle/bike/ATV results in some really weird stuff because of distinctions between open carry and concealed carry and the surrounding case law and relevant state laws.
    - gambiting 6y ago
      Well that's wasn't even a comment about gun laws or anything like that, just that kind of "raw" mentality of "I need to display a weapon on my motorcycle openly to be respected" is straight out of Mad Max, where cars and motorcycles are adorned with weapons and spikes to strike fear and respect in your enemies. At least that's how I read it.
imwillofficial 6y ago
Pretty bad writing, finished it, wouldn’t recommend.
transfire 6y ago
A wonderful read. Thank you.
ahartmetz 6y ago
Hm, this is interesting and a little unsatisfying. The guy can't seem to let go of the idea of being a particular kind of character and it's aggravating to watch him acting how he thinks that kind of character should act. Or, you know, write. Tersely. In the desert. In a trailer. $300 a month. A little more classical literary touch really wouldn't hurt here.
- profunctor 6y ago
  Don't you think that's the point? His writing is an act, his life is an act. Although he eventually became what he acted. That is how he writes and that is how he lives.
  - ahartmetz 6y ago
    It may be the point but it makes me feel about it how I described.
    - ProAm 6y ago
      I think that's a big part of the story. it was aggravating to himself as well. A bit long form coming of age story, but I think it was genuine.
throwaway2a02 6y ago
I was looking for more practical tips and challenges related to alternative housing but most of the article is about the author's love life. So the title is a bit misleading IMO. For me, it wasn't really worth the read.
- AdrianB1 6y ago
  It is more about literature than his bio. I like it, even if I find it very sad.
profunctor 6y ago
I really enjoyed this.
bigbizisverywyz 6y ago
When I read that Slim had hitched 200 miles just to be with him and snuggle up in his be I knew he wouldn't appreciate it and he'd let her down. I wasn't wrong.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
m-i-l 6y ago
Slightly off topic, but I was listening to a piece of music[0] yesterday which starts with a sample of someone saying "I knew these people. These two people." followed by another voice repeating this, over and over, becoming increasingly manic towards end. And today I read this story, and find that "I knew these people. These two people." is from the film "Paris, Texas". Odd co-incidence, although I'm sure there's a perfectly rational explanation involving probability and so on, rather than any deeper significance. [0] Red Soil, by Teeth of the Sea
- rrrrrrrrrrrryan 6y ago
  > a perfectly rational explanation involving probability Baader–Meinhof phenomenon is probably the closest formal explanation: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baader%E2%80%93Meinhof%20phenomenon https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baader%E2%80%93Meinhof%20pheno...
afpx 6y ago
"Now 26, I moved back to L.A. to publish a magazine and go to grad school and write a book ..." I'm embarrassed to be a little jealous. I grew up in a similar place, albeit more like "Trailer park boys" and "Gummo" than a romantic western. And, the best outcome one'd hope for a school's valedictorian is to not die of opioids or poor health before they're 26. Anyway, I'd love to read similar types of stories from other countries. For instance, how about a Chinese boy who abandons his studies at Peking University in Beijing to move to Xinjiang and back again. Is there such a thing?
- burntoutfire 6y ago
  The US may be one of the places which make it uniquely easy and attractive. There are ways to make decent money without maintaining a career if you're not afraid of hard work (fishing boats in Alaska etc.) and also there are places which are dirt cheap with good climate, so that you can live in a shack and not freeze in winter or spend a fortune on cooking. If I were to try to do it in Poland, I see at least a couple obstacles: - the country is relatively densely populated. It's not easy to get a dirt-cheap place where you can settle (legally). Also, the construction code is strict so it's very hard to go low budget by doing unconventional things (like living in a yurt etc.) - the winters make a lot of those unconventional solutions less applicable anyway - you need a decent heat source and a house that has some level of insulation - Manual labor doesn't pay too well and you work with alcoholics and people with terrible personalities. Although arguably, after joining the EU, you can go for temp jobs in EU countries and make money that will last you for months of frugal living in a Polish village - the people in the countryside are often backwards, alcoholics and have a mentality of a serf (Poland had serfdom until mid XIX-century, and also the Communism treated people like serfs, so a lot of people exhibit traits of learned helplessness, have no initiative and expect to be taken care of by some institution - when it doesn't happen, they just get bitter and complain, but are unable to take any initiative). They're the opposite of the rugged, self-reliant American farmers, and would unfortunately make for a poor company or even neighbors - e.g. expect them to steal stuff from you.
  - vagrantJin 6y ago
    > They're the opposite of the rugged, self-reliant American farmers To be a farmer you must have money, land, equipment, likely history of family farmers, technical agricultural know how, a government that protects and promotes your farm. Oh also old farming lobbies to twist the legislatures arm and a Government that uses their trade/military clout to push your products into developing countries - which the WTO seems not to care about. If Polish people dont have these things readily available, I guess yiur statement about them might be a tad harsh.
lioeters 6y ago
Thanks for posting this link - I resonated with the writing and his experiences. The story brought back memories of my own wandering days, struggles learning to love, the American land and people I met along the way. There were real feelings and insight in his words, like listening to a weather-worn man telling his life story by a camp fire. Here are some books by Mark Sundeen: - The Unsettlers: In Search of the Good Life in Today's America (2017) - The Man Who Quit Money (2012) - North by Northwestern: A Seafaring Family on Deadly Alaskan Waters (2011)
thorn 6y ago
Very engaging style of story telling here. I could try to explain this good writing, but I just recommend to read it. It is truly a good piece.

126 points by ProAm 6y ago

Not a bad read.

Off-topic, but I dig the blocky style of pictures served when JS is disabled: https://www.outsideonline.com/sites/default/files/styles/img_1400x800-low-quality/public/2021/03/22/mark-sundeen-shinglewide-1_h.jpg https://www.outsideonline.com/sites/default/files/styles/img... I'm curious what compression settings they come from.

zimpenfish 6y ago
I can get pretty close using JPEG quality 5. djpeg mark-sundeen-shinglewide-1_h.jpg | cjpeg -q 5 > test.jpg

midasuni 6y ago

> One guy mounted his handgun on the gas tank of his motorcycle, where it could be seen by a cop. “They treat you with respect when they see you’re packing,” he said. No prizes for guessing he’s not black.

gambiting 6y ago
Also it's absurd, it's like reading something from the Mad Max universe.
- senectus1 6y ago
  honestly, I see pretty much all of America like that. Its not a country I'd feel safe visiting.
  - adrianN 6y ago
    It's a pretty big country, it's probably wrong to generalize like that.
    - senectus1 6y ago
      probably, but from the outside looking in its what i see. I don't get that feeling from most other 1st world countries. hell, I've been through a few south American countries like Argentina and Ecuador without any real concerns. America as a whole seems to have values that just dont sit comfortably with me. Understand the issue about generalizing. Doesn't change my gut feels though.
      - stoolpigeon 6y ago
        When I moved from the US to Hungary it took a year maybe for me to really relax and realize for the first time how much stress I'd been carrying - all around guns. If you had tried to talk to me about it before I had lived here I would have told you that you were crazy and that the US is really safe. And in a lot of ways it is safe, but the emotional reaction is legitimate and completely understandable. The first time we took our kids back, one night we were out front of the house we were staying in. A truck drove by on the street and the girls kind of huddled together. I said, "What's wrong?" They said, "We don't want to get shot." When you live in an environment where the idea of just any random person having and using a gun is close to unthinkable, shifting to an environment where anyone could have and use a gun at any time is stressful.
        refurb 6y ago
        https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/3/24/coronavirus-triggers-panic-buying-of-guns-in-hungary https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/3/24/coronavirus-trigger... “ “We are selling five times as much as in a normal March,” said Gabor Vass, who runs three gun shops in the Hungarian capital, including the one where Rostas bought his gas pistol.”
        6y ago
- Cthulhu_ 6y ago
  "a trailer in the desert in Utah" probably amplifies that feeling.
- throwaway0a5e 6y ago
  Trying to pack heat and be on the right side of the law on a motorcycle/bike/ATV results in some really weird stuff because of distinctions between open carry and concealed carry and the surrounding case law and relevant state laws.
  - gambiting 6y ago
    Well that's wasn't even a comment about gun laws or anything like that, just that kind of "raw" mentality of "I need to display a weapon on my motorcycle openly to be respected" is straight out of Mad Max, where cars and motorcycles are adorned with weapons and spikes to strike fear and respect in your enemies. At least that's how I read it.

imwillofficial 6y ago

Pretty bad writing, finished it, wouldn’t recommend.

transfire 6y ago

A wonderful read. Thank you.

ahartmetz 6y ago

Hm, this is interesting and a little unsatisfying. The guy can't seem to let go of the idea of being a particular kind of character and it's aggravating to watch him acting how he thinks that kind of character should act. Or, you know, write. Tersely. In the desert. In a trailer. $300 a month. A little more classical literary touch really wouldn't hurt here.

profunctor 6y ago
Don't you think that's the point? His writing is an act, his life is an act. Although he eventually became what he acted. That is how he writes and that is how he lives.
- ahartmetz 6y ago
  It may be the point but it makes me feel about it how I described.
  - ProAm 6y ago
    I think that's a big part of the story. it was aggravating to himself as well. A bit long form coming of age story, but I think it was genuine.

throwaway2a02 6y ago

I was looking for more practical tips and challenges related to alternative housing but most of the article is about the author's love life. So the title is a bit misleading IMO. For me, it wasn't really worth the read.

AdrianB1 6y ago
It is more about literature than his bio. I like it, even if I find it very sad.

profunctor 6y ago

I really enjoyed this.

bigbizisverywyz 6y ago

When I read that Slim had hitched 200 miles just to be with him and snuggle up in his be I knew he wouldn't appreciate it and he'd let her down. I wasn't wrong.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

m-i-l 6y ago

Slightly off topic, but I was listening to a piece of music[0] yesterday which starts with a sample of someone saying "I knew these people. These two people." followed by another voice repeating this, over and over, becoming increasingly manic towards end. And today I read this story, and find that "I knew these people. These two people." is from the film "Paris, Texas". Odd co-incidence, although I'm sure there's a perfectly rational explanation involving probability and so on, rather than any deeper significance. [0] Red Soil, by Teeth of the Sea

rrrrrrrrrrrryan 6y ago
> a perfectly rational explanation involving probability Baader–Meinhof phenomenon is probably the closest formal explanation: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baader%E2%80%93Meinhof%20phenomenon https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baader%E2%80%93Meinhof%20pheno...

afpx 6y ago

"Now 26, I moved back to L.A. to publish a magazine and go to grad school and write a book ..." I'm embarrassed to be a little jealous. I grew up in a similar place, albeit more like "Trailer park boys" and "Gummo" than a romantic western. And, the best outcome one'd hope for a school's valedictorian is to not die of opioids or poor health before they're 26. Anyway, I'd love to read similar types of stories from other countries. For instance, how about a Chinese boy who abandons his studies at Peking University in Beijing to move to Xinjiang and back again. Is there such a thing?

burntoutfire 6y ago
The US may be one of the places which make it uniquely easy and attractive. There are ways to make decent money without maintaining a career if you're not afraid of hard work (fishing boats in Alaska etc.) and also there are places which are dirt cheap with good climate, so that you can live in a shack and not freeze in winter or spend a fortune on cooking. If I were to try to do it in Poland, I see at least a couple obstacles: - the country is relatively densely populated. It's not easy to get a dirt-cheap place where you can settle (legally). Also, the construction code is strict so it's very hard to go low budget by doing unconventional things (like living in a yurt etc.) - the winters make a lot of those unconventional solutions less applicable anyway - you need a decent heat source and a house that has some level of insulation - Manual labor doesn't pay too well and you work with alcoholics and people with terrible personalities. Although arguably, after joining the EU, you can go for temp jobs in EU countries and make money that will last you for months of frugal living in a Polish village - the people in the countryside are often backwards, alcoholics and have a mentality of a serf (Poland had serfdom until mid XIX-century, and also the Communism treated people like serfs, so a lot of people exhibit traits of learned helplessness, have no initiative and expect to be taken care of by some institution - when it doesn't happen, they just get bitter and complain, but are unable to take any initiative). They're the opposite of the rugged, self-reliant American farmers, and would unfortunately make for a poor company or even neighbors - e.g. expect them to steal stuff from you.
- vagrantJin 6y ago
  > They're the opposite of the rugged, self-reliant American farmers To be a farmer you must have money, land, equipment, likely history of family farmers, technical agricultural know how, a government that protects and promotes your farm. Oh also old farming lobbies to twist the legislatures arm and a Government that uses their trade/military clout to push your products into developing countries - which the WTO seems not to care about. If Polish people dont have these things readily available, I guess yiur statement about them might be a tad harsh.

lioeters 6y ago

Thanks for posting this link - I resonated with the writing and his experiences. The story brought back memories of my own wandering days, struggles learning to love, the American land and people I met along the way. There were real feelings and insight in his words, like listening to a weather-worn man telling his life story by a camp fire. Here are some books by Mark Sundeen: - The Unsettlers: In Search of the Good Life in Today's America (2017) - The Man Who Quit Money (2012) - North by Northwestern: A Seafaring Family on Deadly Alaskan Waters (2011)

thorn 6y ago

Very engaging style of story telling here. I could try to explain this good writing, but I just recommend to read it. It is truly a good piece.