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> I don't think technological progress can be stopped but economist, politicians and sociologist need to really step up and provide a meaningful future vision.

> I don't think technological progress can be stopped but economist, politicians and sociologist need to really step up and provide a meaningful future vision. No thanks! Providing a meaningful future vision is a task for each and everyone.

faitswulff 6y ago
Right, but we live in a society.
aogaili 6y ago
Then what the point of government, economist, philosophers and entrepreneurs if everyone can do that? I don't think everyone is qualified to come up with a vision, the world is complex and you need certain background to do it.
- krona 6y ago
  Exactly, freedom is dangerous since it means we might have think for ourselves and take responsibility for our own lives. I'd rather have government deciding what to do.
  - aogaili 6y ago
    If you have been to university or got some educational somehow and can think for yourself, which you probably are given you are in this forum, by all means go, it is a free market, and share with us your vision and insights. But to assume everyone can do that for themselves is just fantasy and idealistic thinking.
- arketyp 6y ago
  Everyone should at least try. It's part of being a decent human being.
aogaili 6y ago
Most people can't articulate visions for themselves let alone human society. Could anyone point me to an author/thinker who can provide a meaningful vision for society in light of this rapid technological progress? I see Zuckerberg wants to embed us in virtual reality, Elon want us to go mars and evolve to cyborgs with neuralinks, Bezos want us to sit all day and one-click-buy from automated Stretch powered Amazon warehouses, governments want to bring coal factories back and print money, and the rest of us just busy speculating about NFTs, stocks, bitcoins, real-estate and posting on HN and social networks.. Where is the delighted vision for humanity in the next twenty years in the mix of all of that? I'd be happy if someone could share one with me.
- arketyp 6y ago
  Though I sympathize with your concerns, maybe that attitude is part of the problem? Why do you expect anyone else to have a vision for you/us?
  - aogaili 6y ago
    Well, it is conversation. I'm doing entrepreneurship and I run business so I'm capable of articulating some vision for some part of the world. But I'm NOT in a position to articulate a vision for humanity, and what I see/hear concerns me, and I'm really hoping someone has one. Also, even if I/You have a vision, I don't think I'm (I speak for myself) in a position to make some major social or economical changes, which seem to me, necessary to avoid the societal catastrophe that might happen when things like this robot gets widely adopted.
- MisterTea 6y ago
  > and the rest of us just busy speculating about NFTs, stocks, bitcoins, real-estate and posting on HN and social networks. It's sad when someone's idea of creative free time consists of gambling and addiction.
  - aogaili 6y ago
    Yeah, I'm personally not into any of that, but I don't hold myself any better than those who do, I just happen to have better support system and got lucky with some skill/goals that keeps me busy. But I can't help but notice that when faced with uncertainty and job instability many choose to throw money in whatever they happen to perceive the future would be, and unfortunately a lot of those so called "investment" are hyped by other capitalizing on their fears. Economical bubbles are everywhere (real estate, NFTs, stocks, bitcoins, etc.) I do think the underlying issue is the instability in the economical system. My concern is that this trend toward job elimination and capital centralization accelerated with Covid. And governments, economist, thinkers still unable to articulate a vision/strategy for the future, or even worse acknowledge the issue. The change is consumer behaviour last year was extremely rapid, those who never bought online in their live are now buying only online and many of those changes don't seem to be reversible. I really hope I'm wrong, but the way I see it, with the current market economics and centralization, and the rate of change, a lot of us and huge chunk of our society would find itself with no prospect of work or income because our government and economical systems are just lagging behind.
freeflight 6y ago
That ignores that we are social creatures living in an extremely interconnected global economy. Rugged individualism doesn't scale to that level and if we left everything only up to that then we might as well just abolish all institutions, including governments. Or to put it another way: There's a reason religion has been so successful for millennia, it provides a shared worldview and vision for people struggling to find their own.

faitswulff 6y ago

Right, but we live in a society.

aogaili 6y ago

Then what the point of government, economist, philosophers and entrepreneurs if everyone can do that? I don't think everyone is qualified to come up with a vision, the world is complex and you need certain background to do it.

krona 6y ago
Exactly, freedom is dangerous since it means we might have think for ourselves and take responsibility for our own lives. I'd rather have government deciding what to do.
- aogaili 6y ago
  If you have been to university or got some educational somehow and can think for yourself, which you probably are given you are in this forum, by all means go, it is a free market, and share with us your vision and insights. But to assume everyone can do that for themselves is just fantasy and idealistic thinking.
arketyp 6y ago
Everyone should at least try. It's part of being a decent human being.

aogaili 6y ago

Most people can't articulate visions for themselves let alone human society. Could anyone point me to an author/thinker who can provide a meaningful vision for society in light of this rapid technological progress? I see Zuckerberg wants to embed us in virtual reality, Elon want us to go mars and evolve to cyborgs with neuralinks, Bezos want us to sit all day and one-click-buy from automated Stretch powered Amazon warehouses, governments want to bring coal factories back and print money, and the rest of us just busy speculating about NFTs, stocks, bitcoins, real-estate and posting on HN and social networks.. Where is the delighted vision for humanity in the next twenty years in the mix of all of that? I'd be happy if someone could share one with me.

arketyp 6y ago
Though I sympathize with your concerns, maybe that attitude is part of the problem? Why do you expect anyone else to have a vision for you/us?
- aogaili 6y ago
  Well, it is conversation. I'm doing entrepreneurship and I run business so I'm capable of articulating some vision for some part of the world. But I'm NOT in a position to articulate a vision for humanity, and what I see/hear concerns me, and I'm really hoping someone has one. Also, even if I/You have a vision, I don't think I'm (I speak for myself) in a position to make some major social or economical changes, which seem to me, necessary to avoid the societal catastrophe that might happen when things like this robot gets widely adopted.
MisterTea 6y ago
> and the rest of us just busy speculating about NFTs, stocks, bitcoins, real-estate and posting on HN and social networks. It's sad when someone's idea of creative free time consists of gambling and addiction.
- aogaili 6y ago
  Yeah, I'm personally not into any of that, but I don't hold myself any better than those who do, I just happen to have better support system and got lucky with some skill/goals that keeps me busy. But I can't help but notice that when faced with uncertainty and job instability many choose to throw money in whatever they happen to perceive the future would be, and unfortunately a lot of those so called "investment" are hyped by other capitalizing on their fears. Economical bubbles are everywhere (real estate, NFTs, stocks, bitcoins, etc.) I do think the underlying issue is the instability in the economical system. My concern is that this trend toward job elimination and capital centralization accelerated with Covid. And governments, economist, thinkers still unable to articulate a vision/strategy for the future, or even worse acknowledge the issue. The change is consumer behaviour last year was extremely rapid, those who never bought online in their live are now buying only online and many of those changes don't seem to be reversible. I really hope I'm wrong, but the way I see it, with the current market economics and centralization, and the rate of change, a lot of us and huge chunk of our society would find itself with no prospect of work or income because our government and economical systems are just lagging behind.

freeflight 6y ago

That ignores that we are social creatures living in an extremely interconnected global economy. Rugged individualism doesn't scale to that level and if we left everything only up to that then we might as well just abolish all institutions, including governments. Or to put it another way: There's a reason religion has been so successful for millennia, it provides a shared worldview and vision for people struggling to find their own.